[OB] Renarin is not Evil, but...(Edgedancers spoilers)

[+eveorjoy]

Before I start this topic let me make a few things clear. I love Renarin. I have several people in my life with both Autism Spectrum Disorder and Epilepsy. So I will be rooting for any character with such traits. 

Also, I Brandon doesn't write purely evil characters. He writes selfish, misguided, cruel, foolish, rude, prideful, wrathful, greedy, and jealous characters, but can anyone say they are pure evil?

Ati who became Ruin was corrupted by his shard.

Sadeas followed Vorism as he understood it. Vorism considers soldiers to be this highest male calling. It is a violent religion when you think of it that way.

Hrathen started as an antagonist who realized he had followed the wrong people and, if you think about it, Dilaf was no more evil than Moash.

Even Roshone is now showing a more human side.

So suggesting that Renarin might be influenced by Odium is not saying he will turn evil or that he will be an antagonist. Shallan has a better chance of becoming an antagonist than Renarin at this point.

Something is going on with Renarin that is worrisome. We have been told repeatedly that to see the future is of the voidbringers. Maybe it is a power of Cultivations as well, but other than Honor suggesting that Cultivation is better at seeing the future than him, we have no suggestion this is one of her common powers. Just because she is better than him, does not mean she is as good as Odium. She might be but we simply do not know. So Odium seems to be the primary shard for seeing the future on Roshar.

Now we have only Renarin's word that a Truthwatcher sees. And to be honest, even Renarin has not explained what that means. We gather from his actions in WoR, such as scratching glyphs on walls predicting the Everstorm and his actions when the Everstorm comes, what seeing implies. That's also in WoR we read from Navani's memoir that the scratches on the wall suggest something bad and seeing the future is of the voidbringers. She knew when she wrote that memoir who had written those glyphs and why it was a bad thing. 

However, Renarin is not the only Truthwatcher we have read about. There is Ym, who doesn't seem to be getting visions before Nale kills him. But that was such a short interlude, so we can't be sure he wasn't scratching glyphs warning about Nale or the Everstorm. However, the is another Truthwatcher. The Stump from Edgedancer. Now we get a bit more time with her and with people who know her. I think someone would have said, not only is she mean to kids and laundering spheres, she has fits where she writes about the future. With all those kids there, one of them would have seen that and said something to Lift.

So why is Renarin the only Truthwatcher having visions?

Also, consider the surges of the Truthwatchers: Lightweaving and Progression. We have not seen Renarin use these surges, but we have seen these surges used. Lightweaving creates, for lack of a better word, holograms. Progression grows plants and heals people. Where in either of these surges is the ability to see the future? It's not Progression. Progression is a pretty straightforward surge. So maybe Lightweaving has the ability to see the future some how? Except, why can't Shallan do it? She did draw events that could have been in the past or present, but she has yet to draw the future. If Lightweaving has the ability to see the future, Brandon is going to have to do some great plotweaving to make it believable.

Nonetheless, we have no solid evidence currently that the Truthwatchers surges give the ability to see the future.

So why can Renarin see the future? And why is he so worried about Odium's champion? And why did Brandon hang this lamp on Renarin's abilities near the end of chapter 2 of Oathbringer?

Quote

“Son,” Dalinar said, stepping over. He took Renarin by the shoulder. “I trust you. The Almighty and the spren have granted you powers to defend and protect this people. Use them. Master them, then report back to me what you can do. I think we’re all curious to find out.”

When an author points out something but does not explain it, that means pay attention this is important. He did this in Mistborn with Kelsier's real plan. He did this in Shadows of Self when hinting what Bleeder's real problem was. He did it with Kaladin's reason for becoming a slave for over half of TWoKs. This passage, especially the last sentence is a huge red flag that something is up with Renarin's powers.

I don't think he has killed anyone at this point, nor do I think he will be Odium's champion and go evil. However, something is going on and we need to pay attention.

I do hope Renarin gets past whatever it is in this book and is stronger for it. I'm rooting for him and he has his own book in the back half of the SA. I will be very disappointed if he goes evil-ish. Of course, he can't go truly evil, because Brandon doesn't write truly evil characters. 

[WhiteLeeopard]

11 minutes ago, eveorjoy said:

That's also in WoR we read from Navani's memoir that the scratches on the wall suggest something bad and seeing the future is of the voidbringers. She knew when she wrote that memoir who had written those glyphs and why it was a bad thing

What was the timeline of the excerpts from her journal in WoR? I always wondered that, as dates is something I get lost on. 

On Renarin...all I'll say is there is something unusual about him, and I'm nearly sure he knows what Adolin did. Other than that I will wait and see.

[+eveorjoy]

9 minutes ago, WhiteLeeopard said:

What was the timeline of the excerpts from her journal in WoR? I always wondered that, as dates is something I get lost on. 

1

You see her writing it in chapter 4 of Oathbringer, but the dates in WoR suggests she wrote it during the first of the Rosharan year 1174. WoR takes place at the end of the year 1173.

[WhiteLeeopard]

Just now, eveorjoy said:

You see her writing it in chapter 4 of Oathbringer, but the dates in WoR suggests she wrote it during the first of the Rosharan year 1174. WoR takes place at the end of the year 1173.

Thank you. I'd upvote as I usually upvote helpful people, but I haven't been able to give a single one since I woke up ^^. So, she may write it during OB or afterwards, depends how fast OB progresses.

[redbishop]

5 hours ago, eveorjoy said:

Something is going on with Renarin that is worrisome. We have been told repeatedly that to see the future is of the voidbringers. Maybe it is a power of Cultivations as well, but other than Honor suggesting that Cultivation is better at seeing the future than him, we have no suggestion this is one of her common powers. Just because she is better than him, does not mean she is as good as Odium. She might be but we simply do not know. So Odium seems to be the primary shard for seeing the future on Roshar.

I like this, and I'd like to further the speculation/offer an alternative.  We know from WoR excerpts that Truthwatchers never spoke or wrote of what they did, and from other sources that Vorinism considers foretelling the future to be of the Void/Odium.  We also heard Honor's recording say that Cultivation was better at seeing the future than he.

Tying threads of speculation together, where we have surmised that surgebinding involves spren and surges associated with both Honor and Cultivation.  Based on placement on the Surgebinding chart and the fact that Progression is shared between Truthwatchers and Edgedancers (who are bonded to cultivationspren), it seems reasonable that the Truthwatchers may be influenced by Cultivation, and thus may have some access to foretelling/seeing beyond.  Since that is pretty heavily scorned by Vorinism, that would explain why Truthwatchers don't speak much of their activities - fear of being branded heretics, or worse.

[+eveorjoy]

1 hour ago, redbishop said:

I like this, and I'd like to further the speculation/offer an alternative.  We know from WoR excerpts that Truthwatchers never spoke or wrote of what they did, and from other sources that Vorinism considers foretelling the future to be of the Void/Odium.  We also heard Honor's recording say that Cultivation was better at seeing the future than he.

Tying threads of speculation together, where we have surmised that surgebinding involves spren and surges associated with both Honor and Cultivation.  Based on placement on the Surgebinding chart and the fact that Progression is shared between Truthwatchers and Edgedancers (who are bonded to cultivationspren), it seems reasonable that the Truthwatchers may be influenced by Cultivation, and thus may have some access to foretelling/seeing beyond.  Since that is pretty heavily scorned by Vorinism, that would explain why Truthwatchers don't speak much of their activities - fear of being branded heretics, or worse.

Okay, but then why can't Edgedancers have visions of the future then? If bonding with a cultivation spren is all that is needed for seeing the future, Lift should have had a few visions herself by now. I just don't see how Progression and Lightweaving lead to clairvoyance.

[Crucible of Shards]

I was under the impression that seeing the future was the Truthwatchers' resonance, like Shallan's Memories ability and Kaladin's Strength of Squires ability. In the past people have debated the meaning of the Truthwatcher epigraph and its relation to this. From the Coppermind--

 

Now, as the Truthwatchers were esoteric in nature, their order being formed entirely of those who never spoke or wrote of what they did, in this lies frustration for those who would see their exceeding secrecy from the outside; they were not naturally inclined to explanation; and in the case of Corberon's disagreements, their silence was not a sign of exceeding abundance of disdain, but rather an exceeding abundance of tact.

Edited September 13, 2017 by Crucible of Shards
Formatting

[redbishop]

Here there be theorizing.

I suspect it is a resonance effect.  Brandon chose "Progression" as the name of the surge, rather than Growth or Healing.  Progression means to continue forward.  Illumination means to cast light on.  If you combine those, you are casting light forward - seeing the future (or glimpses of it, or glimpses of possible futures) makes sense.

Rampant speculation:

Contrasting, Lightweavers have Illumination and Transformation.  From WoR:

Quote

"These Lightweavers, by no coincidence, included many who pursued the arts; namely: writers, artists, musicians, painters, sculptors. Considering the order's general temperament, the tales of their strange and varied mnemonic abilities may have been embellished. "

Transforming and Illumination combined, resulting in incredible artistic abilities?  Sounds right, especially since the Words of Radiance implies more-than-normal artistic ability.

Similarly, Adhesion (Sticking together) and Gravitation (Pulling in) sounds a lot like assembling a cohort...  of Squires?  Tension (Drawing taught) and Adhesion (Sticking together) in building a surgebinding link between people?

I may be wrong, but I feel like we are deep enough into SA that once we get the reveal, it will be really obvious in hindsight.

[Toaster Retribution]

7 hours ago, eveorjoy said:

Also, I Brandon doesn't write purely evil characters.

Straff Venture says hello.

As for the discussion on Truthwatchers and seeing the future. It is possible that seeing the future is the Truthwatchers Resonance. The Resonance is pretty much an extra power that comes when you already have two powers. Kaladin has stronger squires, and it is speculated that Shallans Memory is her Resonance. Each Order has one. 

I don't think Renarin will be voluntarily evil. I think that he could be morally grey, but I don't think he will be evil, at least not of his own will. Renarin being controlled by Odium is a possibility though. I think that he is (not voluntarily) creating a connection to Odium, and this will allow Rayse to control him to some extent. I am also suspicious of Glys. Is he really a Truthwatcherspren? 

I suspect that there is a reason for why Renarin hasn't had a POV yet, despite being a flashback character in the back five. There would probably be far too many clues about him if we saw stuff from his POV.

[+eveorjoy]

2 minutes ago, Toaster Retribution said:

Straff Venture says hello.

 

Straff Venture is not pure evil. Straff is a prideful, greedy, power hungry man, who feels after the death of the Lord Ruler is would simply be the best choice for King. He is no worse than Sadeas or Amaram. He is not a good person, but he is a human one and not pure evil.

Quote

As for the discussion on Truthwatchers and seeing the future. It is possible that seeing the future is the Truthwatchers Resonance. The Resonance is pretty much an extra power that comes when you already have two powers. Kaladin has stronger squires, and it is speculated that Shallans Memory is her Resonance. Each Order has one. 

Fair enough. If Brandon explains it that way I would accept it. However, why didn't the other two Truthwatchers we have seen show hints of this Resonance? Maybe we didn't see enough of Ym, but we heard plenty of rumors about the Stump. Someone would have seen her have a fit like Renarin.

Quote

 I am also suspicious of Glys. Is he really a Truthwatcherspren? 

 

Yeah, we haven't seen Glys, so we simply do not know what he looks like. I will feel better once we get a description of him. I hope he looks like Ym's and The Stump's spren.

[Pammie]

45 minutes ago, Crucible of Shards said:

I was under the impression that seeing the future was the Truthwatchers' resonance, like Shallan's Memories ability and Kaladin's Strength of Squires ability. In the past people have debated the meaning of the Truthwatcher epigraph and its relation to this.

 

39 minutes ago, Toaster Retribution said:

As for the discussion on Truthwatchers and seeing the future. It is possible that seeing the future is the Truthwatchers Resonance. The Resonance is pretty much an extra power that comes when you already have two powers. Kaladin has stronger squires, and it is speculated that Shallans Memory is her Resonance. Each Order has one. 

Doesn't this seem like an over-powered resonance, especially compared to Windrunner's squires or Lightweaver's memory tricks? If they can see the future as their resonance, then it has to be a very basic kind, like getting glimpses or feelings, but that doesn't seem to be on track with the little information that we have on Renarin's visions. 

Personally, I think that it'd make more sense for Truthwatcher's resonance to be much more literal: like, if they have the ability to tell truth from lies. This seems more on par with the other resonances we've seen. We know that Renarin's visions are overpowering and show the destruction of the everstorm, but the way it was portrayed didn't make it seem like a resonance. Kaladin and Shallan's resonances were subtle and make sense with their attributes. Having powerful, omniscient visions of the future sounds like it would be way too overpowered to be a resonance. 

So, if the visions aren't coming from him, where are they coming from? The idea that Odium is controlling Renarin always seemed strange to me, because why Renarin? He's weak, not in a position of much power, and the little that we know about him is that he's earnest, easily obeys, and Dalinar is even impressed how he doesn't resent his older brother. Wouldn't Odium try to influence someone a little more... hateful? But, what if the visions are coming from Cultivation, in the same way that Dalinar was receiving visions from Honor. We know that Cultivation was better at foretelling than Honor and that Truthwatchers are influenced by Cultivation (possibly the closest order to Cultivation? In the same way that Bondsmiths might be closest to Honor?) I doubt that she's just sitting in the west, twiddling her thumbs and we know that Dalinar had a run in with the Nightwatcher, who is theorized to be close to Cultivation. Could this maybe have given her access to Renarin? 

So in summary, I think that Renarin is a Truthwatcher, that Truthwatchers have a much more mundane resonance that foretelling, and that these visions he's receiving are coming from something else, possibly Cultivation. 

 

Edited September 13, 2017 by Pammie

[Toaster Retribution]

2 minutes ago, eveorjoy said:

Straff Venture is not pure evil. Straff is a prideful, greedy, power hungry man, who feels after the death of the Lord Ruler is would simply be the best choice for King. He is no worse than Sadeas or Amaram. He is not a good person, but he is a human one and not pure evil.

Fair enough. I heavily disagree on comparing him to Amaram though, but I won't derail the topic with that :-)

2 minutes ago, eveorjoy said:

Yeah, we haven't seen Glys, so we simply do not know what he looks like. I will feel better once we get a description of him. I hope he looks like Ym's and The Stump's spren.

The longer Brandon keeps him hidden, the more sure we can be about something being off about him. Since we have seen Yms spren, we can directly tell if Glys is different. My bet would be that Glys is an original Truthwatcherspren, somehow corrupted by Odium. It is also suspicious that we have three Truthwatchers in such a short time. The other orders are either much slower than the Truthwatchers, or Glys wasn't sent out like Pattern or Wyndle.

1 minute ago, Pammie said:

So, if the visions aren't coming from him, where are they coming from? The idea that Odium is controlling Renarin always seemed strange to me, because why Renarin? He's weak, not in a position of much power, and the little that we know about him is that he's earnest, easily obeys, and Dalinar is even impressed how he doesn't resent his older brother. Wouldn't Odium try to influence someone a little more... hateful? But, what if the visions are coming from Cultivation, in the same way that Dalinar was receiving visions from Honor. We know that Cultivation was better at foretelling than Honor and that Truthwatchers are influenced by Cultivation (possibly the closest order to Honor? In the same way that Bondsmiths might be closest to Honor?) I doubt that she's just sitting in the west, twiddling her thumbs and we know that Dalinar had a run in with the Nightwatcher, who is theorized to be close to Cultivation. Could this maybe have given her access to Renarin? 

So in summary, I think that Renarin is a Truthwatcher, that Truthwatchers have a much more mundane resonance that foretelling, and that these visions he's receiving are coming from something else, possibly Cultivation. 

 

This makes a whole ton of sense. I am not hundred percent onboard yet, but it is great. If Glys appears normal when we see him, this will immediately be my go-to theory. Upvote!

[Catladyman]

5 minutes ago, eveorjoy said:

Fair enough. If Brandon explains it that way I would accept it. However, why didn't the other two Truthwatchers we have seen show hints of this Resonance? Maybe we didn't see enough of Ym, but we heard plenty of rumors about the Stump. Someone would have seen her have a fit like Renarin.

I think Renarin's fit are the result of a couple of different factors. First, he is clearly very uncomfortable with his visions and is reluctant to assume the role of Radiant, which can be seen in the way he finally admits to bonding Glys at the end of WoR. Second, he knows the knowledge in his visions is important to his family and kingdom, so he wants to tell people about it. However, a Truthwatcher inclination to contain the knowledge (similar to Kaladin's near-inability to lie) is pushing against that desire. He has fits as he struggles against his Truthwatcher-ness to get the information out there.

The Stump could very well have been receiving visions of the Everstorm. However, why would an old lady running an orphanage feel some duty or responsibility to tell people what she sees? There may be no conflict within Stump because she is too stubborn to even believe her visions let alone tell people about them. 

[+robardin]

I don't think Renarin's fits have to do with his foretelling; he's had the seizures since childhood, which means Stormlight may not heal him of it, if his self-image now extends to include it.

Interestingly, his near-sightedness was apparently healed by Stormlight, so I guess he only recently started needing glasses (I don't remember when that was brought up, except that Dalinar comments on his having stopped wearing them at the end of Words of Radiance as evidence of Stormlight use).

AFAIK Ym is the only "confirmed" Truthwatcher we've seen, via WoB, and Ym didn't "see" Darkness coming to get him, which you'd think would be something a foretelling talent might have done. Which along with Syl's comment about the countdown glyphs is why I continue to be a little suspicious about Renarin's foretelling, but am willing to allow that it could be derived from Cultivation rather than Odium, and certainly don't mean to imply that Renarin has "gone bad".

[+eveorjoy]

16 minutes ago, robardin said:

I don't think Renarin's fits have to do with his foretelling; he's had the seizures since childhood, which means Stormlight may not heal him of it, if his self-image now extends to include it.

When I said fit, I was not referring to his partial seizures. I am referring to his freak out at the end of Word of Radiance. But that might have been the only time he did that and it happened while being under such extreme pressure. 

I'm hoping Renarin's visions are a good thing, but there are so many red flags suggesting they are a bad thing. 

[FollowYourMuse]

I don't think either Ym or other truthwatcher we have seen had gotten to the resonance point. Also unlike Renarin, they both started with the progression surge. There could be differences too Renarins epilepsy might make him more open to the shadesmar, being broken both physically and emotionally.

[Calderis]

We know nothing about resonances beyond their existence. We don't know their requirements. We don't know their limits. We just don't know. 

Kaladin's is strength of squires which means he gets more, and they are stronger. Until we see another orders squires for comparison, we don't know how strong this is... But if he gets all of bridge four as little mini Windrunners, and everyone else gets a couple people who can draw in Stormlight, that would be a pretty freaking strong resonance. 

Shallan's is the mnemonic device. By itself it's a cool little trick. Combined with Lightweaving? Holy crap this could be amazing. 

These are literally the only two confirmed resonances we have. Not just for Stormlight, but for the Cosmere. We can't say that a resonance is too strong until we have some kind of baseline established. 

Additionally, Renarin's resonance strengthening his visions would be perfectly in line with his order as evidenced before. Dalinar has had the highstorm visions. Kaladin has had his storm dreams which were accurate to what was going on in the world. Shallan has her drawings if Yalb and Ash. 

Visions are not the soul properly of truthwatchers. The seem to be something that is part of being a Radiant.

[WhiteLeeopard]

4 hours ago, redbishop said:

Since that is pretty heavily scorned by Vorinism, that would explain why Truthwatchers don't speak much of their activities - fear of being branded heretics, or worse.

I'm pretty sure Truthwatchers wouldn't give a figs' worth on what the world thought of their visions, if they did have visions. KR of old were at the top of the food chain, they would be revered, and if seing the future was what they did seing the future would be revered. Vorinism was a mixture of children trying to wear their parents clothes (lets pretend to have some radiant abilities to rule all) and greedy men taking advantage of chaos to rule (lets impose a lot of restrictions that make ruling easier, like safehands which remove half of the population from getting some of the coveted Shards). Vorinism came later, KR were earlier, and they could probably set whichever rules they wanted to and people would accept them (when they were still honorable and their better selves).

I am not certain if Renarin is a normal Radiant or not, I'll probably be on the fence till I see him surgebind.

[Calderis]

The prohibition against foretelling is a product of the fall of the Vorin church. 

The Priesthood claimed prophecies because they were trying to emulate the Radiants of old. 

The whole reason the purging and alteration of books happened that Jasnah laments so heavily is that the Heralds and the Radiants are where the church came from, and they had to link themselves to the old Radiants, and not the fall. 

If there was no basis for prophecy, from the Heralds or the Radiants, it wouldn't have occurred the way it did during the Hierocracy, and the prohibition now wouldn't be an issue. 

Edited September 13, 2017 by Calderis

[redbishop]

9 minutes ago, WhiteLeeopard said:

I'm pretty sure Truthwatchers wouldn't give a figs' worth on what the world thought of their visions, if they did have visions. KR of old were at the top of the food chain, they would be revered, and if seing the future was what they did seing the future would be revered. Vorinism was a mixture of children trying to wear their parents clothes (lets pretend to have some radiant abilities to rule all) and greedy men taking advantage of chaos to rule (lets impose a lot of restrictions that make ruling easier, like safehands which remove half of the population from getting some of the coveted Shards). Vorinism came later, KR were earlier, and they could probably set whichever rules they wanted to and people would accept them (when they were still honorable and their better selves).

I am not certain if Renarin is a normal Radiant or not, I'll probably be on the fence till I see him surgebind.

Well...  yep.  I had not thought about the Vorinism-being-post-Recreance.

I will now drop back and punt, and theorize that it is less to do with Vorinism, and more to do with Voidbinding.  Prophecy and foretelling, per the Coppermind because I don't have access to WoK at the moment, is one of the most common forms of Voidbinding.  It is reasonable that an Order that has access to that power would try to keep it quiet, to avoid tiresome discussions about why it was ok here, but not there.

[BlackYeti]

10 hours ago, eveorjoy said:

if you think about it, Dilaf was no more evil than Moash.

Are you serious? I honestly don't see how anyone could think that.

Spoiler

Dilaf was a sadistic megalomaniac! He tortured countless initiates to the Dakhor monastery, he killed his own monks for trivial uses of his power, he tried to exterminate the entire population of two countries, and who knows what else!

Moash, by comparison, tried to kill two men.

That somehow makes him just as bad, or worse, than Dilaf?

[+eveorjoy]

13 minutes ago, BlackYeti said:

Are you serious? I honestly don't see how anyone could think that.

  Hide contents

Dilaf was a sadistic megalomaniac! He tortured countless initiates to the Dakhor monastery, he killed his own monks for trivial uses of his power, he tried to exterminate the entire population of two countries, and who knows what else!

Moash, by comparison, tried to kill two men.

That somehow makes him just as bad, or worse, than Dilaf?

Moash could go down the same path very easily. My point was Dilaf started the same way. But I agree I may have overstated that Dilaf wasn't worse. Hopefully, Moash won't get that bad. I take back this statement. Sorry, Moash. 

[Kairos]

4 hours ago, Crucible of Shards said:

I was under the impression that seeing the future was the Truthwatchers' resonance, like Shallan's Memories ability and Kaladin's Strength of Squires ability. In the past people have debated the meaning of the Truthwatcher epigraph and its relation to this. From the Coppermind--

 

Now, as the Truthwatchers were esoteric in nature, their order being formed entirely of those who never spoke or wrote of what they did, in this lies frustration for those who would see their exceeding secrecy from the outside; they were not naturally inclined to explanation; and in the case of Corberon's disagreements, their silence was not a sign of exceeding abundance of disdain, but rather an exceeding abundance of tact.

I was under that impression too. Having it be the resonance makes sense with those two surges. And they could be so quiet about it because telling the future could change it. I wonder if it has any parallels with atium usage, although it appears to be more farsighted and less useful overall.

Although, this description of Truthwatchers gives me really bad flashbacks to Aes Sedai. I knew I didn't like Renarin much, but... I really hope he opens up more. Or turns evil. Or does something to become more clear.

[ChazBolt]

So I'm not sure why we are assuming that he has future sight. We know he got some visions of the everstorm, but we don't know the detail of his vision. It may not have been a vision of the everstorm from the future but instead a grander understanding of multiple perspectives about the Everstorm. 

My theory is he doesn't have future sight, he gets Truths about situations. Be that meaning innately understanding multiple ppls perspectives on the situation, or knowing the history of the situation. 

I would venture a guess that this would be more from.Cultivation but that's so far into sepculation theory that I don't want to bother arguing that point.

I just think we are jumping to conclusions about him seeing the future and maybe it's something a bit more subtle than that. 

[+eveorjoy]

26 minutes ago, ChazBolt said:

I just think we are jumping to conclusions about him seeing the future and maybe it's something a bit more subtle than that. 

 

My biggest concern with whatever Renarin's ability is it caused him to write those glyphs on the walls and Navani said in her journal just a few months later that the countdown was not the worst thing about those glyphs. The ability that allowed the prediction brought about something worse. Here is the exact quote from the epigraph of Chapter 5 "Ideals" bold added by me.

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The sign on the wall proposed a greater danger, even, than its deadline. To foresee the future is of the Voidbringers is of the Voidbringers.

                                                                                                                                                      --From the journal of Navani Kholin, Jeseses 1174

1

This was written after the events that we are reading about now in Oathbringer. Navani was just starting to write these entries in chapter 4. Now, the counter argument is that Navani is just worried about the Vorin teaching on seeing the future. I can see why people would take that point of view, but I disagree. Navani never said anything like this during the time Dalinar was suspected of writing those glyphs. Why was she all of a sudden worried about them after the fact and because they were written by Renarin?

Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but we shall see.