[OB] Do you think Jasnah likes Kaladin?

[Razrback16]

On 7/1/2018 at 4:53 PM, SzethIsBadAsHell said:

Good viewpoint . Something happened to her. She casually uses assasins. Maybe she was raped and hired assassins to kill them all.

Thx - yep, I would bet we're going to get that backstory next book - I suspect just like how in OB we saw so much of Dalinar's past, we're going to see Jasnah's in the next one and find out what happened to her to make her the way she is when it comes to closeness with other people. Somebody took advantage of her when she was young and it's scarred her pretty bad, at least that's my interpretation of why she is the way she is.

 

[Bigmikey357 he/him]

I think Jasnah and her flashbacks get book 6 (although the order has changed before). Until we get her book all we'll get is some tantalizing hints.

[Calderis he/him]

3 minutes ago, Bigmikey357 said:

I think Jasnah and her flashbacks get book 6 (although the order has changed before). Until we get her book all we'll get is some tantalizing hints.

Most recent I've seen for book 6 is Lift. 

4&5 are confirmed Eshonai/Venli and Szeth. So if Brandon continues the alternating gender of the front five, currently that would mean we don't get Jasnah until either 8 or 10.

[Razrback16]

6 minutes ago, Bigmikey357 said:

I think Jasnah and her flashbacks get book 6 (although the order has changed before). Until we get her book all we'll get is some tantalizing hints.

Ugh hope it doesn't take that long. Since this book brought her back into the main story interacting with other main characters I've wanted to learn more about her past.  

[StrikerEZ he/him]

6 hours ago, Razrback16 said:

Ugh hope it doesn't take that long. Since this book brought her back into the main story interacting with other main characters I've wanted to learn more about her past.  

You're not alone, man. Jasnah's flashbacks aren't the ones I'm most excited for (that would be Eshonai's because I'm excited to see the contrast between past Eshonai and present Venli), but last I heard they were either scheduled for book 8 or 10. 

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/181/#e3757 (Sorry, I can't seem to copy it) This one is a couple years old, but I think it's still pretty accurate.

 

[Bigmikey357 he/him]

Well we know that Brandon can and has changed his mind on the order of books. Remember that originally Stones Unhallowed, Szeth's book, was supposed to come 3rd in the sequence and now it's Book 5. There's hope that we'll get Jasnah sooner.

[Angsos]

I'd guess not just because Jasnah is and will be such an interesting character. Her history will probably be filled out but nothing earthshattering until her book. Like we didn't find out how Evi, the root of Dalinar current life, died, we won't get the Jasnah incident until her book.

[Razrback16]

Hey quick question guys & gals - as far as the 10 book arc, I know it's been mentioned that it's going to be split into 2 sets of 5 books - has Sanderson mentioned how much time is going to pass between books 5 & 6? Was just curious. Thanks!

[Calderis he/him]

1 hour ago, Razrback16 said:

Hey quick question guys & gals - as far as the 10 book arc, I know it's been mentioned that it's going to be split into 2 sets of 5 books - has Sanderson mentioned how much time is going to pass between books 5 & 6? Was just curious. Thanks!

Between 10 and 15 years 

Quote

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

There's also going to be about a 15 year gap in-world between [The Stormlight Archive] arc 1 and [The Stormlight Archive] arc 2.

source

 

[Razrback16]

Thanks much Calderis!

That's a heckuva time gap.

[StrikerEZ he/him]

On July 3, 2018 at 7:15 PM, Razrback16 said:

Thanks much Calderis!

That's a heckuva time gap.

Brandon has always said he imagines SA as two 5-book arcs of one series, so makes sense to leave some time in between the arcs. To me, at least.

Edited July 5, 2018 by StrikerEZ

[animalia]

On 12/27/2017 at 1:48 PM, The Night Watcher said:

@Dreamstorm funny thing is that even though I don't believe Jasnah is interested in romance, I also sorta DO believe she is? But I can only imagine these two associations with romance:

1. It happened in the past, but she didn't like the restrictions on her freedom so she broke it off. 

2. It could happen in the future, during her time as Queen. 

I imagine Jasnah was more emotional when she was young. I think she's still emotional, but she's just learned to manage them now that she's experienced. Jasnah has always been a symbol of freedom in the books (IMO) -- I seem to remember Shallan is always placing Jasnah on a pedestal, admiring her unwillingness to conform to societal standards. 

Jasnah proclaimed herself a heretic years ago, I assume. That, the fact that she's one of the most brilliant women in the world, plus her refusal to play damsel, all set her into an isolated bubble. I imagine that gets lonely. Why wouldn't Jasnah want a similarly brilliant mind to share ideas and find comfort with? So maybe she fancied romance when she was young, she tried it. But something had to happen to make her so aversive to relationships in the future. Maybe she was traumatized (as so many people say), but I think more likely it was something simple. 

Just go over what you know about Jasnah. Scholar, icon of freedom, lonely. So she's lonely, finds a partner. But she's first and foremost a scholar, with great passion for finding answers and helping her people, and though she might long for romance, in the society she lives in she kind of can't do both.

I think she felt trapped in her relationships, between commitment to her partner and to her duty, so she broke it off. And after that, she decided that the world was more important than her own desires (which seems a very Jasnah-like thing to do), and she swore off marriage.

Now, her character during the time that the books take place, she seems a lot more...okay with not having romance, even going so far as to apologise to Shallan for arranging her marriage and showing genuine surprise at Shallan's openness to it. Maybe she became more confident in being alone? Or maybe she's convinced herself she's better off alone as the years passed (in the unhealthy way)? Whatever happened, Jasnah seems to be off the market, resigned to being alone. I think that's where a lot of her reserved nature comes from -- not having emotional connection to like-minded people (I mean, who the heck else in Roshar is a genius heretical defier of societal stereotype?). Not being able to trust people and really let go of her persona as a stone block. 

But maybe she'll find someone in the future, when she's Queen. I can see a good opportunity for character growth there. If she found a person who allowed her complete freedom and range of dictation, but supplied support and respect for her space as needed. Then again, I still think Jasnah's first allegiance would be to her kingdom, even if she loved a dude with everything she had. And at the first sign that her partner felt any opposition to that, she'd break off the relationship. 

Woah.

If I'd spoken this, I'd be out of breath. Kudos to anyone who actually read this entire thing.

I bolded that word because the idea of being resigned to being alone in a romantic sense, even though I very much don’t want to, is something I can very much identify with. First off I find the idea of dating, someone who wasn’t already a friend, creepy. “Hi, I don’t know anything about you other than the fact that I think you think you look attractive. Let’s hang out sometime.” So yeah the idea of starting a romantic relationship with someone who wasn’t a friend to begin with seems weird. Second I don’t make friends easily. I can get passionate and really open to someone when we have a common interest, but I am slow to feel we become friends. Or at least I feel like I feel that way compared to most people. Finally, I am on the Autism Spectrum (specifically where Asperger’s Syndrome was before it was removed from the DSM). I am bad at reading social ques, it often takes me multiple tries to get it right. Navigation of social rules and boundaries that comes easily to most people, is difficult to me. This is in part because said social boundaries seem so arbitrary to me, and it’s not helped by the fact that each person has their own boundaries that break their rules. My default response is to try and treat people how I want to be treated, and while that makes for a good default it still casues huge problems, as not everyone wants to be treated the same way I want to be treated. In fact many of the things that I have no problems with would not nessecarily be considered appropriate to all social situations.

What this boils down to is that all relationships with people I am in involve a lot of give of and take, as well as asking questions about what EXACTLY they are ok with and what they aren’t, as I try to figure out where everyone’s individual boundaries are. This works IN PART because they understand my issues, AND because I make it clear that if I cross a line with my questions all they need to do is tell me and I will stop. I try to stick to this hard because I don’t like hurting people’s feelings or causeing them pain. But I am so bad at understanding these things that often the only way for me to figure it out is to stumble through, figure out what mistakes I made so I won’t repeat them.

 

 If it isn’t clear why all this has made me resigned to giving up on a romantic relationship I will try to make it clear.

Say I have a friend of the opposite and after a while I fall in love. I confess my feelings, ask them out. They turn me down, because they either don’t feel the same way, or they don’t want to risk the friendship at this point, regardless. What do I do in this situation? My ONLY option is to tell them that if they change their mind to let me know. That may sound silly to you. But there’s a reason for why that is. Social rules today, as I understand them are to not ask the other person again until a significant time has passed so that you don’t make a nuisance of yourself or ignore their feelings. I can respect the logic behind that and I would NOT want to hurt them by ignoring their feelings. The problem is that a “significant amount of time” is a vague and arbitrary term and is most likely going to very from person to person. With most questions my solution would be to take my best guess on when it’s ok to try again. And if it’s not ok, I just leave again. But on something like this it’s obviously not going to fly. If I mess up and ask again to soon, (assuming I am still in love obviously) I risk making things worse, not to mention propogating every (well NOT EVERY) negative stereotype about men (Note I am not a COMPLETE idiot, I know this isn’t something you ask the next day or even in a week or two. But beyond that I have no idea) If I was “normal” I could probably read signs, or navigate the social boundaries effectivly to know if it was ok to ask again. But that’s not something that I see beeing in the cards for me. Which brings me back to why my only option would be to telling them that if they change their minds they can let me know. That has it’s own set of problems as it requires them to remember something I said ONCE. I often have conversations where I can swear I explain something early in the conversation only to have to explain it again because it never comes up. So yeah all this put to together and you can see why I can identify with both wanting a romantic relationship, and resigned to being without.

 

Oh and if this isn’t enough some people have speculated, not just me, that Jasnah herself maybe on the spectrum.

A Tumblr user has compiled a post of anecdotal evidence to support this and I can copy and paste the thing here if you want me to.

 But in case I have been meaning to reply to your post for awhile. I only just got around to it. Sorry I took so long.

 

[Kuroki]

I haven't read all of the posts on this topic, and I see it's kinda old.  But, I want to throw it out there and see if anyone responds... I love Kaladin and the Windrunner oaths--morally, I identify with at least the oaths we know about so far. 

But, as an asexual, I personally,  identify the most with Jasnah.  Knowing nothing more about her than is in the published books, I feel the kinship with her character and I can see her general worldview as being similar to my own.  Her commitment to her personal goals as a person are very clearly and explicitly exterior to her personal connection to others to the point that other characters see her as something of a machine.  Even Navani, her own mother, doesn't know how to deal with her indifference to the social expectations incumbent upon her as a woman.  That, I personally identify with very strongly.

I am /figuratively/ dying to find out what oaths (or other avenues?) the order of Elsecallers swear to.

[Winds Alight she/her]

I do not even think about the possibility of a romance between Jasnah and Kaladin at this point, but I think a lot about the "like" part.
Do they like each other? Probably not, at least as far as the (very few) onscreen interactions we've had.
Judging from that, you could say they dislike each other. There's at least a lot of potential for conflict as they have very different views on how to do things.
But in the way Kaladin resisted her, I think maybe Jasnah could like him? I mean, he is one of the few people (aside from family) that are not in the least hushed by her intimidating appearance and Kaladin certainly doesn't care much that she's an atheist.
Also, they both share some traits: They are intimidating at the outside (any maybe even on the inside), appear to be very hard people, but at the same time, both are very passionate about the things they believe in and fight for.

We haven't had any scene in which Kaladin actually thinks about her, so I'd say they don't really have any personal relationship so far, be it good or bad. But I see much mutual respect in the future.

That said, I think it is a huge shame that Kaladin wasn't present when Jasnah roasted Amaram. If he had been, he'd probably have become Jasnah's #1 fanboy.

Edit: Just for the fun of it, I'd like to see them fall for each other and Kaladin having to deal with the fact that this makes him basically kind of king of Alethkar.

Edited December 13, 2018 by Winds Alight

[Use the Falchion]

11 hours ago, Winds Alight said:

Edit: Just for the fun of it, I'd like to see them fall for each other and Kaladin having to deal with the fact that this makes him basically kind of king of Alethkar.

The Way of Kings indeed!

And going from being like "All Lighteyes are evil and I hate them!" to "Not only am I a lighteyes, I'm the KING of them." Moash would have a total conniption.