RShara

Most magic in the Cosmere is lcoated in the Spiritual Realm, where location and distance aren't important. So most magics can be accessed anywhere, so long as the user has the appropriate fuel. In this case, metal, which is present on all Cosmere planets. The metal isn't invested--it's just a key for the investiture to come through, so metal from anywhere would work, just like color from anywhere would work for Awakening.

55 minutes ago, Harrycrapper said:

This whole situation has always confused me, the facts that we know just don't form a complete picture. At first, I thought that maybe the Singers claim that Odium is the humans' god was because he followed them there. But then Syl at the end of OB seems to confirm that Odium is indeed their(referring to humans) god. There are a few possible questions that raises. Did Odium create these humans like Ruin and Preservation did(I think this unlikely, doesn't seem within the scope of his Shard's Intent)? Or were they refugees from Yolen that had been following him post Shattering and at some point defected? Technically, Odium is a piece of what was once every humans' god, maybe Syl was referencing Adonalsium? Were all of the humans on Ashyn "from" Odium or only a subset of them? 

Syl doesn't have firsthand knowledge of events before she was shaped, which was after Aharietiam. I don't know how much she knows/remembers from her early days either.

Odium definitely didn't create the humans on Ashyn, nor were they following him around. Remember that before he went to Ashyn, he went to Sel, and somewhere near-ish Threnody. And he doesn't like to Invest, and creating life would definitely involve Investing.

We don't know for sure where the humans on Ashyn originated. They could have been created by Adonalsium, or been refugees from Yolen, or who knows what.  But I really think Odium just came, influenced them long enough to get them to destroy themselves, and moved on to Roshar.

6 minutes ago, Anthony683 said:

Ye, when you said probably not, I thought you were saying there’s a chance that a non Radiant bond could have occurred prior to the first desolation. I was just trying to make sure my line of thinking wasn’t flawed. The recreance is weird, and the spren being the catalyst for everything is where my mind is right now.

Oh! Sorry, I misunderstood! I generally don't like to make concrete statements unless we know things for 100% sure. So it's most likely not surgebinding as we know it, but I've been wrong before, and Brandon might have something up his sleeve

11 minutes ago, Anthony683 said:

Probably not? I was asking because if the spren decided to bond with the humans, then the parshendi saw this as a betrayal by the spren and their gods, opening them up to odiums influence, then finding all this out would be a good excuse for the recreance. 
Thanks to the people answering my questions by the way. 

Why probably not? We know that the Nahel bond, and surgebinding as we know it, post-date the Heralds, and thus, must post-date the first Desolation(s). So the fact that the Elia references "surges" means that they had to have been using a different form of magic.

3 minutes ago, Anthony683 said:

I was asking specifically about Nahel bonds. I was wondering if bonding with the spren could have been the spark that set everything into motion. I remember the herald mimicry, but I was aware of the surges being used too. So I wondered if there were bonds, but not the radiant bonds which mimicked the heralds. 

They had some form of magic, which the ancient singers called "surges" but were probably not accessed the same way that Radiants accessed them.

28 minutes ago, GriffinMaze said:

 

That doesn't say that Surgebinding destroyed Ashyn. It says the Dawnshards destroyed Ashyn. Then an insane Honor said Surgebinders would destroy Roshar. Something he clearly never said before he was insane and they made it thousands of years without destroying Roshar. I don't understand how people get that mixed up with "Surgebinding destroyed Ashyn". It clearly doesn't say that

Ah, I see, I misunderstood what you meant. Right, Dawnshards destroyed Ashyn, but Radiants were afraid surgebinding would destroy Roshar, I think is what I'm trying to say. So while surgebinding wasn't relevant for Ashyn, that's where the fear of surgebinding destroying planets comes from.

It might mean some of what we're seeing now, and what Nale said and Notum hinted at--because Honor was dying/is dead, there'll be fewer limits on Radiant powers, and the lack of those limits heightens the potential for destruction.

3 hours ago, GriffinMaze said:

The answer is simple. Its because Honor was going insane. Every generation of KR knew that humans were the voidbringers originally and they destroyed Ashen (via the Dawnshards, I don't know why people always say it was because of surgebinding) But the one generation that put down their blades was when Honor was going crazy. As explicitly stated by the Stormfather

Because Honor said both.

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But in the days leading to the Recreance, Honor was dying. When that generation of knights learned the truth, Honor did not support them. He raved, speaking of the Dawnshards, ancient weapons used to destroy the Tranquiline Halls. Honor … promised that Surgebinders would do the same to Roshar.

Edit: I forgot to actually link the thread with my theory that the spren were willing participants in the Recreance.

I think the reasons for the Recreance were multifold--disillusionment of their "higher calling," the realization that they lobotomized an entire species, plus the promise from their God that they and their powers would destroy the planet, among others. I also wouldn't be surprised if it were their spren's idea in the first place.

12 hours ago, Karger said:

I can't find it either.    But consider.  Radiants of a third oath or higher must have broken oaths before at sometime during the several thousand year history.  They would have known about dead blades.  We know that they were not perfect.  One of them had to executed for fraternization with the enemy according to WoR.

 

This is probably the one you wanted

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Question

Can a Shardblade come back to life?

Brandon Sanderson

This is something that has never happened on Roshar yet. Now they didn't have many opportunities for it to happen in the past, because it was rare for a Radiant to break their oaths. It is not something that's happened and the spren think it's impossible.

Arcanum Unbounded Seattle signing (Dec. 1, 2016)

So when Cosmere healing takes place, it heals to the Spiritual Ideal. The Spiritual Ideal is affected by age. So even though the organ is the tip top shape it can be, the organ is still old and wearing out. So it just eventually stops working, because the Spiritual Ideal is also aged. So the organs still give out eventually. It takes longer because most damages are healed, but not quite all.

I think that if they have a healing started before they're hit, they could theoretically heal from it. Stormlight is more passive healing, and requires effort in order to heal a Shardblade wound, so I think the Radiant would have to be expecting the hit and forcing through the healing before the hit happens. I would guess gold-healing would be the same way.

5 hours ago, BoundbyOath said:

It is interesting that Adonal is very similar to Adonai, one of God's names.

Yep! That was Brandon's inspiration for the name. He's said one of the themes of the Cosmere is regular people given divine power.

https://wob.coppermind.net/adv_search/?query=adonai

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/83/#e7183

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Brandon Sanderson

Well if the philosopher in me steps aside, and the writer in me just wrote what the writer is passionate about. If the trained English major says-- One of the biggest fundamental tenets of Mormonism is deification of normal people, right? Mormonism believes that we are gods in embryo and we are here to learn and have experience so we will be better in the afterlife, and growing and we'll eventually-- Joseph Smith taught "What Man is God once Was, and what God is Man may Become" maybe not "will be" but "may become" That's what he said. And so if you look at my books there's a whole bunch of deification going on, right? That's like fundamental to the cosmere is "What do people do with the power of the gods when they're given it?" And I would say that's totally my upbringing that made me fascinated about that. Does that make sense?

 

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/3/#e100

5 minutes ago, yanjimac said:

Thanks for the reply!

Oh, really? That's interesting. Where does that info come from, particularly the post-shattering aspect?

I guess if I really wanted to shoehorn it into my theory then you could talk about Jesus' role as a 'jester' (provocateur) and most certainly a storyteller, but then the poisoning would have to be synonymous with the shattering, so it certainly doesn't seem neatly aligned.

It's from the unpublished Liar of Partinell excerpts. They used to be on Brandon's site, but were removed or got lost in one redesign or another.

Welcome to the Shard! Your theory is really nicely formed and well thought out. As of right now, however, Hoid's old master was the original Hoid. OG Hoid was a jesker, or a storyteller, and was poisoned prior to NG Hoid going off on most of his adventures. And happened before the Shattering. Technically, this isn't completely canon, so it could change. But that'd be a really big change in Hoid's origin story, and I don't get the sense that it would happen.

In the Traveler excerpt, it's heavily implied that Hoid wanted to Shatter Adonalsium in order to change the rules of the cosmere and find a way to bring someone back from the Beyond. https://wob.coppermind.net/events/332/#e9518

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"You will not find a way to restore what you have lost, old friend," the aged man said softly. "It is impossible." 

"You don't know that. The old rules no longer hold." The Traveler turned the pomegranate over in his fingers. "Besides, I've heard of a place… It doesn't matter. I don't care. This isn't about the dead… or it's not JUST about the dead, at least." He dropped the fruit to the ground, wiping his fingers on his riding coat.

On 7/6/2020 at 11:03 PM, The_Truthwatcher said:

There is some evidence for one more shard on Roshar:

Three of sixteen ruled, but now the Broken One reigns. ”

—Collected on Chachanan 1173, 84 seconds pre-death, by the Silent Gatherers. Subject was a cutpurse with the wasting sickness, of partial Iriali descent.

 

Unless the three here includes Odium, this implies that there was one more Shard.

Brandon has actually said that Odium is the third Shard on Roshar, and that there have only been three Shards on Roshar.

Quote

Questioner

The line about "three of sixteen [ruled] and now the Broken One reigns" - did Odium follow three other Shards to Roshar or is he the third Shard?

Brandon Sanderson

Odium is the third Shard on Roshar.

Footnote: The questioner is referring to the epigraph of Chapter 11 of The Way of Kings: "Three of sixteen ruled, but now the Broken One reigns."
Words of Radiance Washington, DC signing (March 20, 2014)

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Chaos (paraphrased)

How many Shards have existed on Roshar?

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

Three.

Ancient 17S Q&A (May 1, 2010)

On 7/6/2020 at 2:49 PM, Karger said:

The bit that prompted me was Odium saying "WE KILLED YOU!"  As far as we know he had no accomplices in his murder of honor.  This has prompted a lot of theories but all of them involved either a fourth shard in the mix or Cultivation joining Odium against her partner.  Neither of those really made much sense in the context of the stormlight archive(which is only supposed to be more local).

I'll be boring here, and point out that the Fused consider themselves to have helped Odium kill Honor.

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“There are those among us who agree with you, child,” Rine said.

“You do not?”

“No. We will need to watch the humans constantly. At any moment, any of them could manifest powers from the enemy. We killed him, and yet he fights on through his Surgebinders.”

Surgebinders. Foolishly, the old songs spoke highly of them. “How can they bind spren, Ancient One?” she asked to Subservience. “Humans don’t … you know…”

I'll ask about the misspellings. I suspect they're just due to the artist not really being fluent in women's script (and who could blame him?) and wanting it to look good, rather than 100% accurate.

On 7/1/2020 at 3:49 PM, Kahlani said:

we know that Lirin was training to be a surgeon in Kharbranth

Actually Liring trained with a surgeon who had trained in Kharbranth. Lirin himself did not train in Kharbranth.

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Kal felt a spike of excitement. Kharbranth? That was in an entirely different kingdom! Kal’s father had traveled there as a courier, but he hadn’t trained there as a surgeon. He’d learned from old Vathe in Shorse broon, the nearest town of any size.

Yep looks like reddit beat us this time. Still, great job, everyone!

1 minute ago, A Windrunner said:

the highlighted stuff, the words on paper, all of it? what do we translate?

We should get volunteers and assign different chunks to everyone!

I'll start with anything on the papers in women's script!

ALL OF IT!

According to one of the creators of the Call to Adventure game, in the Taravangian art, the women's script is taken from known snippets of the Diagram, but there might be a secret joke in them! So, Sharders, translators unite, and find this joke (unless the joke is on us, of course).

Here is the comment:

And here is the art by Ari Ibarra

1 hour ago, nobodyinparticular said:

Hi Folks!

Not sure if this is necessary, but spoilers possibly.......

 

I was just wondering if anyone knows/asked B.S. about how color could be drained from wood and stone for Awakening? I go under the assumption that the colors people have come from the Tears of Edgli which "drink" the investiture from the Perpendicularity that then provides the necessary addition to Investiture when performing Awakenings. Now that might be ENTIRELY wrong. But if that assumption is at all accurate, does anybody know how draining wood and stone of color would provide that since they are not "drinking" the Investiture like the Tears do? This whole thing might be entirely out of bounds, but I have been thinking enough about it to ask. Thanks!

Welcome to the Shard!

Yes, it's possible to drain color from sticks and stones. It actually happens in Warbreaker! The color drain appears to be a chemical change, where the Awakening draws energy from breaking the chemical bonds, perhaps? There's still a lot we don't know.

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She eyed her clothes, which were now completely grey. Out of curiosity, she tried Awakening the rope again. Nothing happened. She picked up a stick, then Awakened the rope. It worked this time, the stick losing its color, though it took a lotmore breath. Perhaps this was because the stick wasn’t very colorful. The tree trunk didn’t work for color, though. Presumably, one couldn’t draw color from something that was itself alive.

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Although it was dark, Vasher’s life sense was strong. He could just faintly feel the grass growing below and knew how far away it was. With more Breath, he might even have been able to sense the lichen growing on the palace stones. He knelt down, laying one hand on his trouser leg and one on the stone of the palace.

“Strengthen me,” he Commanded, Breathing. His trouser legs stiffened, and a patch of color bled from the black stone beside him. Black was a color. He’d never considered that before he’d become an Awakener. Tassels hanging at his cuffs stiffened, wrapping around his ankle. With him kneeling as he was, they could also twist around the bottoms of his feet.

1 hour ago, Kings_way said:

I have always wondered if ...

You're probably going to want to spoiler tag the rest of that.

1 hour ago, Sharddinnerplate said:

Nahel bonded Spren can appear as any shape as long as it is metal, technically they could become a nail right? Could you perform hemalurgy with a spren? Perhaps that would affect the bond and give the radiant allomancy/feruchemy??

Welcome to the Shard! I think that spren are just too invested to be usable as a Hemalurgic spike. They're basically pure investiture, so adding more and foreign investiture to the mix would be really difficult.

FYI, that's A-gold, not F-gold. I was really confused for a minute when I read the title and then your theory Allomantic gold, when burned, shows an alternate version of yourself. Feruchemical gold stores healing.

I believe there's a WoB that it would help.

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Oversleep

How useful would gold Allomancy be for making Essence Marks?

Brandon Sanderson

Useful.

Skype Q&A (Oct. 8, 2018)

Location is sort of a tricky concept int he COsmere due to Spiritual Realm shenanigans. Have other Shards perhaps taken a look or visited Scadrial for a short time? It's likely. Did  any of them "stay" long enough to Invest? I'd say no, because we get quite a lot of information on what's going on with Scadrial in the two series, and there's no indication that there was a third Shard involved up through Era 1. Era 2, on the other hand...

8 hours ago, MasterK-Bob said:

Are we in agreement feruchemical gold could do it though? I think there might be a wob about it, at least that a gold compounder could do it.

Yes, Feruchemical gold would be able to heal it if they had enough stored up.

I don't think so. Pewter just enhances your natural healing, and no manner of natural healing would heal a Shardblade wound.