Long Game 113: The Thaylen City Council

[Ink and Embers Any pronouns]

2 minutes ago, Mystfall said:

Oh I did.

Didnt work out though

I'm equally dubious of Myst, for this comment (though I'm not really sure what the alternative would be that he could say) and of TUC, as I think a deposition would be unnecessary risk for information that's been manipulated already (and as the manipulation won't be revealed, only the result, it would require everyone to reveal their starting loyalty for it to show targets, which would give a lot of information to Elims. But also to village. I guess it's a balance?)

No votes for now; it's between the two

[Asriel He/Him]

2 minutes ago, Mystfall said:

People can scan my role you know, if you have the role you can fact-check me on this

Point.

[Mystfall He/Him]

Just now, Asriel said:

Point.

Now, if you don’t have the role then fair, but someone probably does. And hopefully I don’t need to say this but if you scan someone and they come up as Mavset-im or Elim. You should probably tell people(delaying to bait info from them is also viable)

4 minutes ago, Ink and Embers said:

I'm equally dubious of Myst, for this comment (though I'm not really sure what the alternative would be that he could say) and of TUC, as I think a deposition would be unnecessary risk for information that's been manipulated already (and as the manipulation won't be revealed, only the result, it would require everyone to reveal their starting loyalty for it to show targets, which would give a lot of information to Elims. But also to village. I guess it's a balance?)

No votes for now; it's between the two

I don’t know about you, but considering how much complaining I’ve done about not being Elim. If I lied and said I didn’t do my best to rig it, that’d be more suspicious. I expect Hoid did something similar 

[Illwei]

To say that trying to keep a positive loyalty prevents the Village from doing anything productive is a gross overstatement.

While there are a lot of actions that can benefit from being negative, please keep in mind that there are only a few roles that can change their own or other's loyalty more than the 1 that you can use with your action. 

If you have a negative loyalty please don't announce it. Feel more than free to not feel pressured to use your negative ability actions if you think it will benefit the team. But if you are in a positive loyalty I recommend not using cycles to lower loyalty so that you can use other negative abilities. 

I think the Rebsk is the biggest thing that you can try to control. ending without or with any votes is something under your control to a degree, so keep that in mind. 

The Minister can affect other's loyalties, The Royal Family, and while smuggler and banker can as well, I think theirs is less impactful. 

I will say, if you are royal family, please don't use your action unless it's essential. The only time I can imagine this ability being useful for the village is in a ExLo situation with one elim (outed) left, and you are trying to prevent them from deposing. 

Also I truly don't see how the questions I am asking are strange haha. 

 

I do think that TUC is a Villager here. 

I would like to see @Mat's thoughts on Myst before I say mine myself. 

[Archer he/him]

VC:

Hoid (1): Myst 

Myst (3): Asriel, Mat, Mint

Araris (1): Hoid

Asriel (1): Illwei

[Mystfall He/Him]

7 minutes ago, Archer said:

VC:

Hoid (1): Myst 

Myst (3): Asriel, Mat, Mint

Araris (1): Hoid

Asriel (1): Illwei

When did Mat vote me?

I can’t find it

[Ascended Grubberfly He/Him]

23 minutes ago, Wahrheitswächter said:

"Don't pretend you aren't old Dvalk, we both know thats not true. And I dont like the appearancr of Odium either and I do not want to join his side, but you know, I fear a world where we remain in the coalition but these next few days evolve in a way that could be detrimental to Thaylenah, if the Contest is won, the Coalition gets Herdaz and Alethkar, but Herdaz is not the most important country and Alethkar is for vast stretches landlocked. Jah Keved, Iri, Rira and Babarthanam are all lost to us, even if we can keep Azir, who says that the other Makabaki Nations really stay with Azir, they could have recieved similar ofders to ours, there is a chance that we end up in a world where most Rosharan Ports will be closed to us, and that is something I truly fear.

@Ascended Grubberfly

“shhhh! If you out my old age, no one will see me as the cunning youth wise beyond his years!”

Dvalk nodded grimly as Ralm finished his statement. “Choose humanity, or choose business. Or is humanity siding with the singers?”

Dvalk was not trained in the ways of the court. He watched others throw accusations and deflections as if they didn’t have to think. Too much for an ol— young untrained soul like him.

 

Illwei 

[Asriel He/Him]

12 minutes ago, Mystfall said:

When did Mat vote me?

I can’t find it

 

2 hours ago, Mat said:

Mystfall

More later

 

[Mystfall He/Him]

Just now, Asriel said:

 

 

Ah, thanks.

I was concerned for a sec that Archer was manipulating the votes through sheer gaslighting

[Asriel He/Him]

Just now, Mystfall said:

Ah, thanks.

I was concerned for a sec that Archer was manipulating the votes through sheer gaslighting

lol something to watch out for I guess

[Mystfall He/Him]

1 minute ago, Asriel said:

lol something to watch out for I guess

It’s usually not on purpose, so I’m not too worried about it

[WhimsyIsTheBestShard]

39 minutes ago, Asriel said:

@WhimsyIsTheBestShard

Rbiren turns from the mirror, his robes swishing dramatically. “Lord Falwin! I have been wanting to meet you. But what do you mean when you say that absurd statement with such a straight face?”

Lord Falwin is a very rational person, and never lets his emotions get the best of him. That said, he was under the impression that politicians weren't supposed to be so blunt. "Why? You have proof otherwise? I think everyone here knows that 'Odium' is Alethi propaganda and anti-loyalists are trying to scare us. I'll bet you were the one to put that letter there. Why, -" he starts walking away, "This isn't over, Rbiren!"

"Oh, you've done it now," Leb says when they are safely in their quarters. "I am going on top tomorrow, and we are voting Fickle"

Edited Thursday at 04:17 PM by WhimsyIsTheBestShard

[Mystfall He/Him]

Will admit that I am concerned that it’s been 14 hours and there’s already 4 votes on me alone. 

[Asriel He/Him]

Just now, WhimsyIsTheBestShard said:

Lord Falwin is a very rational person, and never lets his emotions get the best of him. That said, he was under the impression that politicians weren't supposed to be so blunt. "Why? You have proof otherwise? I think everyone here knows that 'Odium' is Alethi propaganda and anti-loyalists are trying to scare us. I'll bet you were the one to put that letter there. Why, -" he starts walking away, "This isn't over, Rbiren!"

"Oh, you've done it now," Leb says when they are safely in there quarters. "I am going on top tomorrow, and we are voting Fickle"

Rbiren grinned to himself. It was too easy to offend these political types. All it took was one slightly rude comment. But really, he had wanted to talk to Falwin. He needed to change his outfit soon, before he killed Rbiren with that awful trench coat!

[Illwei]

8 minutes ago, WhimsyIsTheBestShard said:

Lord Falwin is a very rational person, and never lets his emotions get the best of him. That said, he was under the impression that politicians weren't supposed to be so blunt. "Why? You have proof otherwise? I think everyone here knows that 'Odium' is Alethi propaganda and anti-loyalists are trying to scare us. I'll bet you were the one to put that letter there. Why, -" he starts walking away, "This isn't over, Rbiren!"

"Oh, you've done it now," Leb says when they are safely in their quarters. "I am going on top tomorrow, and we are voting Fickle"

Can you clarify if this is a vote or not? Red text is usually reserved for voting. 

EDIT:

Village:
Whimsy - Asriel - TUC

Edited Thursday at 04:23 PM by Illwei

[The Unknown Character he/him]

39 minutes ago, Ink and Embers said:

I'm equally dubious of Myst, for this comment (though I'm not really sure what the alternative would be that he could say) and of TUC, as I think a deposition would be unnecessary risk for information that's been manipulated already (and as the manipulation won't be revealed, only the result, it would require everyone to reveal their starting loyalty for it to show targets, which would give a lot of information to Elims. But also to village. I guess it's a balance?)

No votes for now; it's between the two

To be fair to everyone who is distrusting me for this, I'm pretty sure I'd still be advocating for a n1 deposition as an elim. It's useful information for both sides. I probably wouldn't be advocating raising your own loyalty as much if I was Elim though

32 minutes ago, Illwei said:

To say that trying to keep a positive loyalty prevents the Village from doing anything productive is a gross overstatement.

While there are a lot of actions that can benefit from being negative, please keep in mind that there are only a few roles that can change their own or other's loyalty more than the 1 that you can use with your action. 

If you have a negative loyalty please don't announce it. Feel more than free to not feel pressured to use your negative ability actions if you think it will benefit the team. But if you are in a positive loyalty I recommend not using cycles to lower loyalty so that you can use other negative abilities. 

I think the Rebsk is the biggest thing that you can try to control. ending without or with any votes is something under your control to a degree, so keep that in mind. 

The Minister can affect other's loyalties, The Royal Family, and while smuggler and banker can as well, I think theirs is less impactful. 

I will say, if you are royal family, please don't use your action unless it's essential. The only time I can imagine this ability being useful for the village is in a ExLo situation with one elim (outed) left, and you are trying to prevent them from deposing. 

Also I truly don't see how the questions I am asking are strange haha. 

 

I do think that TUC is a Villager here. 

I would like to see @Mat's thoughts on Myst before I say mine myself. 

The underlined was exactly my reaction but phrased better

It's just, a lot of the times you ask questions that I feel like are common sense to me, but when I think about them for a second I realize how they make sense to ask as someone who isn't as ingrained here as I am

4 minutes ago, Mystfall said:

Will admit that I am concerned that it’s been 14 hours and there’s already 4 votes on me alone. 

That is actually insane

I still feel guilty about last game, so I will vote with you to save you if I need to

[Asriel He/Him]

3 minutes ago, Illwei said:

Village:
Whimsy - Asriel - TUC

So are you changing your vote?

[Hoid Slayer He/Him]

12 hours ago, The Unknown Character said:

I'm 100% percent going to move to depose come nighttime unless PMs lead be to believe there's vastly more disloyal players than I expected 

Can we get reasoning on this?

11 hours ago, Archer said:

Araris (1): Hoid (poking the bear)

I love poking the bear

11 hours ago, Mystfall said:

There’s a role for it. There is no guarantee that Jo put the role in though

I highly doubt he wouldn’t

My guess is four starting elims, including one mavset-im

Elims:

I volunteer myself for conversion

This is halfway a joke and halfway a plea

11 hours ago, Wahrheitswächter said:

@Mat According to the Rules the Deposition Votes will be publicly revealed.

I can see two interpretations of this:

a) we will know who has positive, neutral, or negative Loyalty

b) we will know how many have positive, neutral or negative Loyalty

@Jo and the Bush @Cuendillar please Clarify

Awesome thanks

So there actually does seem to be a potential upside to this. The danger is that not enough people up their Loyalty this cycle cause they’re all busy taking other actions, and we open the game with group suicide

Unlikely, though

1 hour ago, Wahrheitswächter said:

I agree with Mint that especially the 3. Point is a horrendous idea. Because it stops the village from doing anything productive with hheir actions because your plan forces all of us to increase Loyalty

I actually agree with Wahr here

Actually I’m not sure I do

Okay here’s my stance

As much as I wanna joke-Depose Jo, I don’t think we should legitimately use this as an info-gathering method since I don’t believe the bonuses outweigh the risks

TUC does have a point about the need to get villagers out of negative loyalty, however

I highly recommend all villagers with negative loyalty simply spend their actions to increase it until it is resolved. I don’t think further incentivizing is really needed. Village wants to stop all possible Depositions. This is the way. That ought to be enough incentive, I think

The other thing is we could all see if we can agree to unanimously increase loyalty this cycle

C1 actions, to be honest, rarely do much, and if we’re ever gonna do this now is the time with the least risk

The one role I don’t think should do this is the one that cab alignment scan at neutral loyalty, I don’t remember the name but yeah keep that ability please, and maybe highguard

Gonna drop this post for now and keep catching up, be right back

 

[WhimsyIsTheBestShard]

6 minutes ago, Illwei said:

Can you clarify if this is a vote or not? Red text is usually reserved for voting. 

EDIT:

Village:
Whimsy - Asriel - TUC

Lord Falwin assures you, he voted Rbi- er... Fickle

[Mystfall He/Him]

13 minutes ago, The Unknown Character said:

That is actually insane

I still feel guilty about last game, so I will vote with you to save you if I need to

Currently wanting to give Hoid a clear for now(don’t have a read just yet, but his role is most likely useful, especially since he had a hand in picking it, and I’d like to not take that away unless I feel confident)

If someone is going to Depo then I’m going to also stay away from Twin as well. I’d like to see the loyalty he started at. After that I’ve got a current gut v!read on Illwei.

I like what Hoid just posted-further reason to not vote him. Obviously taking out Whimsy, Fox and Asriel. It’s still a pretty big pool of people.

I think Mint

1 hour ago, Mint11 said:

"Well, that settles it. Fickle (Myst) isn't someone I'd expect to say that the traitors may not bring someone to their side."

I am suspicious of the fact that I have 4 votes already, and I don’t like this, especially considering what Wahr said immediately afterwards. If the reasoning is that I would go for Mavset, then Hoid falls under the same category, and you’ve said nothing about him. If it’s that you don’t like that I suggested the absence of a conversion, the conversion is role-dependent, if the person with the role dies before they convert anyone then there isn’t a conversion. Balancing that IMO is rather delicate considering one exe would essentially take out 2 of the Elims in one go(more if you consider how 1 conversion = 2 NKs)

[Ascended Grubberfly He/Him]

19 minutes ago, Illwei said:

Village:
Whimsy - Asriel - TUC

Why do you say Whimsy and Asriel are village?

Their only action is voting Myst. If Myst flips elim I would agree that Asriel is village, but Whimsy doesn't sound cleared just yet.

[WhimsyIsTheBestShard]

6 minutes ago, Ascended Grubberfly said:

Why do you say Whimsy and Asriel are village?

Their only action is voting Myst. If Myst flips elim I would agree that Asriel is village, but Whimsy doesn't sound cleared just yet.

"No but I'm really nice"

If I put quotes around it it counts as being in character 

[Illwei]

@Asriel

I haven't yet, as you see. 

@The Unknown Character

General thoughts on the setup and best play as of now? You most likely have the best grasp of the rules, or at least you're implying as such. 

In response of sorts to Hoid- 

Again, I don't think extra actions are needed to purely increase loyalty at this moment. There are obviously some roles that benefit from having a negative Loyalty number. 

 - Bonded can track a player, and in doing so potentially increase their own Loyalty.
 - Minister of Trade can increase another player's loyalty by 2, and in doing so potentially increase their own Loyalty. 
 - Smuggler can potentially increase a player's loyalty, while basically performing a protect action it seems. 

While I'm on the topic i might as well talk about roles that I don't think benefit at all from having negative loyalty. 

 - Counselor: you don't have another action, so...increase your loyalty. 
 - Secretary: if you are in the negatives then you can learn a loyalty, but if you move up (max 2 turns) you can perform an Alignment check. 
 - Royal Family: You can use your negative ability even if you are at neutral Loyalty. While this role is, as I said before, Pretty Anti-Village in general - with lowering a loyalty by 4, if you were to need to use it you can do so at neutral. 
 - Naval Officer: This may be controversial, but a thug like this will not impact the game much from how I see it. You know yourself so you know if you are likely to die to a degree. Most likely it is not a big difference, and if you're in the high negatives (er-low?), then you will be - sorry to say it - more use to the village dead than alive, if you are adding too much negative loyalty. 
 - Banker: While you can increase loyalty to an extent when you are negative, it's not useful enough to justify being in a neg Loyalty. Meanwhile - Positive loyalty allows you to not just soothe votes (which I don't think it particularly useful in many cases from a village side), but it has those people who's vote you took vote with you for Deposition, which is very useful especially if there are people known or suspected to be in the negatives. 

Rebsk truly goes either way, I believe their Loyalty will be swinging all over the place throughout, lol. 
 

@Jo and the Bush 
The kill no longer takes an action slot, but is it still counted as an action by the roles that are able to track/watch/redirect? 

[Jo and the Bush all/any]

On 7/23/2026 at 9:53 AM, Illwei said:

The kill no longer takes an action slot, but is it still counted as an action by the roles that are able to track/watch/redirect? 

It is not. The only role that can interact with the Elim kill is the Highguard protect action.

REALLY LATE EDIT: Also the Smuggler.

Edited Saturday at 02:17 AM by Jo and the Bush
Adding the Smuggler

[Archer he/him]

VC:

Mint (1): Myst 

Myst (30000): Asriel, Mat, Mint

Araris (1): Hoid

Asriel (1): Illwei

Illwei (1): Grub

 

Taking the generic action to increase your own loyalty is best done at Night, after Day effects have resolved eg. Tie resets your loyalty to zero.