Why could lift heal people in RoW?

[Walter The Moral]

Okay, so in RoW the Fused had control of the tower, and "disabled' the Radiants' access to surges. The only surges that we saw work were Adhesion and Progression. Now I would think that they work as they are the Surges most closely associated with the two other Shards on Roshar, Honor and Cultivation, but we have seen a Fused with the power of Progression. He was the one that fought Jasnah and could grow his carapace at will.

So if Odium's forces have access to the surge, why didn't Voidlight disable it? We could say it's just Lift being weird, but she still wasn't able to access Abrasion, so I think it's something different.

Any ideas?

[The Sovereign]

24 minutes ago, Walter The Moral said:

Okay, so in RoW the Fused had control of the tower, and "disabled' the Radiants' access to surges. The only surges that we saw work were Adhesion and Progression. Now I would think that they work as they are the Surges most closely associated with the two other Shards on Roshar, Honor and Cultivation, but we have seen a Fused with the power of Progression. He was the one that fought Jasnah and could grow his carapace at will.

So if Odium's forces have access to the surge, why didn't Voidlight disable it? We could say it's just Lift being weird, but she still wasn't able to access Abrasion, so I think it's something different.

Any ideas?

The short answer is Lift is weird. Raboniel changed the Towers protections to negate the use of Stormlight, not the specific Surges which is ultimately what shut of the Radiant Powers where it could (this protection isn't perfect and as you suggest the Surges closest to the Shards and/or being of a high enough Investiture via Oaths sworn dampens the affects of the suppression field). Due to Cultivation tampering with Lift's spiritual web she doesn't use Stormlight, she uses Lifelight which is why she wasn't affected in the same way.

Edited October 2 by The Sovereign

[Quantus]

40 minutes ago, The Sovereign said:

The short answer is Lift is weird. Raboniel changed the Towers protections to negate the use of Stormlight, not the specific Surges which is ultimately what shut of the Radiant Powers where it could (this protection isn't perfect and as you suggest the Surges closest to the Shards and/or being of a high enough Investiture via Oaths sworn dampens the affects of the suppression field). Due to Cultivation tampering with Lift's spiritual web she doesn't use Stormlight, she uses Lifelight which is why she wasn't affected in the same way.

Agreed.  I think it was the same basic reason Venli was able to use what surges she had access to, since she (for her own weirdness) can use either Voidlight or Stormlight.  

[Walter The Moral]

But she couldn't use Abrasion, so that means that the negation of powers at least partially effected her.

[The Sovereign]

20 minutes ago, Walter The Moral said:

But she couldn't use Abrasion, so that means that the negation of powers at least partially effected her.

Lift's level of investiture was still a factor. Had she been of the 4th Ideal, she likely could have used both. 

[alder24]

2 hours ago, Walter The Moral said:

Okay, so in RoW the Fused had control of the tower, and "disabled' the Radiants' access to surges. The only surges that we saw work were Adhesion and Progression. Now I would think that they work as they are the Surges most closely associated with the two other Shards on Roshar, Honor and Cultivation, but we have seen a Fused with the power of Progression. He was the one that fought Jasnah and could grow his carapace at will.

So if Odium's forces have access to the surge, why didn't Voidlight disable it? We could say it's just Lift being weird, but she still wasn't able to access Abrasion, so I think it's something different.

Any ideas?

14 minutes ago, Walter The Moral said:

But she couldn't use Abrasion, so that means that the negation of powers at least partially effected her.

Lift is weird. She didn't feel the suppression fabrial at all, unlike Kaladin, and as you said, she couldn't use either Abrasion or Progression at first. With Progression she felt some resistance, through which she was able to break and heal. Lift's spirit web is messed up by Cultivation, she exists partially in the CR, and those are the reasons why she didn't feel any suppression and could heal others - creating her own Lifelight is definitely a factor. It also might be that Progression is the truest Surge of Cultivation (but this doesn't exclude Odium's forces from using it, and even with Adhesion there is a bias on Fused side). RoW ch 39:

Quote

Kaladin felt a striking moment of disorientation. A feeling of oppression on his mind, like a dark force trying to smother him.

I-5:

Quote

A few strange spren, like faces mocking her, faded in nearby. Wyndle slowly wrapped his vines around her. Gentle, like an embrace. Though others could barely feel the touch of their spren, Wyndle felt solid to her. He wasn’t warm. But … it was comforting when he rested his vine head on her shoulder. For once he didn’t ruin the sentiment by saying something dumb.
And then he perked up in a suspicious-like way.
Lift wiped her eyes. “What?” she demanded.
“I don’t know,” Wyndle said. “Something just happened. In the tower. I feel … a darkness resting on me like a blanket. I think I felt the tower stir.”
[...]
When she’d tried to become awesome earlier, nothing had happened. But when she’d tried to heal, she’d felt something different—a resistance. So this time she pushed it, growling softly until … it worked. Stormlight left her, and the chicken’s wing healed. Her powers didn’t regrow the lost feathers, but in a moment the thing had rolled over and was picking at the bare skin on its side with a tentative beak. Finally, it looked at her and released a confused squawk

 

Spoiler

LettersWords

The Fused only use nine of the Surges (they don't use Adhesion), and Raboniel describes Adhesion as "not a true Surge." Does this mean, in its original form on Ashyn, Surgebinding had no equivalent to Adhesion, and it was created by Honor later?

Brandon Sanderson

That is a valid way of theorizing, and I would encourage you to go that direction. Raboniel is biased. So take those two sentences as separate things. Do be aware she is very, very biased, but also your theorizing could bear fruit going that direction.

YouTube Spoiler Stream 4 (June 16, 2022)