Aleksiel Posted February 17, 2014 Posted February 17, 2014 Sorry, but I assumed you would know I was speaking of two different Epigraphs. The fault is mine. I realize I wasn't clear. Let me explain. ( Long post coming) Oh, I see now. This is really interesting considering how 'To foresee the future is of the Voidbringers.' 1
+Aletus he/him Posted February 17, 2014 Posted February 17, 2014 I am not sure I can get onboard with kaladin betraying Dalinar. The pair are our honor figureheads. Having said that - this series is said to be massive, and who is to say that one or both of them don't lose their way. I just have a feeling that it won't play out that way. Then again, I couldn't have imagined darkrand following Eye of the World and going into the Great Hunt.
Moogle Posted February 17, 2014 Posted February 17, 2014 (edited) Oh, I see now. This is really interesting considering how 'To foresee the future is of the Voidbringers.' It's odd that seeing the future is so heavily stigmatized like this. Cultivation was romantically linked with Honor, and Voidbinding seems to be her shtick, so what the heck? Maybe seeing the future is a good thing. It certainly was in Mistborn, and I'd argue it's just plain useful in general. This journey before destination silliness the Radiants have going on stupidly rules out future sight. Perhaps Odium has corrupted cultures worldwide to distrust seeing the future so no one will see be able to counter anything he does? Or perhaps it's just that seeing the future on Roshar is intrinsically linked with doing terrible rituals or something? Edited February 17, 2014 by Moogle
Aleksiel Posted February 17, 2014 Posted February 17, 2014 It's odd that seeing the future is so heavily stigmatized like this. Cultivation was romantically linked with Honor, and Voidbinding seems to be her shtick, so what the heck? Maybe seeing the future is a good thing. It certainly was in Mistborn, and I'd argue it's just plain useful in general. This journey before destination silliness the Radiants have going on stupidly rules out future sight. Perhaps Odium has corrupted cultures worldwide to distrust seeing the future so no one will see be able to counter anything he does? Or perhaps it's just that seeing the future on Roshar is intrinsically linked with doing terrible rituals or something? Romantically linked? I've missed something again, apparently Honor is terrible at seeing the future, perhaps that's why generally it's not considered a good thing - because the Almighty couldn't do it and everything the Almighty did was only good, so what he couldn't do is considered evil. We know Cultivation is better at seeing the future, but I'm not convinced on Voidbringing being of her, I guess will wait and see. Kaladin says something on Voidbringers being able to raise the dead and this along with the death rattles being predictions combined with foreseeing the future being of Voidbringers, takes an interesting turn. Could they enter Roshar through the bodies of the dead? But why would Voidbringers reveal the future for those they wish to destroy? I haven't formed a good theory on this yet.
Swimmingly he/him Posted February 17, 2014 Posted February 17, 2014 It might just be that Voidbringing focuses on temporal aspects of the Surges, so, quite literally, "seeing the future is of the Voidbringers.'
Moogle Posted February 17, 2014 Posted February 17, 2014 (edited) Romantically linked? I've missed something again, apparently Keeping up with all the WoBs floating around is an impossible task in of itself. It took me a few months of research to get up to date on all the big ones. We need a liveblog of everything Cosmere related so people can just start at the beginning and read through. Theoryland doesn't lend itself well to this, unfortunately, and some WoBs are hidden on page 10 of 20 page threads here and never make it to Theoryland. Here you go: StormAtlas Were Cultivation and Honor romantically involved? Brandon Sanderson Yes. (source) There's also this bit from the WoR released chapters: “But why?” Wyndle said. “Why did She give you this incredible talent? Why a child? There are soldiers, grand kings, incredible scholars among humankind. Instead she chose you.” Food, food, food. Smelled great. Lift crawled along under the long table. The men and women up above were talking in very concerned voices. ... Wyndle moved along beside Lift. “Mother has given up on your kind. I can feel it. She doesn’t care any longer. Now that He’s gone...” Edited February 17, 2014 by Moogle 2
Aleksiel Posted February 17, 2014 Posted February 17, 2014 Keeping up with all the WoBs floating around is an impossible task in of itself. It took me a few months of research to get up to date on all the big ones. We need a liveblog of everything Cosmere related so people can just start at the beginning and read through. Theoryland doesn't lend itself well to this, unfortunately, and some WoBs are hidden on page 10 of 20 page threads here and never make it to Theoryland. Here you go: There's also this bit from the WoR released chapters: So Odium could be Cultivation's abusive ex, who killed Honor out of jealousy - the Cosmere soap opera 2
+eveorjoy she/her Posted February 17, 2014 Posted February 17, 2014 I read this very differently when I saw this topic. When I saw I raise my hand and the storm responds I immediately thought of Eshonai with stormform. Now I don't think we know enough about Eshonai's backstory to say if she stands against someone who saved her life or if she protects one who killed her promises but stormform is literally about controlling high storms so it may be a possibility. Oh it could be Eshonai, no doubt. The point of reviving the topic was to consider a possibility, nothing more. I also don't think Kaladin would completely betray.Dalinar. I think he would only do a minor betrayal. Help Sadeas win a political conflict or protect him from being caught in an action against the Kholins. Afterward Kaladin would realize his anger at Amaram is turning him away from his promise to Syl to become a KR. So he would let go of his anger apologize to Dalinar and the two become closer friends because the experience. And Kaladin starts wearing Dalinar's cloak. Or something completely different will happen.
AerionBFII he/him Posted February 20, 2014 Posted February 20, 2014 I can't remember but in the book isn't Amaram sworn to Sadeas? So by default would he have been friends with Sadeas Dalinar and Gavilar? Interesting I wonder who he will be loyal too between Sadeas and Dalinar....I hope it's Sadeas so Kaladin can kill him!! I hope Brandon doesn't wait too long before Kaladin exacts his revenge :@
CodeMnke she/her Posted February 20, 2014 Posted February 20, 2014 Actually has anyone considered Moash as the one who saved Kaladin? We don't know who Moash wanted to kill... it could be Amaram.
Speaker4thDead he/him Posted February 21, 2014 Posted February 21, 2014 By all accounts according so some givens our parhsendi General is our best reference 1. The Explorer, straddling the fates of two peoples, forced to choose between slow death and a terrible betrayal of all she believes. "Quote from cover" Betrayal of belief sounds like someone or god broke some promises they made to her 2. Storm form is literally the only magic that I've read so far that the literal storm would respond to. 3. We know she wants to coexist with humans but will be inevitably controlled by their dark gods like before. Probably their magic will be similarly controlled by Odium as Hemulergy was controlled by Ruin. And she wants to try and talk to dalinar. He probably makes piece with them as the high prince of war thus saving her and the parshendi's lives All of which could easily fulfill the parts of the death chant, and still be exactly apart of what we always new would happen.... Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar and more often then not Occam's razor leads us to the right conclusions. I know it's Sanderson but I think it's being read into far to much.
Aleksiel Posted March 15, 2014 Posted March 15, 2014 After reading WoR I was reminded of this topic. I think “All is withdrawn for me. I stand against the one who saved my life. I protect the one who killed my promises. I raise my hand. The storm responds.” refers to Syl when she was still trying to protect Kal from the highstorm in the chasms after Kal betrayed his oaths and most of her intelligence and memories were withdrawned from her: And a small figure, all white, standing before him with hands forward, as if to part the tempest for him. Tiny and frail, yet as strong as the winds themselves. So I guess death rattles are indeed predictions of future events.
tareth Posted March 15, 2014 Posted March 15, 2014 (edited) After reading WoR I was reminded of this topic. I think refers to Syl when she was still trying to protect Kal from the highstorm in the chasms after Kal betrayed his oaths and most of her intelligence and memories were withdrawned from her: So I guess death rattles are indeed predictions of future events. The death rattle almost certainly refers to Kaladin defending Elhokar against Moash. Moash saved Kaladin's life in WoK, and the chapter Kaladin learns that Elhokar was responsible (albeit somewhat indirectly) for Roshone showing up in his home town (and also deciding that Elhokar needs to die) is named The One Who Killed Promises (chapter 62, page 746 hardback). "All is withdrawn for me" -- Kaladin is pretty beaten up in the scene, and has lost his powers. "The storm responds" would be referring to what happens after Kaladin speaks the third oath. This is something a lot of people have discussed recently, and the evidence for it is pretty strong. EDIT: Here's one of those discussions. Edited March 15, 2014 by tareth
Recommended Posts