Trusk'our he/him Posted January 4, 2022 Posted January 4, 2022 During the time of the Final Empire, not all of the metals, or even all of the powers of the known metals, had been discovered yet. But now in Scadrial’s modern era such things have been discovered. So, would Marsh want to get his hands on these powers? For instance, if there was a Slider Misting who’s continued existence he. . . disagreed with, would he also be willing to use Hemalurgy to get their power as well? What about gaining access to other magic systems? Would he be bound to Scadrial like his brother, or like with Mistings and probably Ferrings, would he be free to leave? This WoB seems to say that Allomancy can be taken off world without too much difficulty, but what about Hemalurgy? Quote Questioner Would a Seeker burning bronze be able to tell what order of Knight Radiant someone is? Or what Surges they have access to? Brandon Sanderson Yes, but they'd have to be actively using it, right? So you could hear somebody -- for instance -- Lashing, but if you just saw somebody who'd drawn in Stormlight, you probably wouldn't be able to tell until they use that Stormlight, which it was. You'd be able to probably hear that they have the Stormlight. Questioner So the pulses are not unique to Scadrial's Investiture? Brandon Sanderson No they're not. You'd be able to do that. In fact there are other things in the cosmere that are kind of the same sort of "radar detection" here and there, that you can read in the same way. Bronze is just the one of the best... way to do it -- being a Seeker is really handy for these reasons. Being able to go off-planet with your Allomancy also is a pretty big advantage. It's really hard, for instance, to get a Surgebinder off of Roshar, because of the Connection stuff that's happening. In fact you may have heard in a prologue just recently someone complaining about that. In fact, there is a WoB that says that someone is going around the Cosmere and collecting magics via Hemalurgy. Could that be Marsh? Quote Questioner If Hemalurgy can be used to transfer Investiture regardless of the planet, is someone gathering pieces of different Investitures the way Hoid got, for example, the Lerasium bead? Brandon Sanderson Yes. So, I guess I've got a few questions here, really.
Quantus he/him Posted January 4, 2022 Posted January 4, 2022 14 hours ago, Trusk'our said: During the time of the Final Empire, not all of the metals, or even all of the powers of the known metals, had been discovered yet. But now in Scadrial’s modern era such things have been discovered. So, would Marsh want to get his hands on these powers? For instance, if there was a Slider Misting who’s continued existence he. . . disagreed with, would he also be willing to use Hemalurgy to get their power as well? What about gaining access to other magic systems? Would he be bound to Scadrial like his brother, or like with Mistings and probably Ferrings, would he be free to leave? This WoB seems to say that Allomancy can be taken off world without too much difficulty, but what about Hemalurgy? In fact, there is a WoB that says that someone is going around the Cosmere and collecting magics via Hemalurgy. Could that be Marsh? So, I guess I've got a few questions here, really. Hemalurgy can be used anywhere in the cosmere with any of the relevant metals from any source, so long as the user understand hemalurgy enough to have the proper Intent. Which makes it very interesting and dangerous once the culture clash happens. The only time we've seen Scadrian investiture bind a person to the planet, it was raw Preservation investiture that was sustaining a disembodied ghost. And once that ghost regained a body he didnt have the same issue (per wob). As for Marsh, I suspect he would not have anything against using a new spike, or in making one if the victim were somebody he'd be willing to kill anyway. His biggest issue I think would be that he already has way more Spikes than was typical for an Inquisitor (21 total) and the more you have the more unstable your Spiritweb becomes. Once upon a time he might have been possible to get full Mistborn or Feruchemist in a single spike (something TLR didnt want to happen) but you wouldnt find a viable Donor/victim anymore. He could always swap them out though. If I were him Id have gone looking for allomantic Gold a long time ago to gain the Compounding trick on healing.
Tamriel Wolfsbaine Posted January 4, 2022 Posted January 4, 2022 I have wondered how a lerasium spike would work. If it does steal all abilities from the person would it steal any hemalurgically gained abilities as well? Spiking a fullborn with one would be nice but could you make a fullborn from what is currently on scadrial via spikes and then use one spike to steal all of the abilities of that created fullborn? I feel like medallion tech and a few nicrosil metal born would offer a much more simple path towards potential fullborn power. Save the spikes for off world or creating constructs specifically. I am also a bit curious as to what all Marsh would need to be able to use it. Having access to a surge via an atium spike wouldn't necessarily grant that same person the ability to hold and use stormlight automatically. Would a nicrosil spike be needed to access the investiture so that you could use the surge? Or if you spike out one surge does it automatically open up the option to use stormlight? Can the ability to breath and use stormlight be spiked without taking the ability to use a surge? For that matter could a person capable of storing breath through feruchemy then store stormlight in their other metalmind and access it via the stolen investiture or would it only be accessed via a stolen surge?
cometaryorbit Posted January 4, 2022 Posted January 4, 2022 4 hours ago, Quantus said: Once upon a time he might have been possible to get full Mistborn or Feruchemist in a single spike (something TLR didnt want to happen) but you wouldnt find a viable Donor/victim anymore. He could always swap them out though. If I were him Id have gone looking for allomantic Gold a long time ago to gain the Compounding trick on healing. I don't think getting all the powers in one spike is possible; per the HoA epigraphs Ruin couldn't do it and that's why few Inquisitors had Duralumin. If Ruin didn't know how it's probably not possible with Hemalurgy. Maybe with Lerasium, which Ruin didn't have, but there's a WoB that seems to say that "steals all abilities" means human senses/strength/emotional strength/mental fortitude type things, not Allomantic/Feruchemical powers (or other Invested Arts). So I doubt even that. I'd imagine Marsh already has double Gold, Ruin was setting him up as a champion / super warrior / assassin, and we know he has over 20 spikes... there are a bunch that would be lower priority than super healing, especially given things like bendalloy, chromium, and nicrosil weren't available in Era 1. He could get the eight generally known Era 1 metals plus atium with eight spikes (since he started as a Seeker). Doubling bronze and the primary Allomantic combat metals, pewter, steel, iron... he's now at 12. Gold Feruchemy for healing... 13. He has an a-duralumin spike per epigraphs... 14. Probably electrum to protect him from enemy atium if he was out... 15. At that point you're out of combat useful allomantic powers, since bendalloy and chromium weren't available in Era 1. Throw in the best combat Feruchemy: pewter, steel, and probably iron to help with Pushes/Pulls ... 18. Give him Atium Feruchemy and Gold Allomancy for Compounding healing and youth for immortality, and that's 20. We know he has more than that, but I'm not sure what else would have been useful for Ruin or TLR to give him, given Era 1 available metals. Bronze Feruchemy for wakefulness, useful for being a relentless tracker, I guess? Brass Feruchemy for surviving extreme temperatures? *though a-Copper is probably kind of useless for an Inquisitor, everyone knows they are Allomancers and they aren't exactly subtle. I wonder if they even had it.
Quantus he/him Posted January 4, 2022 Posted January 4, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, cometaryorbit said: I don't think getting all the powers in one spike is possible; per the HoA epigraphs Ruin couldn't do it and that's why few Inquisitors had Duralumin. If Ruin didn't know how it's probably not possible with Hemalurgy. Maybe with Lerasium, which Ruin didn't have, but there's a WoB that seems to say that "steals all abilities" means human senses/strength/emotional strength/mental fortitude type things, not Allomantic/Feruchemical powers (or other Invested Arts). So I doubt even that. I'd imagine Marsh already has double Gold, Ruin was setting him up as a champion / super warrior / assassin, and we know he has over 20 spikes... there are a bunch that would be lower priority than super healing, especially given things like bendalloy, chromium, and nicrosil weren't available in Era 1. He could get the eight generally known Era 1 metals plus atium with eight spikes (since he started as a Seeker). Doubling bronze and the primary Allomantic combat metals, pewter, steel, iron... he's now at 12. Gold Feruchemy for healing... 13. He has an a-duralumin spike per epigraphs... 14. Probably electrum to protect him from enemy atium if he was out... 15. At that point you're out of combat useful allomantic powers, since bendalloy and chromium weren't available in Era 1. Throw in the best combat Feruchemy: pewter, steel, and probably iron to help with Pushes/Pulls ... 18. Give him Atium Feruchemy and Gold Allomancy for Compounding healing and youth for immortality, and that's 20. We know he has more than that, but I'm not sure what else would have been useful for Ruin or TLR to give him, given Era 1 available metals. Bronze Feruchemy for wakefulness, useful for being a relentless tracker, I guess? Brass Feruchemy for surviving extreme temperatures? *though a-Copper is probably kind of useless for an Inquisitor, everyone knows they are Allomancers and they aren't exactly subtle. I wonder if they even had it. My theory is that you should be able to steal being a full Mistborn by stealing the Connection with a Duralumin spike to Preservation that a Mistborn has (and lerasium creates), and Im then making an unconfirmed leap to assume the same would be possible with Feruchemy (even though we dont know how it's granted and whatnot). But the fact that Ruin apparently didnt know how it could be done is by far the best counter-argument Ive seen, thank you for that. Only thing I can think of that would still fit would be if Ruin did know how it could be done but didnt want the Inquisitors to have enough realmic knowledge to make the Connection method work. Edited January 4, 2022 by Quantus
cometaryorbit Posted January 5, 2022 Posted January 5, 2022 I am not convinced that being a Mistborn is due to stronger Connection to Preservation - Mistborn Secret History pretty strongly implies that Kelsier is not all that Connected to Preservation. I think being an Allomancer is instead a matter of having more Innate Investiture from Preservation than most people. Most have it from heredity ("Spiritual DNA") but Mist-snapping can add Investiture and thus Snap people who couldn't Snap normally (the "sliding scale of Allomantic potential" from the HoA annotations). And lerasium directly gives you more Preservation, like solid mist.
Kingsdaughter613 she/her Posted January 5, 2022 Posted January 5, 2022 On 1/3/2022 at 8:10 PM, Trusk'our said: During the time of the Final Empire, not all of the metals, or even all of the powers of the known metals, had been discovered yet. But now in Scadrial’s modern era such things have been discovered. So, would Marsh want to get his hands on these powers? For instance, if there was a Slider Misting who’s continued existence he. . . disagreed with, would he also be willing to use Hemalurgy to get their power as well? What about gaining access to other magic systems? Would he be bound to Scadrial like his brother, or like with Mistings and probably Ferrings, would he be free to leave? This WoB seems to say that Allomancy can be taken off world without too much difficulty, but what about Hemalurgy? In fact, there is a WoB that says that someone is going around the Cosmere and collecting magics via Hemalurgy. Could that be Marsh? So, I guess I've got a few questions here, really. I think you have the wrong brother. The person most likely to be doing this is Kelsier.
Trusk'our he/him Posted January 5, 2022 Author Posted January 5, 2022 2 hours ago, Kingsdaughter613 said: I think you have the wrong brother. The person most likely to be doing this is Kelsier. Suppose that's possibly true. Marsh always was the better brother, as it was said. But Kelsier still can't get off world currently, which limits my ability to believe that it's him doing it.
Kingsdaughter613 she/her Posted January 6, 2022 Posted January 6, 2022 (edited) 33 minutes ago, Trusk'our said: Suppose that's possibly true. Marsh always was the better brother, as it was said. But Kelsier still can't get off world currently, which limits my ability to believe that it's him doing it. ……………….. Ah. Um. Er. You haven’t read RoW yet, have you? Spoiler Kelsier is very good at getting other people to do things for him. Edited January 6, 2022 by Kingsdaughter613
Trusk'our he/him Posted January 6, 2022 Author Posted January 6, 2022 3 minutes ago, Kingsdaughter613 said: ……………….. Ah. Um. Er. You haven’t read RoW yet, have you? yeah, I have. Spoiler Kelsier canno't leave Scadrial. He's too Connected to it. That's why he wanted to have the Ghostbloods find the Herald Kalak for him, so he might be able to find a way to leave the world he's currently stuck on.
Kingsdaughter613 she/her Posted January 6, 2022 Posted January 6, 2022 6 hours ago, Trusk'our said: yeah, I have. Hide contents Kelsier canno't leave Scadrial. He's too Connected to it. That's why he wanted to have the Ghostbloods find the Herald Kalak for him, so he might be able to find a way to leave the world he's currently stuck on. Spoiler The GBs are likely collecting forms on Investiture for him; we know Mraize at least has quite the collections. Nothing says he has to do it personally.
Trusk'our he/him Posted January 6, 2022 Author Posted January 6, 2022 8 hours ago, Kingsdaughter613 said: Reveal hidden contents The GBs are likely collecting forms on Investiture for him; we know Mraize at least has quite the collections. Nothing says he has to do it personally. True, that could be the case. It would explain why he'd want them doing that type of stuff for him.
Trusk'our he/him Posted January 7, 2022 Author Posted January 7, 2022 On 1/3/2022 at 8:10 PM, Trusk'our said: Would he be bound to Scadrial like his brother, or like with Mistings and probably Ferrings, would he be free to leave? This WoB seems to say that Allomancy can be taken off world without too much difficulty, but what about Hemalurgy? I found this WoB that says that kandra can leave Scadrial. Quote Questioner Have we seen the worldhopping kandra on-screen in Oathbringer? Brandon Sanderson Yes, I believe you have. Ahhhh, yes, she gets around. Since kandra need Hemalurgic spikes to maintain sapience, I think it is safe to assume that someone pierced by Hemalurgic spikes can still worldhop, despite the spikes containing investiture. So I would also venture to guess that Marsh can worldhop too
Recommended Posts