Shades and there intent

[PewterKrogan]

Ok... So I am beginning to think the shades of Hel react to the 3 things they do because they symbolize Odium? 1. The starting of a fire being "passion" ignited. 2. The running being Ambition trying to escape Odium. 3. And the shedding of blood being Odium shaving off parts of Ambitions power. And that chunk of Ambition remembering what happened to it and leaving that intent in the shades? This probably seems like a stretch but what do you think?

[Thaidakar the Ghostblood]

I don't think so. They are I think because there is an open perpendicularity that spans a huge amount of threnody and that the shades are actually cognitive shadows that are on threnody, what if the area around threnody is a litteral merging of the cognitive and the physical realms.

[PewterKrogan]

So if a large amount of Threnody is ambitions perpendicularity and the shades are passing through it couldn't they be picking up part of Ambitions intent as they pass through it? Or being driven by the intent because two realms are merged or overlapping is such a unique way?

10 minutes ago, Thaidakar the Ghostblood said:

I don't think so. They are I think because there is an open perpendicularity that spans a huge amount of threnody and that the shades are actually cognitive shadows that are on threnody, what if the area around threnody is a litteral merging of the cognitive and the physical realms.

 

[Thaidakar the Ghostblood]

YES 

13 minutes ago, PewterKrogan said:

So if a large amount of Threnody is ambitions perpendicularity and the shades are passing through it couldn't they be picking up part of Ambitions intent as they pass through it? Or being driven by the intent because two realms are merged or overlapping is such a unique way?

 

I really think that is it. ye.

[PewterKrogan]

Ok so it could be what I was saying, just in a more direct way.

[Elegy]

4 hours ago, Thaidakar the Ghostblood said:

I don't think so. They are I think because there is an open perpendicularity that spans a huge amount of threnody and that the shades are actually cognitive shadows that are on threnody, what if the area around threnody is a litteral merging of the cognitive and the physical realms.

As per the Threnody essay in Arcanum Unbounded, there is no stable perpendicularity on Threnody, so that can't be it

Edited January 29, 2022 by Elegy

[Thaidakar the Ghostblood]

23 minutes ago, Elegy said:

As per the Threnody essay in Arcanum Unbounded, there is no stable perpendicularity on Threnody, so that can't be it

hmmm, no STABLE one but you can still travel there. what if each time a shade is created a perpendicularity is formed.

[Kandrafish]

55 minutes ago, Thaidakar the Ghostblood said:

hmmm, no STABLE one but you can still travel there. what if each time a shade is created a perpendicularity is formed.

I agree. I thought the same thing after reading the essay. That the shades are cognitive shadows, so their formation could cause a perpendicularity. Also, it was mainly because there was this undertone that the perpendicularities were dangerous and shades are one of the most dangerous thing on Threnody. (Not including the Evil, but that, I think, is Fainlife. Someone wrote a theory on it in 2017. And if you consider that Uli Da was Fain, it makes sense.) 

 

This could be nothing, but I also, I often wonder if the shades embody the opposite of Ambition:

--- you need to walk and not run --- you need to use the same old fires and not go making any new ones --- you cannot go around killing anyone 

In other words ambition is dead on Threnody because Ambition is dead on Threnody. --Kind of poetic, but without any overly logical explanation. All I have is that "the waves of destruction—carrying ripped-off chunks of Ambition’s power—twisted both the people and the planet of Threnody." And then all I can think is "Ambition's power... twisted". 

 

One more idea: If the Evil is Fainlife, that could be Ambition or Uli Da's army. And then, the shades could be the army against Ambition, which could explain their intent...

Shades are the the enemy of Ambition.

Any thoughts?

[Thaidakar the Ghostblood]

2 minutes ago, Kandrafish said:

I agree. I thought the same thing after reading the essay. That the shades are cognitive shadows, so their formation could cause a perpendicularity. Also, it was mainly because there was this undertone that the perpendicularities were dangerous and shades are one of the most dangerous thing on Threnody. (Not including the Evil, but that, I think, is Fainlife. Someone wrote a theory on it in 2017. And if you consider that Uli Da was Fain, it makes sense.) 

 

This could be nothing, but I also, I often wonder if the shades embody the opposite of Ambition:

--- you need to walk and not run --- you need to use the same old fires and not go making any new ones --- you cannot go around killing anyone 

In other words ambition is dead on Threnody because Ambition is dead on Threnody. --Kind of poetic, but without any overly logical explanation. All I have is that "the waves of destruction—carrying ripped-off chunks of Ambition’s power—twisted both the people and the planet of Threnody." And then all I can think is "Ambition's power... twisted". 

 

One more idea: If the Evil is Fainlife, that could be Ambition or Uli Da's army. And then, the shades could be the army against Ambition, which could explain their intent...

Shades are the the enemy of Ambition.

Any thoughts?

I like that, I REALLY like that. Uli Da's army.... HMMMM. that could be interesting. that makes sense. what if the shades are MERCY's army and Odium's army were the Rosharan humans.

[Kandrafish]

3 minutes ago, Thaidakar the Ghostblood said:

I like that, I REALLY like that. Uli Da's army.... HMMMM. that could be interesting. that makes sense. what if the shades are MERCY's army and Odium's army were the Rosharan humans.

Thanks!

I like how it fits too. I think The Shadows of Silence takes place before Stormlight.

I also worry about some kinks in the idea. --Shades aren't very merciful. --Would creating them cause a shard to be invested 

I wonder... Could they use Ambition's own power against them? Are Shades bits of Ambition's power Unmade into an enemy of Ambition?

 

On a separate note...

Also, risking going way off topic: do you think that after "Ambition" was "fatally wounded" someone in the vicinity might take mercy on them and let them abandon their shard. I've been toying with this theory for over a year now (I don't think anyone else has talked about it).

Could Mercy have spared Uli Da while splintering Ambition?

I think it is in line with Mercy's intent and a logical guess with the minimal information that we have.

[Thaidakar the Ghostblood]

2 minutes ago, Kandrafish said:

Thanks!

I like how it fits too. I think The Shadows of Silence takes place before Stormlight.

I also worry about some kinks in the idea. --Shades aren't very merciful. --Would creating them cause a shard to be invested 

I wonder... Could they use Ambition's own power against them? Are Shades bits of Ambition's power Unmade into an enemy of Ambition?

 

On a separate note...

Also, risking going way off topic: do you think that after "Ambition" was "fatally wounded" someone in the vicinity might take mercy on them and let them abandon their shard. I've been toying with this theory for over a year now (I don't think anyone else has talked about it).

Could Mercy have spared Uli Da while splintering Ambition?

I think it is in line with Mercy's intent and a logical guess with the minimal information that we have.

ooooo I like that

That would fit with Mercy a lot with what we know about them.

Except I have been wondering, where is Mercy?

Where would mercy be right now? would mercy still be on Threnody? no I do not think they would still be there.

So where are they? well I think they are preparing to attack someone. Harmony has said that Mercy worries them.

I first thought that Mercy was Trell but then I realized how would Harmony have contacted them? 

I think Mercy is on their own planet by now. Preparing. Watching. Waiting.

Also I think that the Survival shard may be Mercy possibly.

Aswell I always thought SSFH was after stormlight but still before space age.

[Kandrafish]

2 minutes ago, Thaidakar the Ghostblood said:

Aswell I always thought SSFH was after stormlight but still before space age.

I thought so too, but I google a timeline and every one of the timelines said that Stormlight comes after Shadow of Silence in the Forest of Hell.

[Thaidakar the Ghostblood]

1 minute ago, Kandrafish said:

I thought so too, but I google a timeline and every one of the timelines said that Stormlight comes after Shadow of Silence in the Forest of Hell.

interesting, would then the dust brigade, threnody book planned, would be either be 50 years before shadows for silence or it would be hundreds of years after shadows for silence.

[Kandrafish]

2 minutes ago, Thaidakar the Ghostblood said:

interesting, would then the dust brigade, threnody book planned, would be either be 50 years before shadows for silence or it would be hundreds of years after shadows for silence.

I have no idea. I'm hearing about it for the first time. The Coppermind says "late cosmere".

"One of the reasons Brandon wants to write this book is because there is "a group" that will be important later in the cosmere saga, and he needs to write a book about them so that readers know who they are." From the Coppermind on Dust Brigade."- From Coppermind

The "group" has to be Sho Del, right?

[Thaidakar the Ghostblood]

Just now, Kandrafish said:

I have no idea. I'm hearing about it for the first time. The Coppermind says "late cosmere".

"One of the reasons Brandon wants to write this book is because there is "a group" that will be important later in the cosmere saga, and he needs to write a book about them so that readers know who they are." From the Coppermind on Dust Brigade."- From Coppermind

The "group" has to be Sho Del, right?

yeah, that makes a LOT of sense, I think the sho del will have a big part in Era Four of mistborn.

[Kandrafish]

Oh, man... I need to create a new discussion to talk about if Kandra can eat fain food.

[Kandrafish]

It doesn't belong here, but I really want to see if anyone has opinions...

 

[Thaidakar the Ghostblood]

3 hours ago, Kandrafish said:

Oh, man... I need to create a new discussion to talk about if Kandra can eat fain food.

that sounds interesting, POST IT?

[Kandrafish]

Does that belong in Cosmere or Mistborn?

 

[Thaidakar the Ghostblood]

11 minutes ago, Kandrafish said:

Does that belong in Cosmere or Mistborn?

 

cosmere most likely

[AidenTollis]

6 hours ago, Elegy said:

As per the Threnody essay in Arcanum Unbounded, there is no stable perpendicularity on Threnody, so that can't be it

The essay also says that Ambition was splintered elsewhere.

Quote

Ambition would later be Splintered, though that final took take place in a different location

So the shades probably wouldn't be picking up any of the Intent?

Or maybe they are picking up Odiums Intent to kill Ambition? Idk

Spoiler

Spoiler

Edited January 30, 2022 by AidenTollis

[Benkinsky]

12 hours ago, Thaidakar the Ghostblood said:

I first thought that Mercy was Trell but then I realized how would Harmony have contacted them? 

yeah, and Trell can't be Mercy, it's a shard we knew at that point.

But yeah, Mercy can be scary. I think we're too nervous to assume something like "Mercy" has to be a positive force after seeing Preservation enjoy the Lord Ruler.

[EmulatonStromenkiin]

On 1/29/2022 at 4:00 PM, Thaidakar the Ghostblood said:

hmmm, no STABLE one but you can still travel there. what if each time a shade is created a perpendicularity is formed.

I'm pretty sure that it is said that the origin of the perpendicularity is rather morbid.

[Kandrafish]

14 hours ago, EmulatonStromenkiin said:

I'm pretty sure that it is said that the origin of the perpendicularity is rather morbid.

So... They open up a perpendicularity to the cognitive realm and pull energy from there because that is where Odium tried to hide the investiture that he broke off of Ambition... Making it similar to what he did with Dominion and Devotion, but on a much lower scale. This could explain the lack of full sentience among shades because it is only a small piece of the shard's power, it does not suffuse them enough in investiture.

[cometaryorbit]

There's one reference to something called the "Deepest Ones" as a larger threat than normal shades... maybe they have something to do with the temporary, morbid perpendicularities?