Fabrials Of Other Investiture

[Sirscott13]

I was wondering if we could come up with some theories on how one could create fabrials or machines to harness investiture magics other than surges.

I read somewhere that there might be allomancy fabrials on the southern continent of Scadrial, but what could those be like?

Could one use a fabrial of magics on Sel without the need to be near the homeland?

What exactly makes a fabrial? And would awakened objects already count?

Could one use a fabrial device for FTL travel?

These are the questions I ask and more do I want to read. So share your thoughts fellow airsick lowlanders!

[Mestiv]

Elantrians have fabrials all over the city. The whole city is a fabrial I guess Got this from coppermind about AonTia:

 

 

There were a number of metal plates inscribed with this Aon scattered throughout Elantris. An Elantrian would only have to place their hand at the center of the Aon to be transported to another region of the city.

[Blaze1616]

I agree with Mestiv, AonDor should easily conform to fabrial "tech". I was actually a little surprised that the old Elantrians hadn't made flamethrowers when reading the book. Aon Ehe on a palm sized plate, to be activated in similar fashion to the Tia plates Mestiv quoted.

 

Edit: Or firearms. Aon Daa on a palm-plate should work too.

Edited February 12, 2015 by Blaze1616

[Sirscott13]

I forgot about those. You are right of course. I wonder if those plates would grow weaker if you took them away from Elantris.

[WeiryWriter]

This thread might interest you.

[Moogle]

Basically, the things Awakening makes are fabrials, so I don't know if you can do much there.

 

As to Allomancy, the trick seems to follow Rosharan fabrials. First is that you have to find some way to express Allomantic powers in the metal (equivalent of trapping a spren), then provide the metal with power (aka charging a gemstone, but charging the metal). Every other "fabrial" follows this design - Aons naturally designate their own power, and they draw power on their own. Commands designate the power in Awakening, and Breath is a natural battery.

 

The most well-accepted theory I know of at this point for Scadrial is that you can create them through Hemalurgy. The spiked bit of soul acts like the spren, and apparently you can charge metals with the mists through a process unknown to us (see: Weiry's link). Also possible is that you don't need Hemalurgy, but it's hard to know how you'd manage to control the fabrials (I want a Soothing fabrial that just gets rid of anger; how do I do it with just a lump of brass?).

 

The whole process is quite interesting and ripe for theories!

Edited February 12, 2015 by Moogle

[skaa]

Basically, the things Awakening makes are fabrials, so I don't know if you can do much there.

As to Allomancy, the trick seems to follow Rosharan fabrials. First is that you have to find some way to express Allomantic powers in the metal (equivalent of trapping a spren), then provide the metal with power (aka charging a gemstone, but charging the metal). Every other "fabrial" follows this design - Aons naturally designate their own power, and they draw power on their own. Commands designate the power in Awakening, and Breath is a natural battery.

The most well-accepted theory I know of at this point for Scadrial is that you can create them through Hemalurgy. The spiked bit of soul acts like the spren, and apparently you can charge metals with the mists through a process unknown to us (see: Weiry's link). Also possible is that you don't need Hemalurgy, but it's hard to know how you'd manage to control the fabrials (I want a Soothing fabrial that just gets rid of anger; how do I do it with just a lump of brass?).

The whole process is quite interesting and ripe for theories!

I don't think you need to "find some way to express Allomantic powers in the metal", because the molecular structure of the metal is its own "Aon". You just need to find a way to activate that power somehow without the need for an Allomancer. Maybe that would involve the mists, but we don't even know whether the mists even existed in Southern Scadrial.

My personal theory is that they used harmonium to activate the Allomantic power of metals. In my theoretical scenario, either Rashek discovered harmonium during his Ascension and decided to move all of Scadrial's harmonium deposits to Southern Scadrial, or maybe harmonium was easy enough to discover once a certain technological level is achieved, and the relatively advanced Southern Scadrians discovered it on their own.

Edited February 13, 2015 by skaa

[Moogle]

I don't think you need to "find some way to express Allomantic powers in the metal", because the molecular structure of the metal is its own "Aon". You just need to find a way to activate that power somehow without the need for an Allomancer. Maybe that would involve the mists, but we don't even know whether the mists even existed in Southern Scadrial.

 

I don't think this is how it works because of the Alloy Ars Arcanum.

Allomancy is the most common of the three. It is end-positive, according to my terminology, meaning that the practitioner draws in power from an external source. The body then filters it into various forms. (The actual outlet of the power is not chosen by the practitioner, but instead is hardwritten into their Spiritweb.) The key to drawing this power comes in the form of various types of metals, with specific compositions being required. Though the metal is consumed in the process, the power itself doesn’t actually come from the metal. The metal is a catalyst, you might say, that begins an Investiture and keeps it running.

 

Brandon has also suggested that Allomancy is how people (which suggests humans to me, though I recognize there are other interpretations here) interpret the use of the Metallic Arts:

Kaimipono (16 October 2008)

Allomancy is fueled by Preservation's body? How exactly does that work? And how does that interact with Atium—it's fueled by both gods' bodies?

Brandon Sanderson (17 October 2008)

The powers of Ruin and Preservation are Shards of Adonalsium, pieces of the power of creation itself. Allomancy, Hemalurgy, Feruchemy are manifestations of this power in mortal form, the ability to touch the powers of creation and use them. These metallic powers are how people's physical forms interpret the use of the Shard, though it's not the only possible way they could be interpreted or used. It's what the genetics and Realmatic interactions of Scadrial allow for, and has to do with the Spiritual, the Cognitive, and the Physical Realms.

(source)

 

Vin is able to use Allomancy via the mists, so clearly metals are not required. There's a link between specific metals and powers, but I don't know if we can say metals themselves and their molecular structure can signify a power on their own. There's a lot of unclear ground here to cover.

 

Finally, if metal was sufficient on its own, how would you distinguish between an Allomancy and a Feruchemy fabrial? Why does Allomancy get preferential treatment? Or are you suggesting that Feruchemy fabrials don't exist? I might be able to get behind that.

Edited February 13, 2015 by Moogle

[skaa]

I talked a little about this before, but you are drawing power from some source, and the metal is actually just a gateway. It’s actually the molecular structure of the metal… what’s going on there, the pattern, the resonance of that metal works in the same way as an Aon does in Elantris. It filters the power. So it is just a sign of “this is what power this energy is going to be shaped into and give you.” When you understand that, compounding [in Alloy of Law] makes much more sense.

Compounding is where you are able to kind of draw in more power than you should with feruchemy. What’s going on there is you’re actually charging a piece of metal, and then you are burning that metal as a feruchemical charge. What is happening is that the feruchemical charge overwrites the allomantic charge, and so you actually fuel feruchemy with allomancy, is what you are doing.

Source.

I'm sure you're quite aware of that WoB, Moogle, and I can understand if it didn't cross your mind earlier. I suppose I should've included it in my post above. Anyway, I have bolded the parts that answer your issues regarding the purpose of a metal's molecular structure in Allomancy and how Feruchemy can "override" this Allomantic purpose.

Edited February 13, 2015 by skaa

[Moogle]

I'm sure you're quite aware of that WoB, Moogle, and I can understand if it didn't cross your mind earlier. I suppose I should've included it in my post above. Anyway, I have bolded the parts that answer your issues regarding the purpose of a metal's molecular structure in Allomancy and how Feruchemy can "override" this Allomantic purpose.

 

I'm aware of the WoB, and it's at odds with the in-world fact that you can use the mists (and heck, any type of Investiture) to power Allomancy. No molecular structure there to power anything. I'd really prefer not to go too much off-topic here, but at this point canon (Ars Arcanum, Vin using the mists) says that the powers derive from the user's Spiritweb, not the molecular structure of the metal itself, and we've only really got WoBs saying otherwise. Canon will trump WoB for me at this point.

 

There's something more going on here with how the metals are linked and so you can only get one power from burning one type of metal, but saying that the metal is purely responsible for the power output definitely is not the case. I'm not entirely sure how to interpret the WoBs on Compounding. (I do have an alternate model for Compounding and Allomancy in general to explain all this, but this is not the thread to post it.)

 

I can see the argument for why you wouldn't need Hemalurgy for mistfabrials, but I think things are far too uncertain at this point to share a belief in it. Hopefully someone can post a grand unifying theory of Allomancy someday to make things make total sense to me.

 

Edit: I also note there's the Annotations, which again trump WoB for me since Brandon had time to sit down and expand on his thoughts without having to come up with an answer super fast when being asked questions:

First, to these forces, energy and mass are the same thing. So, their power can take physical shape—as Preservation’s did in the bead of metal Elend ate. Second, there is a bit of Preservation inside of all the people—and it’s this that allows the people to perform Allomancy. It needs to be awakened and stirred to be of use, but when it is, a proper metal can draw forth more of Preservation’s power. It’s like the metal attunes the bit within the person, allowing it to act as a catalyst to grab more power.

Allomancy is not fueled by metal; it is fueled by Preservation. The metal is the means by which a person can access that fuel, however. If there were another way to access it, then the metal wouldn’t be needed.

(source)

 

He is crystal clear that metal is not needed. From this, I conclude that the WoBs where he claims the metals are acting exactly like Aons are either misleading (and we have entirely new mechanics to learn about for why Allomancy works) or have since been made uncanon. It's possible Aons similarly access something in the user's Spiritweb, though, so I'm not quite ready to throw all those WoBs into the trash, but there is clearly something up and I'm pretty sure Allomancy is not simply "force Investiture through metal, obtain effect".

 

But I mean, if you want to keep the WoB you've got as canon, I would definitely be up for theories on how Elantrians can reproduce the effects of Aons without in fact drawing Aons just by drawing in Investiture. That would be the natural extension of that WoB and the fact that you can use Allomancy without metals. It sounds really interesting, actually - maybe I should make a thread on that myself. There's definitely several viable models here to work on. I should really reread White Sand...

Edited February 13, 2015 by Moogle

[skaa]

Here's my interpretation of those WoBs: When accessing Allomancy via metals, the molecular structure of the metals (or any overriding charge) determines the kind of power used. When accessing Allomancy via the mists, the mists provide what Elend called "phantom metals" (which I think are probably just different components of Preservation's mist form), and those are what determines the type of Allomantic power used.

I'd be very surprised if the Southern Scadrians don't use metals in their Metallurgic technology, so I'm just a bit confused why you seem to insist on waving metals away. Am I misunderstanding what you're trying to say, Moogle?

Edited February 13, 2015 by skaa

[Moogle]

Here's my interpretation of those WoBs: When accessing Allomancy via metals, the molecular structure of the metals (or any overriding charge) determines the kind of Allomantic power used. When accessing Allomancy via the mists, the mists provide what Elend called "phantom metals" (which I think are probably just different components of Preservation's mist form), and those are what determines the type of Allomantic power used.

 

I've had similar thoughts with the mists -> metals idea (we may want to move to the White Sand PM conversation if we're going in depth on this), but how can Breath power Allomancy then? Is Breath going to become "phantom metals" too? I have issues with that. At some point it seems like a ridiculous stretch, particularly when we have in-world people and the Annotations telling us "no there's literally parts on the Spiritweb which handle the interpretation of Investiture into certain powers, it's not the metals, those just handle getting you the Investiture".

 

Off-topic rambling model I've been thinking of:

Why the metals don't let you use any power and limit you to one per metal type is a very interesting mechanic, and not one I've seen explained to my satisfaction. Gemstones let you use Stormlight do whatever. Kaladin can use Gravity with non-sapphires/smokestone (though that's because he's taking in pure Stormlight, it's not really a direct analogue of Allomancy's metal burning... though, you should be getting pure Preservation when you burn metals if it's based on your Spiritweb).

 

I've got vague thoughts of each metal type's molecular signature attaching to/bending the bit of your Spiritweb associated with that power into position (essentially telling the soul "YOU, USE THIS POWER!" or else attaching to the bit of Spiritweb responsible for that power), and then the metal acts like a gateway for Preservation's Investiture (or perhaps more like a gemstone attracting Stormlight from a highstorm), only it's attached to/bent your soul on only one small place where one power can be used. (Based on this, I'd predict a sufficiently powerful Allomancer might be able to power many Allomantic abilities with one metal, because the Investiture he's flinging at this one part of his Spiritweb could leak to the rest of his body. I... suppose this sorta fits with Ascension.)

 

This fits with the Annotations, which say the metal "attunes" the bit of Preservation in you to get power. This would handle Compounding as well, with the metal's structure + Feruchemical charge just bending the part of your Spiritweb associated with that Feruchemical metal into position rather than the Allomantic part. When you use the mists, there's nothing forcing your Spiritweb to do anything, or there's nothing only providing power to a small portion of your Spiritweb so you can use any metal.

 

(I'm trying to turn this model into an explanation of why Mistings get only one power, but nothing immediately comes to mind. Something about the bits of your soul only responding to one type of metal? Eh.)

 

It might be most productive to just turn this discussion into a bunch of predictions and then ask Brandon. For example:

 

-With Breath alone and no metals, could an Allomancer power Allomancy? I would predict yes. I'm guessing you'd say no.

-With just a hunk of ordinary Allomantic-grade metal, some random Scadrian working on it, and a source of raw Investiture (mists, Breath, Stormlight), can we create an Allomantic effect? I would predict no (I mean unless you treat the metal somehow, say by using it to spike the Scadrian...), I am guessing you'd say yes.

 

I'd be very surprised if the Southern Scadrians don't use metals in their Metallurgic technology, so I'm just a bit confused why you seem to insist on waving metals away. Am I misunderstanding what you're trying to say, Moogle?

 

Metals seem important to the process as they are tied up with Preservation's Investiture (and they're also used in Hemalurgy), so yeah I'd guess that mistfabrials are going to use metals as a base (sort of like how different gemstone types can alter a fabrial's behavior, even if the spren is the real important part), but I'm not sure they're sufficient on their own is what I'm trying to argue. Adding some Hemalurgy seems reasonable to me for how you'd get them to work.

Edited February 13, 2015 by Moogle

[Caladcholg]

Im no good at long drawn out theories and I apologize for this, but Im going to throw out a couple ideas.  Though Im solidly in Moogle's camp on this.  I dont think metals are necessary, but act as a tool to tune investiture to a certain frequency/wavelength.  Measuring this wavelength is how Vin can pierce copperclouds.  Each metal modulates the Investiture to proper length to be used by the Allomancer/misting, but a powerful enough allomancer can alter the wavelength on their own.  So a fabrial has to have the proper converter(metal/gem/etc) to change the investure to the proper wavelength to produce the desired effect.

[skaa]

This is how I see it: the Spiritweb of an Allomancer contains an "interpreter" component that can convert various forms of Allomantic "code" into Shard-readable requests for power. The "code" can come from various "mediums", e.g., certain metals (in which the "code" exists as the molecular structure of those metals) or mist. Determining the Allomantic power produced relies on how the "interpreter" interprets the "code", whatever its "medium" may be.

In AonDor, the "interpreter" exists in the sDNA of the Elantrian, the "code" is the Aon, and the "medium" is whatever form the Aon takes (as a glowing drawing in the air, as an impression in metal, etc.).

As for "Breath-powered" Allomancy, I'm pretty sure Breath itself would act as the "interpreter", as it is the Nalthian equivalent of the Scadrian Spiritweb. I suppose the "code" might still be the molecular structure of Allomantic metals, which would activate upon being infused with Breath. There might even be a more Shardic alternative method to access Allomancy under the Breath Allomancy system, akin to mist-powered Allomancy. All this of course presupposes that the required tweaks have been made to the Breath so that the "interpreter" recognizes Allomantic "code", and this might be difficult since Breath doesn't like metal very much.

To go back to "Scadrian fabrials", I suggest that harmonium itself can become the "interpreter" in Allomancy.

At least, that's my current speculation. Pardon my use of programming terminology, but I feel this model of Allomancy at least allows us to reconcile all the WoBs that has been noted so far.

Edit: Come to think of it, the mists would not need to be interpreted because they are already part of the Shard powering Allomancy.

Edited February 13, 2015 by skaa

[Moogle]

This is how I see it: the Spiritweb of an Allomancer contains an "interpreter" component that can convert various forms of Allomantic "code" into Shard-readable requests for power. The "code" can come from various "mediums", e.g., certain metals (in which the "code" exists as the molecular structure of those metals) or mist. Determining the Allomantic power produced relies on how the "interpreter" interprets the "code", whatever its "medium" may be.

 

So to make sure I'm understanding you correctly: the interpreter interprets the code, which is to say the results of the code are not fixed? ie. You'd agree with me that a non-human who came to the ability to burn metals would not necessarily get the same Allomantic effect from burning a metal like this WoB suggests, because their body interprets the metal differently, much like a two compilers can output different machine code for the same code input?

 

If so, why do you think harmonium will necessarily interpret metals exactly like the human body? Or do you?

 

As for "Breath-powered" Allomancy, ...

 

Okay, Breath perhaps not the best example since it involves the Spiritweb. How would you fit Stormlight into this? Say a Mistborn gains an Honorblade, sucks in some Stormlight, and then wants to use it to power his Allomancy because he's all out of metals. Can he do this under your model? How would he set up his "interpreter"?

 

Edit: Come to think of it, the mists would not need to be interpreted because they are already part of the Shard powering Allomancy.

 

Okay, so you'd predict Mistings who gain the ability to take in the mists effectively become Mistborn? Would you predict Surgebinders can also use all ten Surges when they take in whatever Investiture is composed of both Honor and Cultivation, if it's not Stormlight?

Edited February 13, 2015 by Moogle

[IAmTheBeard]

It seems that the metal acts more as a conduit than as either an interpreter, per se, or a bit of code, or whatever. They essentially allow access to Investiture without direct contact (being in the mists, or whatever) but they "attune" the Investiture that they let through to one specific thing. In a way, they are a limiting factor, determining what you can do with the Investiture. And in another way, they are an empowering factor, as they give freer access to Investiture.

 

Also, metals compare to Commands, not directly to Breath. Breath is Investiture, while metal is not. And, similarly, the Command is a required element of the process, and it allows access to Investiture (because you can't transfer Breath without the Command, but even a bad Command will allow the transfer) but the Command itself isn't what does the interpreting. In that case, it appears to be something in the Cognitive Realm that does the translating, since it requires visualization. 

 

One could say that the bonds (or whatever that "missing element" of Rosharan Investiture is) also function this way. They allow access to Investiture and "attune" the Investiture received so that it is used for a specific pair of surges.

[skaa]

So to make sure I'm understanding you correctly: the interpreter interprets the code, which is to say the results of the code are not fixed?

 

Possible but not likely, I think. The Allomancy "interpreter" was created by Preservation when he gave Scadrians their Spiritweb, so unless sDNA could have random mutations like real DNA, the results should be consistent across all Allomancers. (It's like when you install the same Python interpreter on different machines; you'd expect all the machines to produce the same bytecode given the same Python code, unless something really bizarre happens to some of the machines.)

 

(Edit: I've almost forgotten about Mistings, whose Allomantic sDNA has weakened to the point that their Spiritweb can only recognize one type of metal; but their "interpreter" still converts that metal to the expected Allomantic power.)

 

 

If so, why do you think harmonium will necessarily interpret metals exactly like the human body? Or do you?

 

It would be interesting if Metallurgic technology produces different effects from the typical Metallic Arts, but I don't think they'd be too different. It all depends on what Brandon thinks would better fit the future stories. Anyway, my theoretical harmonium would be following rules set by the interactions between the Shards and the Shardworld, so whatever the produced effects are, they would probably be more or less similar to what we've seen so far.

 

 

How would you fit Stormlight into this? Say a Mistborn gains an Honorblade, sucks in some Stormlight, and then wants to use it to power his Allomancy because he's all out of metals. Can he do this under your model? How would he set up his "interpreter"?

 

Stormlight is akin to the mists, so the Stormlight-infused Mistborn would be accessing the power of the Surges directly. I've theorized before that infused Stormlight is transformed by spren (and Honorblades, I guess) into whatever Surges are associated with them. If the Mistborn's Spiritweb even recognizes Stormlight at all (which would involve some serious modifications), then it would recognize two wells of power depending on which Honorblade he is holding, and tapping those would lead to Surgebinding.

 

If he wanted to use Stormlight for Allomantic powers, he'd have to find/invent an Honorblade that can transform Stormlight into Allomantic powers, or find some sort of spren that could do that.

 

 

Okay, so you'd predict Mistings who gain the ability to take in the mists effectively become Mistborn?

 

Assuming Mistings could even tap the mists, then yes they'd become Mistborn as long as they've tapped enough of the mists to reach that level of closeness to Preservation necessary to become Mistborn. (And if they tap way more than that, they'd eventually Ascend.)

 

 

Would you predict Surgebinders can also use all ten Surges when they take in whatever Investiture is composed of both Honor and Cultivation, if it's not Stormlight?

 

I happen to think that Stormlight is the unified form of all the Surges. The only reason Surgebinders can only use two is because their spren/Honorblades transform the "Unified Surge" into two specific Surges. If they wanted access to all ten Surges, then they'd have to get multiple Honorblades, or attract multiple spren (which would be quite difficult).

 

 

It seems that the metal acts more as a conduit than as either an interpreter, per se, or a bit of code, or whatever. They essentially allow access to Investiture without direct contact (being in the mists, or whatever) but they "attune" the Investiture that they let through to one specific thing. In a way, they are a limiting factor, determining what you can do with the Investiture. And in another way, they are an empowering factor, as they give freer access to Investiture.

 

I don't think we disagree, but it seems you misunderstood me a bit. The interpreter is the Spiritweb, not the 16 metals. The "metal is code interpreted by the Spiritweb" analogy is, of course, just one way of looking at it. Another way of saying the same thing is to say that metal is attuned to a certain Intent, as determined by the Spiritweb. I've even theorized about Investiture resonance in metal before.

 

 

Also, metals compare to Commands, not directly to Breath. Breath is Investiture, while metal is not.

 

Again you misunderstood. I never compared metals to Breath. I compared the Spiritweb to Breath.

Edited February 14, 2015 by skaa

[Sirscott13]

I would assume breath is similar to stormlight and mists, in that they are all gaseous forms of a shard. I imagine endowment gave up part of its spirituality in order to give all mankind a breath similar to what preservation did to give all mankind more sentience.

[skaa]

I would assume breath is similar to stormlight and mists, in that they are all gaseous forms of a shard. I imagine endowment gave up part of its spirituality in order to give all mankind a breath similar to what preservation did to give all mankind more sentience.

They are similar in that they are all from Shards. Nalthian Breath and Scadrian Spiritweb are what we call Innate Investiture, the thing that a Shard gives to all the people he created, and that people generally pass down to their offspring. Rosharian Stormlight and the Scadrian mists, on the other hand, are not Innate, though they have the potential to modify the Innate Investiture of people (the same way radiation can mutate DNA).

Edited February 14, 2015 by skaa

[Sirscott13]

They are similar in that they are all from Shards. Nalthian Breath and Scadrian Spiritweb are what we call Innate Investiture, the thing that a Shard gives to all the people he created, and that people generally pass down to their offspring. Rosharian Stormlight and the Scadrian mists, on the other hand, are not Innate, though they have the potential to modify the Innate Investiture of people (the same way radiation can mutate DNA).

I only assume breath is also the gaseous form of endowment in the same way as the mists and stormlight because Vasher is able to use stormlight to feed his divine breath on Roshar

[Moogle]

I only assume breath is also the gaseous form of endowment in the same way as the mists and stormlight because Vasher is able to use stormlight to feed his divine breath on Roshar

 

You're correct, at least partially:

Q:  I know that there's three sorts of forms that magic presents itself in, the liquid and the solid and air. What would Breath be?

A:  Breath is definitely like Mist, it is in the form of the air.

Q:  And is Stormlight the same?

A:  Stormlight is the same. Good questions!

(source)

 

Breath just seems to also act like part of your soul. But then, your soul is Investiture anyways, so this shouldn't be too surprising.

Edited February 15, 2015 by Moogle

[skaa]

I only assume breath is also the gaseous form of endowment in the same way as the mists and stormlight because Vasher is able to use stormlight to feed his divine breath on Roshar

True. As I said, they are all Shardic in origin. They are all forms of "Investiture", or "the Power of Creation", as Brandon sometimes calls it, and are convertible into each other somehow. That still doesn't change the fact that while Stormlight can be converted to a Breath analogue that Returned can use to survive, Breath is still closer in nature to the Spiritweb. It's just that all these things (Stormlight, Breath, Spiritwebs, etc.) fall under a big category, with subcategories like "Innate Investiture", etc.

Edited February 15, 2015 by skaa

[Sirscott13]

Side thought, does that mean that a hemuralgic spike can steal breath?

[Voidus]

Side thought, does that mean that a hemuralgic spike can steal breath?

Hemalurgic spikes can steal nearly anything, although in this case it does go against the very essence of Endowments magic so it might not be able to but I still think it would.

[Ari]

Hemalurgic spikes can steal nearly anything, although in this case it does go against the very essence of Endowments magic so it might not be able to but I still think it would.

 

Really? I would think that at least at the very least it would be possible for someone to will breath into a Hemalurgic spike, if not actually drive it through an Awakener to steal their breaths. The nature of Endowment is to give away power. The nature of Ruin is to steal and decay power, setting it against other power. One would think that it would be easier to steal breaths than any other type of non-metallic investiture.