[OB] Kaladin's Heritage

[Mewmeister]

 

6 minutes ago, WhiteLeeopard said:

If the Heralds can have children they would probably have to jump through some hoops to achieve it, so I don't think it would be so common to be descended from them. Mainly because they are cognitive shadows, and we saw in Nalthis how CS can't easily have children.

Are the Returned cognitive shadows? I got the feeling that they weren't, but I could be mistaken.

[Vissy]

Yes, the Returned are cognitive shadows.

Quote

Argent

When you say that the Returned are cognitive shadows, are they shadows of the people they were pre-death? In other words, is Lightsong Llarimar's cognitive shadow stapled to his body with a Divine Breath?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, they are. (The evidence in the books is Lightsong obtaining some of the memories his pre-death soul had.)

Footnote: It’s likely that “Llarimar” is supposed to be “Stennimar”

- Stormlight Three Update #6

Edited March 9, 2018 by Vissy

[Subvisual Haze]

9 hours ago, Song said:

Crazy  idea, is there any chance that Hessina is a straight up light-eyes?

We know there are eye drops you can use to make your eyes dark. You can imagine Hessina coming from a low dahn family, meeting Lirin and deciding she was happy to live as a dark eyes for him. It would add impidious to her wish to marry Kaladin to a lighteye because their kids would be more likely to be light-eyes than dark.

Kind of tied into this: what if the lightening of iris color in Radiant descendants functions like the Royal Locks/Godly physical forms we saw in Warbreaker?  I think both are an indicator of ancestors being heavily tied to investiture.

It's kind of a cognitive self-image thing.  Vasher can look like a bitter scruffy hobo instead of a broad chested Greek God (which the investiture defaults to) because that's how he views himself.  Vivenna can control her magical hair and stop it from changing colors with her moods if she focuses enough.  Perhaps a lighteyes who strongly believed themselves to be a darkeyes (and saw themselves as such), would manifest in that way?

[Mewmeister]

Are there any WoBs that say whether the Kalad(as in Vasher/Zahel) in Kaladin is relevant? 

[WhiteLeeopard]

The meaning of Kaladin's name is known. Brandon has said before there are sometimes similar names between planets which are chance and have no particular link.

Quote

Questioner

Did Kaladin’s name come from anywhere in particular?

Brandon Sanderson

No. I'm sure the word paladin was in the back of my head, but it's not like he shares much with like an actual paladin. His name was Merin in the initial version and it was-- it didn't work, he wasn't a Merin and all the fans-- all the readers were like "this name just doesn't work" so I spent years hunting for the right name for him, and that's the one I ended up with. It's really based-- it's Kalak, which is the Storm-- not really the Stormfather but people y'know. Most of the names you'll find are based off one of the Heralds in some way. So he's KALA + DIN, Kalak and din is a suffix.

Isaac Stewart

We do have a meaning for it though. Can I tell them the meaning?

Brandon Sanderson

Ehhh, have we canonized it?

Isaac Stewart

We have canonized it, and we have told people before.

Brandon Sanderson

Then yeah.

Isaac Stewart

It means "Born unto Eternity".

Brandon Sanderson

...I mean, it means that in the same way that names mean something, like my name means-- But when they're naming him that they aren't thinking that. What they are doing is picking one of the Heralds and making a name out of it. But my name technically means "Dweller by the Beacon", but really what it means is "He was the son of Alexander".

source

[Mewmeister]

24 minutes ago, WhiteLeeopard said:

The meaning of Kaladin's name is known. Brandon has said before there are sometimes similar names between planets which are chance and have no particular link.

Just a coincidence then, I guess. Weird.

[stonedshaman]

Does this tie in with the fact that kaladin's hair is black and tien's was mixed black and Brown?

[YKDG22]

Part of me wonders if this deal ends up saving Kaladin at some point? We know Lirin trained in Kharbranth, but we don't know the exact time frame right? Seems like very specific wording:

The words started to fade all around them. Leaving him alone. Alone and stupid. He blinked tears from the corners of his eyes. “Kharbranth,” he said. “Preserve only Kharbranth. You may destroy all other nations. Just leave my city. It is what I beg of you.” The world was lost, humankind doomed. They had planned to protect so much more. But … he saw now how little they knew. One city before the storms. One land protected, even if the rest had to be sacrificed. “Kharbranth,” Odium said. “The city itself, and any humans who have been born into it, along with their spouses. This is whom I will spare. Do you agree to this?”

[Calderis]

@YKDG22 unfortunately Lirin didn't train in Kharbranth. He apprenticed under a man who did. He wanted to send Kaladin to receive real training that he himself couldn't give. 

[Subvisual Haze]

6 hours ago, Calderis said:

@YKDG22 unfortunately Lirin didn't train in Kharbranth. He apprenticed under a man who did. He wanted to send Kaladin to receive real training that he himself couldn't give. 

Or so he says. Lirin has shown a capability to lie to Kaladin's face if he thinks it is for the best (spheres incident) so he isn't by any stretch a perfectly trustworthy source.

It's also notable that Lirin as a hobby likes to predict the timing of Highstorms.  I think he received a much more classical (if incomplete) education than he has implied.

Even if Lirin isn't from Kharbranth I would place very good odds that Hesina was.

[WhiteLeeopard]

That deal may not save Kaladin, but it may save his parents, as Hesina may have been born in Kharbranth. Nevertheless, Kaladin's parents are known to be his parents, so I would be very surprised if by the beginning of book 4 they aren't either in Urihiru or captured by Odium's forces to use against Kaladin at a handy time.