Blurb for Words of Radiance

[Kurkistan he/him]

Well, a distinct thing from spirit.

Akin (adj.): Of similar character: "genius and madness are akin"

[Phantom Monstrosity]

Akin (adj.): Of similar character: "genius and madness are akin"

You could argue previously that having a powerful spirit automatically made you more heavily invested or vice versa - ie, having a heftier dose of preservation's power makes you more spirited, or being a drab (and less invested) resutls in being less spirited.

[Djando Je he/him]

Kaladin is not a full Radiant yet, he has only said the first two Ideals of the Knights of Radiance. The first one being the "Life before death," and the second being the "I will protect people who cannot protect themselves,". Unless I'm mistaken, there are ten Ideals and the first two are generic for all ten groups of knights and the next eight are specific to each group. Also we don't know yet if Kaladin will even be a Windrunner because there are two groups of knights that have the ability to bind things.

It has to do with the double eye of the creator design on the inside cover of the book. There are ten groups of Radiants and ten Radiant abilities. Each group of Radiants has two abilities and each ability is used by two groups of Radiants. If you look at the design I'm talking about, then each colorful symbol represents a Radiant group and each black symbol represents an ability.

So unless there is something I haven't seen that Brandon or Peter has said, then we don't know if Kaladin is a Windrunner.

Also Beorc is right: Jasnah is Dalinar's niece, not sister. Aside from that, they are going to the Shattered Plains not to look for Ureata, but to study the Parshendi. I just read the last Shallan viewpoint chapter where they talk about leaving (p. 990, hardcover).

[Windrunner he/him]

Brandon has said Kaladin is on the path to becoming a Windrunner.

And, each order has only five oaths, sharing the first one among all ten orders, for a total of 41 oaths.

[b4dave he/him]

Well if someone Invested with the powers of a KR (or non KR like Szeth) can't use their powers against one another....that pretty much ensures some crappy fight scenes...so I doubt this is the case.

[Djando Je he/him]

I tried to respond last night but the site went down just as I hit post. (speaking of which, everything looks weird.) Anyways, thanks for the correction windrunner. I actually wasn't sure about the number of oaths. Not to mention the fact that I was talking more to the people on the first page, because when I posted I hadn't yet noticed that there were three pages of comments. 

Anyways, I have a correction of my own to make. You can push on metal spikes with allomancy. Rashek does it at the end of book one to Vin's earring while it is in her ear. (p.626 paperback)

[Dahak he/him]

I do think the "Where's Urithiru?" plot line will be brought to a close before too many books.

 

We do have an as yet unnamed city that appears to be in a location that does't seem suitable for cities. Namely the Shattered Plain. If someone parked their flying city there during the recreance it could be Uritithiru and the next book from the preposed names appears to be centered arround the shatered plains.

 

If it is Urithiru that might also explain how we find out how shardblades are made this book.

[Windrunner he/him]

I wouldn't doubt it, but Jasnah is fairly adamant that Urithiru is not in Natanatan, which controlled the area of the Shattered Plains previously. Not that I believe Jasnah is infallible, but I can't see her being that certain without knowing or having a really good idea where it is.

[rags]

Maybe there is a gateway in the shattered planes leading to urithiru? I think it is safe to assume that there is one of these mysterious "usual route" to the our annoyingly elusive city in Natanatan, given that it was one of the silver kingdoms??

[Windrunner he/him]

Oh wow. Now that is compelling. An Oathgate to Urithiru in the old capital of Natanatan is something I see as being a very real possibility.

[callumke he/him]

I agree that this is a very good point - but I doubt that the Oathgates still work. Perhaps the Parshendi do not know what they have, and a Radiant-to-be (Dalinar?) activates it.

[Chris Lockett]

An aspect of "basic lashing" is the ability to lash upwards, to lessen weight, or downwards, increasing it. Perhaps, after all 5 ideals are spoken, a kr can travel this way. There is a reference to "radiants riding the stormwall" (paraphrased). Sezth does say the lashings interfere with the gemstones in shardplate. Yet in his visions, Dalinar sees the kr's plate glowing, with glyphs written on them. As far as the creation of the blades, the dawnshards were the heralds, while shardblades were created for mankind to use against the voidbringers. Hence the cutting of rock as passing through smoke, yet living flesh tugs slightly. Another interesting thought is Syl tells Kaladin that she gave up some of her self, in return taking from him to enable Kal to use stormlight. In this example, Sezth would have bonded with a spern in order to use stormlight.

Shallan, Jasnah, and Elhokar all show the same signs of another order of raidents... those who soulcast. While it is still to early to say when, i believe Elhokar will begin in WoR to soulcast, with the anticipated arrival of his sister and Shallan on the shattered plains.

Hoid is a rather interesting character, one could say timeless. He refers to the heralds as friends, and is oft in the right place at the right time. I suspect more to be reveled soon....

One final thought for now. Are the Parshendi voidbringers? For one, the assassination of Gavilar had to do with the sphere given to Sezth, which was dark and glowed with a black light. Alas, not another mention aside from the prologue. Eshonai gives a great perspective on this in the audio sample found on this sight about "The Dark Gods".

[askthepaperclip he/him]

Man, someone downvoted this guy's very first post, and didn't bother to tell him why, or correct any of the things he said? Harsh...

[Binnut he/him]

During a reread i found the following quote:

Way of kings part One. p.111
 

Parshmen could speak, but they rarely did so. Many seemed mute. As a child, she'd found the patterns of their marbled skin beautiful. That had been before her father forbade her to spend any time with the parshmen.

 

After reading this post that line stood out a little to me. She used to spend some time at least watching parshmen, but her father forbade her from spending time with them. Did he know something? Did the monster discussed earlier in this thread have anything to do with parshmen prompting him to forbid her to be near parshmen again.?

What do you think?

[Dysphoric Kitten she/her]

                    *****SEVERE WARNING*******

THIS REPLY IS FULL OF SPOILERS OF THE WORST KIND

 

 

 

I don't know of Brightlord Davar's knowledge, but I suspect that:

A. Navani is a Soulcaster

B. Firespren make fire, Windspren case winds, etc.

C. Earth might have existed

D. Dalinar will soon become a Windrunner

E. Szeth will soon die

F. We are missing much of Surgebinding

G. Voidbinding does not use spren. What then?

H. Kaladin will acquire shards

I. Shinovar has normal seasons

J. Szeth is truthless because he was bonded, not because of his shards

K. We found the magical triad, but where are the sixteens?

L. Shards, Fabrials and Voidish magic (along with old magic?) don't work in Sinovar

M. Voidish magic might be related to the old magic

 

Rationale:

A. Jasna and Elhokar are Soulcasters. What have they in common with Shalan? Passion. Navani is both their mother, and is very passionate.

B. When we say the opposite, we give the scientific explanation from Earth. But look at the seasons! They are NOT right, they are completely RANDOM! Also, if the sun is up for 12h (therefore down 12h) and each moon up 4h (therefore down 4h), they MUST be up at DAY, TOO! That is never mentioned, presumably doesn't happen. What's up with THAT? Makes no sense.

C. Humans are everywhere (created by the once-human shardholders). I know, very poor rationale, and a poorer theory, but it seems the place where Adonalsium shattered or was or something. Especially when you see Shinovar and the strawberries and chicken and all that.

D. (+See E&H) Syl likes Dalinar now, and he is honorable and all that. It increases chances that he will be bonded be an Honorspren. Plus, Szeth is assassinating him, and he, Adolin and Kaladin are too important

E. (+See D&H) It has to happen sometime, Dalinar, Adolin and Kal are too improtant, Teravangion can't die and won't give the stone.

F. Aren't there supposed to be two Spren to each radiant? What draws each Spren? (Symbolheads (Passionspren?) seem to search passion and want truth, Honorspren seem to search honor and want humanity, what else?)

G. Spren are of Honor, Void is of Odium, the two are enemies. I suppose the Voidish magic is the old magic

H. (+See D&E) He can, and Renarin is still waiting for his.

I. It is, supposedly, a model of earth.

J. He wouldn't have been bonded if he was a shardbearer, the shards have been given to him by the Shin

K. (+See G&M) Spren magic (Radiant) - Stormlight magic (Fabrials) - old/Voidish magic (?)

L. (+See C&I) Maybe the moons and night could be different, too?

M. (+See G&K) Kolo?

 

Sources:

A. Elhokar mentions (at Adolin's duel, during the dandelion era) that he sees, in mirrors, assassins with twisted heads of symbols, a very specific Symbolhead description.

B. The only set season is the wheeping. Read Kal's flashbacks

C. The other cosmere books

D. The freeing of the bridgemen

​H. The flashbacks - Kal does kill a full SB

J. Syl's Shard-hatred

All Other Ones: General knowledge/Logic

 

Kolo?

 

Critics (especially constructive ones), thoughts and responses are welcome.

[hoser he/him]

                    *****SEVERE WARNING*******

THIS REPLY IS FULL OF SPOILERS OF THE WORST KIND

 

 

 

I don't know of Brightlord Davar's knowledge, but I suspect that:

A. Navani is a Soulcaster

B. Firespren make fire, Windspren case winds, etc.

C. Earth might have existed

This book is set in the "Cosmere", which does include other planets on which horses, chickens, grass etc thrive.  The earth is not part of the cosmere. 

D. Dalinar will soon become a Windrunner

Some think that he will become a Radiant.  Some think he may have attracted a spren already.  Most speculate that he will be a Radiant of a different order than Kaladin.  Brandon has said that he will be the focus of a book and it is thought that the books will each focus on a different Radiant order.  We have read the Windrunner book. 

E. Szeth will soon die

He is supposed to have a later book, although Brandon has said that characters can predecease their books.  There are other outcomes than Szeth dying or Dalinar dying.  Szeth could fail to assassinate, then escape.  He could be captured.  He could decide that fighting the Voidbringers is more important than having his soul sit in stone after he dies (lose faith) and not worry about the stone. 

F. We are missing much of Surgebinding

F. Aren't there supposed to be two Spren to each radiant? What draws each Spren? (Symbolheads (Passionspren?) seem to search passion and want truth, Honorspren seem to search honor and want humanity, what else?)

I am expecting one spren per Radiant.  Why do you think there should be two?  Kaladin apparently has the full Radiant powerset with a single spren.  

G. Voidbinding does not use spren. What then?

H. Kaladin will acquire shards

I. Shinovar has normal seasons

J. Szeth is truthless because he was bonded, not because of his shards

Szeth's Truthlessness is apparently a sentence laid down by the Stone Shamans.  Brandon has stated that his Windrunner powers do not come from an association with a spren. 

K. We found the magical triad, but where are the sixteens?

Some speculate that the sixteen refers to the original 16 Shards of Adonalsium.

L. Shards, Fabrials and Voidish magic (along with old magic?) don't work in Sinovar

In an Interlude, Rysn's successfully uses a detection fabrial in Shinovar.  There are apparently no spren in Shinovar, but they can be brought inside fabrials, at least.

M. Voidish magic might be related to the old magic

 

Rationale: ...

[Shardlet he/him]

A. Jasna and Elhokar are Soulcasters.

 

Sources:

A. Elhokar mentions (at Adolin's duel, during the dandelion era) that he sees, in mirrors, assassins with twisted heads of symbols, a very specific Symbolhead description.

 

This is an assumption based upon an assumption.  While the cryptic (symbolhead) does grant Shallan access to Shadesmar where she interacts with the cognitive aspect of the goblet (leading to the transformation to blood), there is no evidence beyond this that the cryptic facilitates the soulcasting in any other fashion.  The cryptic is conspicuously absent from Shadesmar.  This leads me to believe that the cryptic is not involved in Shallan's soulcasting.  By extension, I don't think that Elhokar is a soulcaster. 

 

He appear to have, in my view, a greater sensitivity to the cryptics since he can visibly see them, albeit in mirrors, while Shallan can only sense them, presently, by way of her drawing ability (as well as being able to hear in her mind their communication with her).

[Crysanja]

we dont know if Shallan would see cryptics(her cryptic?) in mirrors too.

 

it seems that Sly/(spren) can change her body, maybe to look like a cryptic?

so maybe someone else could be bound to the cryptic and he asked/send the cryptic to follow/spy/terrorice Elhokar.

would be a very effective way, we dont know any way to prevent it.

[Dysphoric Kitten she/her]

1.This book is set in the "Cosmere", which does include other planets on which horses, chickens, grass etc thrive.  The earth is not part of the cosmere. 

 

2.Some think that he will become a Radiant.  Some think he may have attracted a spren already.  Most speculate that he will be a Radiant of a different order than Kaladin.  Brandon has said that he will be the focus of a book and it is thought that the books will each focus on a different Radiant order.  We have read the Windrunner book. 

 

3.He is supposed to have a later book, although Brandon has said that characters can predecease their books.  There are other outcomes than Szeth dying or Dalinar dying.  Szeth could fail to assassinate, then escape.  He could be captured.  He could decide that fighting the Voidbringers is more important than having his soul sit in stone after he dies (lose faith) and not worry about the stone. 

 

4.I am expecting one spren per Radiant.  Why do you think there should be two?  Kaladin apparently has the full Radiant powerset with a single spren.  

Szeth's Truthlessness is apparently a sentence laid down by the Stone Shamans.  Brandon has stated that his Windrunner powers do not come from an association with a spren. 

 

5.Some speculate that the sixteen refers to the original 16 Shards of Adonalsium.

 

6.In an Interlude, Rysn's successfully uses a detection fabrial in Shinovar.  There are apparently no spren in Shinovar, but they can be brought inside fabrials, at least.

1. fine, seem legit.

2. As above

3. I definitely do not buy any of those arguments. Definitely. Szeth is too devoted for one murder (instead of 500+ slaughters, which he's done) to break him.

4. If I recall correctly, there was something like a two spren per order thing in the book. ... After checking with the coppermind, I see it says that orders share surges, which I have interepted as "the share surges and spren, for spren are related to surges"

5. I meant, why  does sixteen appear at mistborn, and here it is ten?

6. You have won, fair and square. I don't think you can put spren in fabrials, though. You should check.

 

(Tal Spektor: "Jasna and Elhokar are soulcasters"

This is an assumption based upon an assumption.  While the cryptic (symbolhead) does grant Shallan access to Shadesmar where she interacts with the cognitive aspect of the goblet (leading to the transformation to blood), there is no evidence beyond this that the cryptic facilitates the soulcasting in any other fashion.  The cryptic is conspicuously absent from Shadesmar.  This leads me to believe that the cryptic is not involved in Shallan's soulcasting.  By extension, I don't think that Elhokar is a soulcaster. 

 

He appear to have, in my view, a greater sensitivity to the cryptics since he can visibly see them, albeit in mirrors, while Shallan can only sense them, presently, by way of her drawing ability (as well as being able to hear in her mind their communication with her).

Jasna is a soulcaster (Shallan's climax reveals it), knows the creatures.

Shallan is a soulcaster (she soulcasts twice, once without a soulcaster even AROUND her, both using the creatures) and at the second time she does, it is VERY CLEARLY put that the soulcasting is dependant on the truth she gives HER SYMBOLHEADS.

   It should be clear that the symbolheads are her radiant bond. (FYI, the cognitive realm does NOT belong to soulcasting)

 

This, added to Occam's razor, means I probably am correct. Full explanation of the Occam instance:

 

Maybe someone is freaking Elhokar out, but it is much less likely that: A. there is a radiant in camp, B. no-one suspects, C. the radian hates his king, D. the radiant thought of that method, E. the radiant had the guts to use it, F. the symbolheads complied,

than: Elokhar has the potential

or: Elhokar, like Rock, can see all present spren.

we dont know if Shallan would see cryptics(her cryptic?) in mirrors too.

 

it seems that Sly/(spren) can change her body, maybe to look like a cryptic?

so maybe someone else could be bound to the cryptic and he asked/send the cryptic to follow/spy/terrorice Elhokar.

would be a very effective way, we dont know any way to prevent it.

You get the same Occam's.

[Windrunner he/him]

Spren are definitely inside fabrials, that's how they work. Navani's notebook was translated and says so.

[Shardlet he/him]

Jasna is a soulcaster (Shallan's climax reveals it), knows the creatures.

Shallan is a soulcaster (she soulcasts twice, once without a soulcaster even AROUND her, both using the creatures) and at the second time she does, it is VERY CLEARLY put that the soulcasting is dependant on the truth she gives HER SYMBOLHEADS.

   It should be clear that the symbolheads are her radiant bond. (FYI, the cognitive realm does NOT belong to soulcasting)

 

This, added to Occam's razor, means I probably am correct. Full explanation of the Occam instance:

 

Maybe someone is freaking Elhokar out, but it is much less likely that: A. there is a radiant in camp, B. no-one suspects, C. the radian hates his king, D. the radiant thought of that method, E. the radiant had the guts to use it, F. the symbolheads complied,

than: Elokhar has the potential

or: Elhokar, like Rock, can see all present spren.

You get the same Occam's.

 

 

Again, I think you are making some unjustified leaps.  Jasnah knows of the cryptics.  We do not know yet whether she knows them or sees them.

 

Shallan has only soulcast once when she changed the goblet to blood.  She travelled to Shadesmar twice.  The second trip did not involve soulcasting.  The cryptic says the strength of the bond is dependent upon the power of the truth given.  At no point does the cryptic mention anything about soulcasting.

 

As to Elhokar freaking out, yup, he sure is.  Shallan was freaking out about them also.  Her panic put her in a very bad position which ultimately worked out.  Elhokar has no explanation or resolution to his sightings of the cryptics.  So, yeah, he's still freaking out about them.  It may indeed turn out that the cryptics are indeed involved in soulcasting and that Elhokar has the potential/ability to soulcast in the same way as Jasnah and Shallan. (Although, that seems to me to be a lot of natural soulcasters in the core cast of characters).  My only point is, I don't think the evidence is strong enough yet to support such absolute statements. 

[hoser he/him]

3. I definitely do not buy any of those arguments. Definitely. Szeth is too devoted for one murder (instead of 500+ slaughters, which he's done) to break him.

Yeah, I don't think that Szeth would balk at a death either. 

I do think that he is vulnerable through his motivation, though.  Apparently he voluntarily took on the punishment of the Stone Shamans to do something to defy the Voidbringers.  He seems resigned to the coming Desolation.  If he saw some hope, he could defy the Shamanic punishment for the same reason he brought it on in the first place. 

He also has two constraints: he can't take his own life and he can't give up the sword.  If he was put in a dilemma where he had to do one or the other, it seems to me that he could crack. 

OTOH, he could end up hating himself and everyone else and become Odium's champion. 

4. If I recall correctly, there was something like a two spren per order thing in the book. ... After checking with the coppermind, I see it says that orders share surges, which I have interepted as "the share surges and spren, for spren are related to surges"

  That seems like an assumption to me.  In isolation, it seems reasonable.  If Kaladin had a relationship/bond with two different spren, I would tend to agree.  Since Kaladin can access both gravity and pressure surges and apparently only has a bond with one spren, it doesn't seem to be the way it works.  Does Occam cut here?

5. I meant, why  does sixteen appear at mistborn, and here it is ten?

Sorry, I misunderstood.  I believe that Brandon has said that certain numbers are important on certain parts of the Cosmere.  On Roshar, 10.  On the Mistborn planet, 16.  I can try to dig up the quote if you want. 

6. You have won, fair and square.

I apologize.  The best part of my intention is to learn and share information.  The extent that my desire to be right and smart has interfered is not helpful.  Please forgive me. 

I don't think you can put spren in fabrials, though. You should check.

Apparently Navani thinks that that is how it works.  Her translated notebooks say that that is what is going on.  To me, it dovetails with that interlude with the ardent spren researchers.  But Navani could be wrong too, I suppose.   

 

Welcome to the 17th Shard and please keep sharing your insights. 

[Dysphoric Kitten she/her]

Yeah, I don't think that Szeth would balk at a death either. 

I do think that he is vulnerable through his motivation, though.  Apparently he voluntarily took on the punishment of the Stone Shamans to do something to defy the Voidbringers.  He seems resigned to the coming Desolation.  If he saw some hope, he could defy the Shamanic punishment for the same reason he brought it on in the first place. 

He also has two constraints: he can't take his own life and he can't give up the sword.  If he was put in a dilemma where he had to do one or the other, it seems to me that he could crack. 

OTOH, he could end up hating himself and everyone else and become Odium's champion. 

  That seems like an assumption to me.  In isolation, it seems reasonable.  If Kaladin had a relationship/bond with two different spren, I would tend to agree.  Since Kaladin can access both gravity and pressure surges and apparently only has a bond with one spren, it doesn't seem to be the way it works.  Does Occam cut here?

Sorry, I misunderstood.  I believe that Brandon has said that certain numbers are important on certain parts of the Cosmere.  On Roshar, 10.  On the Mistborn planet, 16.  I can try to dig up the quote if you want. 

I apologize.  The best part of my intention is to learn and share information.  The extent that my desire to be right and smart has interfered is not helpful.  Please forgive me. 

Apparently Navani thinks that that is how it works.  Her translated notebooks say that that is what is going on.  To me, it dovetails with that interlude with the ardent spren researchers.  But Navani could be wrong too, I suppose.   

 

Welcome to the 17th Shard and please keep sharing your insights. 

 

I tend to be slightly mal-informed about certain things, including, but not limited to, things brandon says (where do I get a feed of those?) and book addatives (since I audioread many books, and, well, the pages from Navani's notebooks were not included, in this instance). 

[Windrunner he/him]

It's all good, a lot of this stuff is tough to pick up on. We get our info from a few places. We co-run an interview database with theoryland, which contains as many Brandon interviews as we can get our hands on. (I'm working on adding more all the time) When someone gets new info, they often post it in the Events board. Brandon's also posted a series of annotations for Warbreaker, Elantris, and the Mistborn trilogy, available on his website. These often contain lots of fun and interesting facts. There is also the Brandonothology. This is the old database, no longer being updated. All of its stuff is now in the theoryland database, but I find it can be a good background for someone newer to the cosmere. There is also the Coppermind, a 17th Shard wiki. This is definitely a work in progress, but there is a lot of good info there. The translated versions of Navani's notebook are there, or you can just click here. I'm not sure if the audiobook comes with illustrations, but here's a link to all the TWoK illustrations. Hopefully this is somewhat helpful

[Kurkistan he/him]

Here are the interior illustrations for the Rithmatist, if you haven't found them yet.

Edited August 4, 2013 by Kurkistan