WitSpren

Wyndal did want to bond with an Iri Matron, but he was encouraged to bond with Lift. We don't know exactly how far the encouragement went. That said, I have serious doubts of choosing the Iri Matron over Lift, to become a KR would have been wise or a better choice. From what we have seen of Lift, she seems to be on the short track to be a pretty good choice. Since we have not seen the Iri matron, it is hard specifically to say that she would have been a worse choice. But on the surface it sounds worse. As far as the "Blood Weekness" goes lets look at several examples that we have. Kal was seeing and talking to Syl for a considerable time, and the other Slave Captives thought he was crazy. Later he was using Stormlight for a considerable time before he finally realized what he was doing. Lift also was talking to Wyndal in front of the other thieves and they thought she was crazy. Elhokar and Shallan when they started seeing Cryptics really behaved strange, and no one could understand why. Also look at Shallan's freekout when she hears the Voice asking strange things. Both Jasna and Shallan both "went to" Shadesmar & made it back. But we see this from their POV (in Shadesmar - Cognative Relm), but how can we say what it would have looked like in the Physical Relm. Prehaps it would have looked like a "Seazure" to someone that might have seen them. We know that Jasna 6 years later, later in her training, was able to control her Physical Relm appearance so that people did not notice her spiritual side-trips. Anyway, what I am getting at, is that with Renarin, we may just be seeing the Phisical Worlds manufestation of his initial "uncontrolled" visits to Shadesmar or maybe a better "controlled" response to the Voice that he could be hearing, that no one else hears. Or this could be a different result from him having a different "Surge.

Another thing that I think interferes with correct Shardplate/blade operation and new Spren development is that you need three things: 1. A user that is following a particular Ideal. 2. Shardplate that matches that Ideal (Windrunner etc.) 3. Shardblade that matches that Ideal. An Edgedancer with Windrunner Shardplate and Bondsmith Shardblade would have built in conflicts that would keep a new Spren from bonding.

This is along the line that I am thinking and posted a week or so ago in another thread. 1. It is the only thing that makes sense considering that the further you go back in time, the less technology they have. 2. It also goes along with the fact that when the KR gave up (Deserted) their Shardplate and Shardblades they stopped Glowing. The Sprens trapped within being betrayed (loosing their Link or Dying). I think that counts as two additional pieces of evidence.

That is what I thought as well. Adolin did not mention her in his POV except to say "Mother's pendant" or something like that.

This is the way that I see it. On the Amaram's part, I disagree. It sounded like he had already been convinced that him having the Shards was better for his people that Kal having it. He just appeared to be seeking final confirmation. That said, it is strange that he had not already "taken" posession of it. So you may be right and I may be wrong on that.

We know his Curse. And we know that he said it was a Great Shame to him. Just throwing out a half baked thought. What if the Shame was not going to the Nightwatcher or the (not completely) the loss of his wife memories. He has a thought in a recent chapter that about 10 years ago, he was nearly overcome by a desire to challenge his brother, because Galivier was the only one that he considered a real challenge for his skill. now obviously, this was not just in the contest of a friendly duel. He apparently considered overthrowing his brother. So maybe in a saner period, he resorted to the Old Magic (Nightwatcher) to force himself (Because he was loosing the internal battle of self control) to never cover his brothers throne.

Yes, & I did not notice until just a few minutes ago. It Was not anything big, Just telling everyone thanks for their input. Mostly on the lines that I was thinking. I mostly just started the thread to see if someone had seen a little tidbit that I had missed. BS is getting good at putting them in in such a way that they can be missed. Just overall, unless they still have some kind of power, I can see that they might be rare & expensive, but hardly rating a fortune. But that is mostly just me and my values.

Same here. He has always enjoyed the Thrill of the Dual. This time there was still a bit of Thrill, but no enjoyment.

Why would Kings pay fortunes for dead ones. Elhokar apparently has a dead one encased in crystal on his desk at the Shattered Plains. Just cruious if anyone has any ideas on it?

Also, once I had it - I would RUN FAR AND FAST so I would not have to take it back until I was done!!

OH I definately agree. Plus - If he was able to hold Stormlite that early, then when he got injured with his son and they took him to Kal's father. He should have been able to absorb the Stormlite from the spheres that they used for lighting and be healed bu the Stormlite. So I think that we can rule him out. - but it is very suspicious.

Thank you!! Any you correct, glow was even put in different script!!! So what is going to happen when Roshone comes to Kal for KR training? Wasn't there a back cover exert or something for WoR specifically saying that Kal was going to lead the new KR order or something like that? Or is Roshone already fully trained and on the other side - an agent for Odium?

Very interesting. But I don't remember where that was. Could you tell me where it was?

@Xavien, I quite agree with this part. Though it was stupid giving over their swords & plate over to just anybody. I do not see any information about how many Desolations occured after the Oathpack was broken and when the KR disbanded. Also not sure how much time was between them. I can see how some book characters might look at those events and be erroniously convinced that the Desolations were somehow caused bu the appearance of the Herolds and KRs. Kind of a chicken and egg circle.

OK, back to Lift. She is from Rall Elorim (Far North West) and some how traveled all the was from there to the Valley (South Middle). After she visited the Nightatcher (Wyndles "Our Mother") she sometime after that gets her Spren and starts "Manufesting". Following that she travels far north, past the Pure Lake, to Marabethia where she has a run in or maybe several, with Darkness. She escapes him and goes far south again to Azimir. Also, she has been using her talent/power "Friction" now for many weeks. Could be months, but that implies - less than a year. That is one hell of a lot of traveling for a solitary 13 year old.

OK. That explains the confusion I was viewing from the view of being Shallan's Shardblade. I see no reason to add another blade in the mix. It is surely possible, but see nothing to hang that hat on. My scenario also explains how she could acquire such a thing and why she would not have given it away to her father and/or brothers. Because she has been suppressing all these memories from the beginning 6 years ago. Guess we will just have to agree to disagree for at least another 2 weeks.

I understand what you mean. We have heard that her father was a tyrant & did not treat his family kindly, but the way I read the POV she clearly thinks that he should not hold and care for a Monster (her) after what she did. I have been wrong before, but I do not think so on this part of the scene. I also do not see how any Shardblade could be in the lockbox. They specifically go to mist unless "held" by the owner?

We do not have a lot to go on: Man Dead - Bloody Woman Dead - (He mother I think) with horrible eyes - most likely killed by Shardblade. Shellan considers herself to ba a "Monster" Also, there is a "Monster" in the strongbox - glowing light. I can think ot 2 senerios that might work for this. 1. After a hard day Soulcasting at the Mines, her exausted dad gives the Soulcaster to her & tells her to take it to his den or to the strongbox. When she enters the den, she sees this man (intruder) attacking her mother with a Shardblade & since she is holding the Soulcaster - she inadvertently activates it killing him very bloodily. His blade drops to the floor & she touches it - causing it to be "tuned" to her. Then she drops it & it disappears - as they do. She is screaming & shaking & crying - causes her father to come in & see (some of) what happened - & takes her away - telling her to forget those terriable things. or 2. Mostly the same, but she catches her mother & the man having an affair. Mostly same result except that when she picks up the sword (11 year old with a light 6' blade) she could have in-advertently "touched" her Mother - killing her. Add your additional plausable secerios.

Mister T - I can't decide if it is intentional or not - I wonder if he is the head of the Ghostbloods? Darkness - Seems to be working for Odium, but seems to think that by eliminating KR candidates that he is working to stop Desolutions. Has a strange reverence for the KR of old. He also has a strange sense of Justice. Added note - he seemed to be involved with Parshendi killing King Galiver and somehow with the assassin. Ghostbloods - Not enough infor on these to be sure, but my gut feeling is that they are Odium agents. Parshendi - Apparently thought that they would be preventing a Desolation/return of their God (Odium?) by having the king killed. Now they are considering persuing the Stormform. They seem to be significantly manipulated by Odium - even though they clearly were trying to avoid it. Adherents - seriously being manipulated by Odium. Have law/rule do not try to predict the future because it is of the Voidbringers. So just because Desolations have occured every few hundred years for Thousands and Thousands of years is no reason to use Voidbringing logic to the issue & try to predict when the next one will be. Let's also erase and rewrite history to make it even harder!

You talk as if you did not know that Sadeas is a coward. The Kolinars jump across chasms and establish a bridgeheads for their troops. Sadeas sends unarmed bridgemen and his army to secure plateau's before he joins. Delinar tells about how brave Sadeas was in the Old Days, but as we have seen, Sadeas is good at pulling the wool over Dalinar's eyes. Delinas could just be fooling himself, because he has has such shame about being drunk when his brother was assassinated. I think that if you need additional proof of this, just look at the war of unification and then add 6 years of fighting on the Shattered Plains and you will see that Sadeas still did not have a Shardblade. That is a really piss poor record. I have a little bit of a Sadistic hope of soon (in 2 weeks) hearing about Sadeas the Swordlessman, when he gets out on the Shattered Plains on his next run, in the middle of a heavy battle, when Delinar calls back the Shard blade that he only loaned Sadeas. I know that will not work because it would really screw up Delenar's KR path, but it would have a great "Paybacks a Bitch" factor.

Jasnah's Ivory seems to be well developed, I would think that Ivory would be far enough along to be able to tell her what kind of Spren he is. Surely! Jasna first visited Sharedmar 6 years ago. I think that her research would have led her to link up with her Ivory fairly quickly. Probably (I would guess) 6 months, but since that is a guess, let's say at most 2 years. That gives 4 years at least for Jasna and Ivory to develop. She should know by now what type of Spren she has by now. She seems very developed in her powers. Not sure how far along she is on the KR "Ideals" though. Can't wait for her to get to/talk to Daninar/Kal +++

Yes and no. In the WoR Chapter 4, (not exact words) Jasna says that there are two types of Spren. Honor Spren and Cryptics (Liespren) & then she goes on to say that Shallan needs to study her spren's development because no one has had the chance/done so for a Cryptic in written history. Well if Jasnah's spren is a Cryptic, I would not think that she would have said it like that as she would certianally have documented her Spren's (Ivory) development. Quote: "You are the only person in centuries to have the chance to interact with a Cryptic," Correct me if I am wrong, but that chapter sure seems to me to be saying that Jasna's Spren is an Honor Spren.

I am very concerned that Jasna says that her Spren is an Honor Spren, but Syl says that she is the only Honor Spren that came. This seems very suspicious. Also, it seems that all Cryptics are not Symbol heads. I need the book, so i can start figuring this out!!!