VTPharaoh Posted July 8, 2022 Posted July 8, 2022 I’m finishing a reread of the original Mistborn trilogy. These were the first Cosmere books I read so figured it would be good to reread now that I have a better idea of what’s going on in the grand scale of things! Maybe this is explained more later and I just don’t remember but in Vin’s battle with the Inquisitors near the end of Hero of Ages Marsh breaks her arms, legs, and fingers before pulling out her earring allowing her to draw in the mists. However Allomancy has no healing power that I know of, only the ability to push through pain. I would think with all of those bones broken she wouldn’t be able to jump around, fighting like crazy, no matter how much allomantic power she had from the mists. Anyone have an answer for this?
Stormtide_Leviathan Posted July 8, 2022 Posted July 8, 2022 Also, the infusion of investiture from the mists may have had some healing effect outside of the normal allomantic effects. 3
cometaryorbit Posted July 8, 2022 Posted July 8, 2022 (edited) There's a reference to "the embrace of limitless pewter" making her basically invulnerable. @Frustration is right: pewter does increase healing. Sazed talks about this in book 1, saying they have to keep feeding Vin pewter after she's axed by an Inquisitor at Kredik Shaw. Normally it's slow; enough to make some normally fatal wounds survivable (Vin then, Elend at the Well) but still requiring convalescence (Vin takes ages to get back to full form after the Inquisitor axe incident), not fast healing like Gold Feruchemy. But with it amped up to near-Shardic levels in the process of Ascension, somewhat-increased healing speed becomes massively-increased healing speed. Edited July 8, 2022 by cometaryorbit 6
VTPharaoh Posted July 8, 2022 Author Posted July 8, 2022 Yeah I had forgotten about the increased healing ability and thought only feruchimists had that ability. I figured it had something to do with her being in the process of ascending though.
Treamayne Posted July 8, 2022 Posted July 8, 2022 (edited) Something else to think about: HoA Ch 72 Spoiler Where had she felt that feeling before? Where did she know them? From the Well of Ascension, of course, a voice whispered in her head. It’s the same power, after all. Solid in the metal you fed to Elend. Liquid in the pool you burned. And vapor in the air, confined to night. Hiding you. Protecting you. Giving you power! Vin gasped, drawing in breath—a breath that sucked in the mists. She felt suddenly warm, the mists surging within her, lending her their strength. Her entire body burned like metal, and the pain disappeared in a flash. Marsh swung his axe for her head, spraying water. And she caught his arm. Follow the logic chain: Vin is not burning any metals (except the dregs of her Tin) Vin is absorbing/burning the power of Preservation Compounding is based on the entire concept of using the power of Preservation to fuel a Feruchemical power Therefore: Preservation's power can fuel F-Gold healing, even if Allomancy cannot Conclusion - The healing wasn't any single effect of any single Metallic Art Edited July 8, 2022 by Treamayne 1
Duxredux he/him Posted July 11, 2022 Posted July 11, 2022 @Treamayne, I see the logic, but that doesn't play out for other circumstances of people directly fueled by Preservation. If that was what was happening we should see compounded F-Gold level healing in each case, but we don't. 1. Vin's broken bones healed in an instant as she draws upon the Mists in the process of Ascending. Notably her broken leg was not healed when drawing on the Mists to defeat TLR, prior to her attunement at the Well of Ascension. 2. As a benchmark for F-Gold, TLR could casually walk around with three spears stuck in him and was reported to survive beheadings and immolation. 3. Elend, fueled by Vin as Preservation, killed by an obsidian axe blow first to the chest and then the neck. Vin's case in particular makes me think it is something to do with the level of power drawn in while Ascending, otherwise the level of healing available from F-Gold probably should have kept Elend alive. Alternately Vin was simply too inexperienced and was just giving Elend general power without focusing on augmented healing similar to (Elantris spoiler) Spoiler Raoden not being specific enough with the targeting of his healing Aons to save Roial. I could believe that with practice Vin could have figured out how to focus her power into healing with F-Gold, but I'd expect you would need to be drawing on a huge amount of health at the moment of impact to survive decapitation just through sheer speed of healing. Sazed was able to restore Elend and Vin's bodies after their deaths, though I don't know if it's been confirmed if they could have been resurrected, but Sazed certainly thought they could.
Treamayne Posted July 11, 2022 Posted July 11, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Duxredux said: @Treamayne, I see the logic, but that doesn't play out for other circumstances of people directly fueled by Preservation. If that was what was happening we should see compounded F-Gold level healing in each case, but we don't. 1. Vin's broken bones healed in an instant as she draws upon the Mists in the process of Ascending. Notably her broken leg was not healed when drawing on the Mists to defeat TLR, prior to her attunement at the Well of Ascension. At both previous times, when drawing on the Mists, Vin was already attempting an Allomantic action; then used the mists to fuel that action. In the HoA Climax, when she first draws the mists (and starts ascending), she is thinking only of the pain and how she is too hurt to defend herself or fight back. IOW: consciously or not, she showed the intent to heal, so the Power of Preservation acted on that Intent. 1 hour ago, Duxredux said: 2. As a benchmark for F-Gold, TLR could casually walk around with three spears stuck in him and was reported to survive beheadings and immolation. Don't forget, part of Rashek's "healings" were an exaggeration by the Steel Ministry. See WoP: Spoiler Arabas The question is about the Lord Ruler's death. He is basically killed because Vin was able to remove his Feruchemy storage bracelets thus depriving him of his stored youth and strength correct? Once he didn't have access to these she could simply kill him like a normal man. Now on page 627 (Ch 38) about the 3rd paragraph down the Lord Ruler states " I've survived burning and beheadings. I've been stabbed and sliced, crushed and dismembered." (I also think this is also reference somewhere else in the book that I could not locate)If all it took to drain the Lord Ruler of his power was to remove access to his Feruchemy items wouldn't he have died if he was dismembered? Remove the storage devices from the trunk of the body and he would die? Peter Ahlstrom I asked Brandon about this once, and I'm pretty sure he said the beheading survival part was a lie/exaggeration. I'd have to go back and check my notes. The Lord Ruler would have reason to want people to believe he had survived beheadings and being burned to ash. Now, we did see Miles survive having his head mostly shot off, so it is likely the "exaggerations" were for anything that would have disconnected his goldmine from himself (dismemberment, immolation, etc.) 1 hour ago, Duxredux said: 3. Elend, fueled by Vin as Preservation, killed by an obsidian axe blow first to the chest and then the neck. Vin was specifically fueling Eland's Allomancy with preservation - a very different thing than accessing the power of Preservation itself. HoA Ch 81: Spoiler Elend’s pewter ran out. “You cannot beat me, Elend Venture,” Marsh said in a voice like gravel. “We’ve killed your wife. I will kill you.” Vin. Elend didn’t believe it. Vin will come, he thought. She’ll save us. Faith. It was a strange thing to feel at that moment. Marsh swung. Pewter and iron suddenly flared to life within Elend. He didn’t have time to think about the oddity; he simply reacted, Pulling on his sword, which lay stuck into the ground a distance away. It flipped through the air and he caught it, swinging with a too-quick motion, blocking Marsh’s axe. Elend’s body seemed to pulse, powerful and vast. * * * Kelsier reached the top of a hill and stopped. On another hill beyond, distant but close enough to make out, Elend Venture stood among a pile of corpses, clashing with Marsh. Vin hovered above, expansive and incredible, a figure of glowing light and awesome power—like an inspiration for the sun and clouds. Elend Venture raised his hand, and then exploded with light. * * * “No!” Kelsier screamed. “No!” He stumbled down the hillside, running for Venture. He climbed over corpses, shadowy on this side, and scrambled toward where Elend had died. He hadn’t reached the position yet when Marsh took off Elend’s head. Oh, Vin. I’m sorry. Vin’s full attention coursed around the fallen man. Kelsier pulled to a stop, numb. She would rage. She would lose control. She would... Rise in glory? * * * The axe took off Elend’s head. Ruin raged and thrashed about, enraged and destructive. Vin only sat quietly, watching Elend’s headless body slump back into the pile of blue corpses. How do you like that! Ruin screamed. I killed him! I Ruined everything you love! I took it from you! Vin floated above Elend’s body, looking down. She reached out with incorporeal fingers, touching his head, remembering how it had felt to use her power to fuel his Allomancy. She didn’t know what she had done. Something akin to what Ruin did when it controlled the koloss, perhaps. Only opposite. Liberating. Serene. 1 hour ago, Duxredux said: Vin's case in particular makes me think it is something to do with the level of power drawn in while Ascending, otherwise the level of healing available from F-Gold probably should have kept Elend alive. Oh, I agree it absolutely was tied to her process of Ascension. I was only trying to point out that the healing didn't have to be an Allomantic effect since she could have drawn on any power that Preservation could fuel - and Preservation's power can fuel F-Gold. 1 hour ago, Duxredux said: I could believe that with practice Vin could have figured out how to focus her power into healing with F-Gold, but I'd expect you would need to be drawing on a huge amount of health at the moment of impact to survive decapitation just through sheer speed of healing. Sazed was able to restore Elend and Vin's bodies after their deaths, though I don't know if it's been confirmed if they could have been resurrected, but Sazed certainly thought they could. Part of it is probably the quantity of stored healing, but part of it is also familiarity with the powers (and likely the path to Savantism). M:tFE References Spoiler Ch 15 Quote “She is badly wounded,” Sazed said, stepping quickly into the room, his fine robes streaming with rainwater. “Master Hammond, I require some pewter. Her supply is exhausted, I think.” Ham rushed forward as Sazed set Vin on the kitchen table. Her skin was clammy and pale, her thin frame soaked and wet. She’s so small, Kelsier thought. Barely more than a child. How could I have thought to take her with me? She bore a massive, bloody wound in her side. Sazed set something aside—a large book he’d been carrying in his arms beneath Vin—and accepted a vial from Hammond, then bent down and poured the liquid down the unconscious girl’s throat. The room fell silent, the sound of pounding rain coming through the still open door. Vin’s face flushed slightly with color, and her breathing seemed to steady. To Kelsier’s Allomantic bronze senses, she began to pulse softly with a rhythm not unlike a second heartbeat. “Ah, good,” Sazed said, undoing Vin’s makeshift bandage. “I feared that her body was too unfamiliar with Allomancy to burn metals unconsciously. There is hope for her, I think. Ch 20 Quote “Marsh?” Vin asked. “How did you know I was Mistborn? I only knew how to Soothe back then.” Marsh shook his head. “You knew the other metals instinctively. You were burning pewter and tin that day—just a tiny bit, barely noticeable. You probably got the metals from water and dining utensils. Did you ever wonder why you survived when so many others died?” Vin paused. I did live through a lot of beatings. A lot of days with no food, nights spent in alleys during rain or ashfalls… Marsh nodded. “Very few people, even Mistborn, are so attuned to Allomancy that they burn metals instinctively. That’s what interested me in you—that’s why I kept track of you and told Dockson where to find you. WoB on Savantism: Spoiler Questioner There are Allomantic savants, are there Feruchemical savants? Brandon Sanderson Much harder to do. My feeling on Feruchemical savants was because it was your own power in the first place, you can't steep in it so much in the way. But, if you can get someone else's power or if you are fueling your Feruchemy another way, you would become one. So, the Lord Ruler is a good example. Questioner Was Miles a... Brandon Sanderson Yeah. Miles would be the same sort of thing. Questioner Is that why he didn't die as quickly in the execution? Brandon Sanderson Yes. So, Miles' savantism was likely a part of how his body could instinctively tap gold to heal the headshot. Edited July 11, 2022 by Treamayne Formatting
cometaryorbit Posted July 12, 2022 Posted July 12, 2022 I agree Preservation's power could fuel F-Gold (I believe there's a WoB that either Preservation or Ruin could technically fuel any of the Metallic Arts). But until Vin vanishes/ascends I think she is still using Allomancy -- super fueled by the Mists but limited to the specific powers of Allomancy -- rather than the broader Shardic power of Preservation. As the full Shard she could probably have done more for Elend if she'd known what she was doing. But Elend's Duralumin Atium burn showed him how his death would lead to Ruin's defeat, so maybe he could have saved himself even with the powers he did have. -- With the crazy degree to which her Allomancy is being boosted she doesn't need f-Gold imo. When Vin does a Duralumin Steelpush/Ironpull it's mentioned that she uses Pewter to survive the force on her body- well, when she exploded Kredik Shaw with super charged Steel, she must have been using equally super charged Pewter. Normally a-Pewter healing works on "accelerated medical recovery" timelines not "heal during a fight" timelines- but once you go from something like x2 healing speed to something like x2000...
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