[Spoilers] Shadows of Self Full Book Reactions

[Theo Wilson]

I recently made an account here after reading Shadows of Self and noticing something interesting.

 

"Gentleman Jak in the City of Fountains" Part Six "The Sinister Soiree!" (Page 177)

 

"...Had I not best the tribes at the Pits of Eltania? Was I not the first to bring back tales of the slopes of the Ashmounts, now gone green with vegetation? And wasn't it I that had domesticated the fabled long-necked horses of the Plains of Kaermeron?"

 

 

This is probably Jak making things up, but I really want to see Metallurgist cowboys riding giraffes. With guns.

[Argent he/him]

I don't know if those were actually giraffes - I believe Wax uses the word "giraffe" (maybe), so calling them "long-necked horses" when they have an actual name is kind of weird. Maybe they do have horses with long necks in Kaermeron.

[ccstat he/him]

I really love all of these characters--so glad that Bands is coming soon. And I don't just mean the leads. Steris? Impressive. MeLaan? So much fun. 

 

My favorite scene has to be Wayne in the "church of the common man." 

 

I was not planning to buy this for another week, since I have a lot of deadlines and can't spare the time, but it looks like my self control wasn't up to the task. And I thoroughly enjoyed the book, so hopefully the stress and no-sleep of the next 8 or 9 days won't make me regret getting it already.

[Emerald101 he/him]

And we thought we knew how Hemalurgy worked! Hah!

[natc]

We know about as much about hemalurgy as we do genetic engineering.

Not anywhere near enough to be comparable to what a literal god can accomplish.

[the winter system]

Harmony is an absolute slontze. 

I was rereading Mistborn and just cracked up when I saw Sazed for the first time again. 

[StormingTexan he/him]

I had a crazy busy week so even though I got the book on release day I just now finished it. I have to say this was not really what I was expecting at all. AoL was pretty lighthearted and felt like a "bonus" after the original trilogy. Something to tide us over until the 80s era. Maybe this was Brandon's original plan. I loved it but never got the deep emotional roller coaster like the rest of his books. Then came SoS and BAM! Man so much packed into such a small book. I feel like this is now more than a bonus as we are getting a setup for the events to come in the next era. In other words this isn't just "filler" now.

I'm kind of perplexed though. I guess because I was prepared for another Wax and Wayne lighthearted Wild West adventure. It started out very similar then took a very dark turn. I still liked the book a lot just trying process it all I think.

New metal? New God? New shard pool? Additional powers of twinborns? Visitors from another planet?!! As usual Brandon left us with so much to discuss and ponder. I am so excited we do not have to wait but until January to get another fix.

Wayne is probably my favorite character Brandon has written. Then he went and brought back TenSoon and I suddenly remember no he's my favorite. No wait it's Sazed. No wait what about Breeze.. Ok so I have a lot of favorites but man it was good to see Kandra again one of my favorite things about Mistborn.

One thing that keeps me scratching my head is there were only around 500 Kandra and yet Harmony sent one to Wax when he's basically a newbie lawman in the rough. Obviously Wax is a descendent of Breeze and the main protagonist for this era but is he possible going to be planet saving important like Vin and Elend down the road?

So yes this was a lot deeper and darker than I was expecting. Regardless I can't wait to see what comes next (hopefully we will get back to the Set in BoM).

Edited October 11, 2015 by StormingTexan

[Angsos]

I'm guessing the Main era 2 will either be an older Wax or Wax and Steris's kids and the conflict will probably be a chess game between Harmony and the new shard, only these chess pieces bleed and die

[Cheese Ninja he/him]

I didn't see the Lessie thing coming, and it bothered me because Wax can faintly detect hemalurgic spikes, as he did with TenSoon.  So he spend years around Lessie and never noticed that she had two sources of metal inside her body?

 

I did expect them to stop Bleeder by adding a second spike from the beginning, and found it odd that no one actually mentioned the option until after the fact.

 

I agree with Arkennys, Steris contined to be best girl, and got even better.  Wax should appreciate and treat her a bit better, and I don't understand Wayne's assholish attitude to her either.  Maybe Wayne was just feeling snappish since Tesla (Tarcsel, halfway between an anagram and portmandeau with "arc") girl reminded him of the girl whose father he killed, but acting that way towards best girl Steris annoyed me.  I imagine most of Wax's emotional distance is Lessie-related, both before and after the reveal, but how can you not love Steris?

 

Hoid is Wax's carriage driver... I kept expecting either him or Sazed to say something about it, but we never even saw Hoid.

 

Shardpool in the broadsheet, Trell is another Shard and the main antagonist in this trilogy?  Things got a lot more Cosmerey.

[Argent he/him]

I didn't see the Lessie thing coming, and it bothered me because Wax can faintly detect hemalurgic spikes, as he did with TenSoon.  So he spend years around Lessie and never noticed that she had two sources of metal inside her body?

 

Except Wax lost vision of TenSoon's spikes quickly. There must be something the kandra can do to hide their spikes, bury them deeper in their bodies perhaps. Plus, if they couldn't do that, they would be pretty easy to detect even in the Final Empire, making them pretty bad at being the fabled spies and impersonators they were known to be.

[Orlion Blight he/him]

Except Wax lost vision of TenSoon's spikes quickly. There must be something the kandra can do to hide their spikes, bury them deeper in their bodies perhaps. Plus, if they couldn't do that, they would be pretty easy to detect even in the Final Empire, making them pretty bad at being the fabled spies and impersonators they were known to be.

That, and he was looking for TenSoon's spikes. I imagine if you aren't concentrating, the kandra's spikes would be unobserved.

[natc]

You'd probably need to approach Inquisitor levels of steelsight to get a clear lock on metal so deeply burried, honestly. Vin didn't even notice Zane had coins in his mouth, imagine a pair of metal spikes impaled through living flesh, and then probably coated in blood or other fluids for good measure. Probably not easy to find without being as strong as someone like Wax, and even then he could barely see them by concentrating on TenSoon.

[sanderfuss he/him]

I've enjoyed reading this thread almost as much SoS. It has enlightened me to the fact that I don't know enough about the Cosmere to have picked up on some of the finer points toward the end that would probably of made the story better for one who does. Obviously I've heard of shards and not just the shards of Roshar, and I'm guessing the well of Ascension is a shard pool. Someone was going on about a character called Lyatel. Who is this.

Would the general opinion be that it would of been worth while to have read all the Cosmere novels to be able to have picked up on certain things?

Cosmere novels I've yet to read:

Elantris

1/2 warbreaker

And the novellas

Apart from Hoid doing the odd bit of world hopping, this is the first time there has been a cross over that has left me confused and I can only think that maybe it's because I haven't read all of the above before hand.

[natc]

There's only one Warbreaker.

And if you've read WoR without reading Warbreaker you're missing something really interesting.

[sanderfuss he/him]

Ha, I meant I've read half of warbreaker. tWoK's was the first Sanderson book I read on recommendation, WoR inevitably followed. But I wasn't left thinking I was missing something, just an urge for the next instalment. Thanks for tip, no doubt I'll go back to warbreaker and find myself going "huh, cool". But SoS is different, it's almost as if I'm in the dark.

[Asperity he/him]

I liked that 'cosmere' was straight-up name-dropped. That still keeps the term being mentioned in any books <5, right? Or somewhere along those lines.

I enjoyed the banter between Wax and Wayne--real organic and spot on--and I like how Marasi slightly deviates from most of Brandon's main female characters although I hope he someday drops the recurring trend of blushing being an obscenely common trait. I noticed 'rust' and 'ruin', and variants, used several times as well but that's probably because they are Scadrian curse terms and would naturally crop up often.

Interested to see what other Shard is interfering--perhaps Autonomy?--and the why behind it. Hopefully we'll learn more in Bands of Mourning.

 

Also noticed that bit about Harmony possibly alluding to the Southern Scadrians when he was musing about the populace not being too technologically advanced "compared to people who were almost destroyed" (paraphrased). I really hope we learn ANYTHING about Southern Scadrial during this particular arc. Makes me believe that modern Mistborn will take place in South Scadrial which would be pretty neat.

[Argent he/him]

Would the general opinion be that it would of been worth while to have read all the Cosmere novels to be able to have picked up on certain things?

 

It always helps to have read more Cosmere books, there are small connections all over the place. But because they are small, it doesn't really matter. Either way, I would encourage you to do a reread of all of them once you've read all of them.

[Blaze1616 he/him]

I've enjoyed reading this thread almost as much SoS. It has enlightened me to the fact that I don't know enough about the Cosmere to have picked up on some of the finer points toward the end that would probably of made the story better for one who does. Obviously I've heard of shards and not just the shards of Roshar, and I'm guessing the well of Ascension is a shard pool. Someone was going on about a character called Lyatel. Who is this.

Would the general opinion be that it would of been worth while to have read all the Cosmere novels to be able to have picked up on certain things?

 

First and foremost, because this is an error I see all the time on this forum and it drives me crazy. It's "Iyatil" not "Lyatil." The first letter is a capital i, because it's a name. That's not a lowercase L. Iyatil is a character from the Stormlight Archive. Some detail in the spoilers:

 

Iyatil is a member of the Ghostbloods, or at least helps the Ghostbloods. She claims to be Mraize's master, indicating that she is likely very high up in the organization. WoB from earlier this year confirmed that she's a worldhopper, though where she comes from is currently unknown.

 

Something to keep in mind, this here is Sanderson's Official Fansite. As such, our discussions of the novels will delve deep. I do not think a lack of Cosmere knowledge should have hindered your enjoyment of the book. Had you not come here to see our discussions, I'd hope it would have never crossed your mind. Being knowledgeable about the Cosmere will enhance your understanding, and potentially your enjoyment, of any of the books though, not just SoS. WoR, for example, has three major scenes where being Cosmere aware tremendously benefits you. Warbreaker has a handful of very minor details where being Cosmere aware would a helpful. The level of extra depth gained by being Cosmere aware does change per book, but I'd say it's there for all of them.

[StormingTexan he/him]

 

Also noticed that bit about Harmony possibly alluding to the Southern Scadrians when he was musing about the populace not being too technologically advanced "compared to people who were almost destroyed" (paraphrased). I really hope we learn ANYTHING about Southern Scadrial during this particular arc. Makes me believe that modern Mistborn will take place in South Scadrial which would be pretty neat.

 

I am intrigued by this as well. I agree I think 1980's era will actually be from the POV of the Southern Scandrians and may not be that far ahead (possible 40 years or so) of WaW era as they appear to be a lot farther along than the North. What almost destroyed them may be WW1 or WW 2 like situation and they are in the process of rebuilding.  Perhaps we learn that Harmony built the North based on Preservation and the South on Ruin as separate experiments or to balance out the struggle from the opposing forces. Also if I recall correctly the 1980's era is about a team of Allomancers hunting down a full Mistborn. I feel like the Set's plans are to make a full Mistborn through hemalurgy from the captured women in AoL perhaps this is the tie in between the two eras. Of course this is all just crazy speculation. The thing that doesn't make sense is to me is why the Southern Scandians would not explore the North if they are that much more technologically advance. 

[voidspren]

I have been reeling since I finished SoS. This amount of upheaval and change, the way the lighthearted WaW world turned so bleak, to the point where were not sure how much we can trust even Harmony (who I loved and thought was beyond reproach)...it's almost too much despair.

I hated what happened with Wayne in chapter 5, but I hate more how much pain Wax is suffering at the end. And senselessly. Was it just to keep the balance between Preservation and Ruin? No, that's not okay. I AM NOT OKAY.

To be betrayed by man is expected. But betrayed by your god? And the way that it was done?? That HURTS, Sanderson.

If I can stop being raw and visceral, I start to wonder why Harmony is so blind to the threat (not ignorant, but unable to see it). How limited is Harmony? How much can he observe — everything that happens on Scadrial? He needs the spikes only to communicate (listen/speak) and to control the kandra, not to observe what people are doing. So why is this third shard, and the unknown metal, able to hide so effectively? Does Harmony have a lot less power and influence than we thought? Or is he simply not telling how much he knows?

[Asperity he/him]

I am intrigued by this as well. I agree I think 1980's era will actually be from the POV of the Southern Scandrians and may not be that far ahead (possible 40 years or so) of WaW era as they appear to be a lot farther along than the North. What almost destroyed them may be WW1 or WW 2 like situation and they are in the process of rebuilding.  Perhaps we learn that Harmony built the North based on Preservation and the South on Ruin as separate experiments or to balance out the struggle from the opposing forces. Also if I recall correctly the 1980's era is about a team of Allomancers hunting down a full Mistborn. I feel like the Set's plans are to make a full Mistborn through hemalurgy from the captured women in AoL perhaps this is the tie in between the two eras. Of course this is all just crazy speculation. The thing that doesn't make sense is to me is why the Southern Scandians would not explore the North if they are that much more technologically advance. 

 

It's not so much that they're /more/ technologically advanced, but that they advanced /differently/. That's a paraphrased WoB from an AoL hardcover I bought a while back.

 

Also keep in mind that Allomancy is incredibly rare in South Scadrial. While I do believe that modern Mistborn will be set in South Scadrial, I'm curious as to where the Mistborn(s) will come from.

[Asperity he/him]

Hoid driving carriages again, we have confirmation he survives SA.

 

 

I forgot that I had this reply open in another tab. Oops.

Anyway, Hoid surviving SA is a given as he will be the main character of future Mistborn.

 

Sorry for double post.

[qarlin he/him]

I think Melaan sums up Harmony's dealings with Wax well (but I'll paraphrase); doing something good for one person will hurt other people. Sazed can see the future, and that means that he can tell that Wax needs to be somewhere to do something and can see what needs to happen; Harmony's intent may be balance, but Sazed himself can't stand to see people suffering. So it's probable that he needs Wax to grow in ways that those around him won't, so he can save other people from worse suffering or death.
 
 
The very fact that the feral people in the Homeland were obviously being controlled through that single spike (they were only there to prevent Wax's escape) suggests to me that it's not Autonomy. Also, the idea that Autonomy would be controlling people or manipulating people seems to go against his Intent. That's my impression, though.
 
 
 
I am interested in who the "Men of Gold and Red" are. With the Unknown Metal (I think Miles says that).
 
 
And I'm pretty sure Hoid was there to overhear the conversation. How, I don't know. But he has a lot of abilities that we don't know about. (Reference end of WoR).

Edited October 13, 2015 by qarlin

[the winter system]

Anyway, Hoid surviving SA is a given as he will be the main character of future Mistborn.

Emphasis mine.

Where is this coming from?

[Landis963 he/him]

Emphasis mine.

Where is this coming from?

 

There was a WoB that said that Hoid would be a major character of the Sci-fi Mistborn trilogy where everything comes to a head, but I don't recall him saying that Hoid would be the main character of that trilogy, per se.  

Edited October 14, 2015 by Landis963