Awakening forgery AonDor or Dakhor

[Adonlasium]

Choose

[EmulatonStromenkiin]

why? I did, but why?

Edit: Nvm, I read the question.

Edited May 3, 2022 by EmulatonStromenkiin

[cometaryorbit]

Powerful in what situation?

AonDor is a very strong and broad set of powers, but it's location limited. Awakening is narrower but you can take Breaths with you anywhere.

So if you're in Arelon AonDor is stronger, for a worldhopper or for living on another planet Awakening is stronger.

[Returned]

I've always liked Awakening just because of the passive effects of the Breaths you hold. Awakening itself seems like it could be hard to use effectively in many situations, but it still gives some nice options as long as you're practiced and creative.

[SwordNimiForPresident]

Aon Dor is the strongest magic system in the Cosmere so far. A programmable magic system is limited only by imagination. The only thing that might be able to knock it off it's throne is Microkinesis, which has not been explored in the canon as of yet.

[Tamriel Wolfsbaine]

23 hours ago, Returned said:

I've always liked Awakening just because of the passive effects of the Breaths you hold. Awakening itself seems like it could be hard to use effectively in many situations, but it still gives some nice options as long as you're practiced and creative.

I totally agree.  The passive effects are so good from awakening and once you hit God King level heightenings it is absolute brilliance.  The only downsides to awakening, in my opinion, are the aura and the fact that you are so vulnerable to the one shot.  

I do wonder how quickly the cloak is capable of reacting for the command "protect me".  Catching an arrow mid air is pretty impressive for defensive capabilities. 

I have recently seen it theorized that a returned could potentially heal rather quickly based on how they view themselves.  If that were to ever play out it could be a big game changer in some vs battles... 

[cometaryorbit]

5 hours ago, SwordNimiForPresident said:

Aon Dor is the strongest magic system in the Cosmere so far. A programmable magic system is limited only by imagination.

Except for its regional limitation. It's super powerful in Arelon, but for a worldhopper who wants to live somewhere else or keep traveling, not so much. The Ire in Secret History don't use AonDor, only magi-tech devices.

[SwordNimiForPresident]

17 hours ago, cometaryorbit said:

Except for its regional limitation. It's super powerful in Arelon, but for a worldhopper who wants to live somewhere else or keep traveling, not so much. The Ire in Secret History don't use AonDor, only magi-tech devices.

I imagine they don't use Aon Dor because they are in the Cognitive realm. Given the machanics of Aon Dor, I don't see how it could function anywhere but the Physical. They do seem to be drawing the Dor to their fortress on the edge of the Scadrian CR, which makes me think that setting up a satellite Aon Rao on other worlds is probably possible. It also seems possible that accessing the Dor from other places (at least on Sel) might simply be a matter of finding the right base Aon for the geographic region. We've barely scratched the surface of Aon Dor on page, so I'll have to wait for more books to find out.

[cometaryorbit]

On 5/5/2022 at 9:51 AM, SwordNimiForPresident said:

I imagine they don't use Aon Dor because they are in the Cognitive realm. Given the machanics of Aon Dor, I don't see how it could function anywhere but the Physical.

Hmm, that is also possible since the Dor is in the Cognitive...

 

On 5/5/2022 at 9:51 AM, SwordNimiForPresident said:

They do seem to be drawing the Dor to their fortress on the edge of the Scadrian CR, which makes me think that setting up a satellite Aon Rao on other worlds is probably possible. It also seems possible that accessing the Dor from other places (at least on Sel) might simply be a matter of finding the right base Aon for the geographic region. We've barely scratched the surface of Aon Dor on page, so I'll have to wait for more books to find out.

They clearly have a big pipe of Dor power, but they don't seem to use it for anything except sustaining themselves (their longevity/immortality? Elantrian status? Something like that) - not for overt magical effects.

Even if that method could allow full AonDor access, that's still a big limit for a worldhopper compared to Zahel/Vasher or Hoid just carrying Breaths with them, or Hoid being able to use local Rosharan metal to fuel his Allomancy.

I am not sure if you could use AonDor with non-Arelon-based symbols; each Selish magic having different effects makes me tend to think not, but if that's the case, Sel would really be left out in the space era cosmere.

[SwordNimiForPresident]

1 hour ago, cometaryorbit said:

They clearly have a big pipe of Dor power, but they don't seem to use it for anything except sustaining themselves (their longevity/immortality? Elantrian status? Something like that) - not for overt magical effects.

I would guess that they used it in the construction of their fortess, as well as in the making of the Connection orb that Kelsier used to take Preservation. I don't have the text on me at the moment but I think they were also using something on themselves at camp that was implied to sustain them in some way. Presumably that was also produced via the Dor beam.

1 hour ago, cometaryorbit said:

Even if that method could allow full AonDor access, that's still a big limit for a worldhopper compared to Zahel/Vasher or Hoid just carrying Breaths with them, or Hoid being able to use local Rosharan metal to fuel his Allomancy.

Fully agree. Selish magic seems to be the biggest pain the ass for potential world hoppers.

1 hour ago, cometaryorbit said:

I am not sure if you could use AonDor with non-Arelon-based symbols; each Selish magic having different effects makes me tend to think not, but if that's the case, Sel would really be left out in the space era cosmere.

This is what leads me to believe that Sel's various systems can work off world, just not in the same way or not as well as they do on Sel. We simply haven't seen it yet.

 

I'll just add that of all the magic systems out there, Aon Dor seems to be the only one that cannot be acquired at will. This makes it far more valuable in my opinion. Having it would give you a leg up in potentially acquiring other abilities, where having other abilities would not help you get Aon Dor. I also think that this makes it safe for Aon Dor to be extremely overpowered compared to other magic systems, as the maximum number of people using it is very limited.

Edited May 17, 2022 by SwordNimiForPresident

[cometaryorbit]

5 minutes ago, SwordNimiForPresident said:

I would guess that they used it in the construction of their fortess, as well as in the making of the Connection orb that Kelsier used to take Preservation. I don't have the text on me at the moment but I think they were also using something on themselves at camp that was implied to sustain them in some way.

It's at least implied the fortress was built by using the Cognitive aspects of stones and bringing them into reality in the Cognitive, the way Kelsier gets his staff, logs/campfire etc. - though I suppose that could be Kelsiers incorrect assumption.

The Dor pipe seems to be used to keep the stones from "decaying" the way Kelsier's campfire does, however.

They are definitely sustaining themselves somehow by drinking liquid Dor, yeah. My point is that it seems to be used only to sustain the Ire and their fortress- not to power any Aons or other overt, non-technological magic. (The Connection orb might be ultimately powered by, or distilled from, the Dor pipe - but it doesn't look like AonDor.)