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Metacognition

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  1. Metacognition
    I think it's safe to say that we've all said what we have to say about this game, since it's been over a week without any new discussion, so it's time to lock it up! Thank you Joe for running such a fun game! I really thought we were about to make a comeback there near the end, but alas, it wasn't meant to be. Congratulations to Hoid and his converts as well! As usual, if you'd like to try your hand at running a game yourself, please get a hold of Gamma, Wilson or myself. Not only will we get you added to the list, but I'm sure we'd be more than willing to help out in any way we can as well! You can also ask questions and get some hints and feedback from everyone over here in our Art of Game Creation thread as well. With all the games that we've run so far, we have plenty of experienced GMs that can help you refine any game you're thinking about!
  2. Metacognition
    Yeah, I corrected for such. As I said, I was confused by the timezones. My apologies.
  3. Metacognition
    Within minutes of the cycle ending? ....Wait, I got my timezones confused. There should still be 12 hours left. Okay, retract Damon.
  4. Metacognition
    I'm tempted to let this play out, since you're effectively claiming Wit and are trying to make Reihmer lose his role if he has one. That's the only reason I can see for this. Instead, I'll vote Damon to block you, as I think you're going for the secondary win condition for Wit, but I'm going to keep a close eye on this all the same.
  5. Metacognition
    I really wanted to try to do this in RP, as an added challenge to myself, but you guys bring up valid points, so I want to address them with as much clarity as possible. First, this isn't to say that the person chosen is actually an innocent, just that people think it is unlikely that the person is a spy at that time and considering that we have more than one spy out there, taking one person off the table late in the cycle isn't going to really hurt our options. Typically, closer to the end of the day (which is when this kind of thing would be decided), we have a consensus of a few people that are on the chopping block, so we just pick someone that isn't on that list. I'll give an example cycle to give you an idea: It's 2nd cycle and after 36 hours, Reihmer, Wok, and Torwel (these names were chosen at random, I don't necessarily suspect any of them any more than anyone else) each have 2-3 votes on them, with a scattering of people with 1 vote on them and a few people with none. More than likely, this means that one of those three are likely to get lynched without something drastic happening, like a watcher who for some reason decided to wait till the end of the day to speak up. The target for the lighteyes' vote would then go to someone that doesn't have a vote on them, since it's unlikely that they are being considered for this cycle and thus keeping it from being used on one of the three that we're debating between The plan isn't to clear anyone in particular and the target of the lighteyes' vote should be subject to change throughout the cycle. I'm not saying that calling someone out that we've determined to be a possible target for the lighteyes' vote in and of itself is terms for suspicion. As you guys pointed out, no one is above suspicion. That said, my point (#3 on Aonar's list) about someone being suspect in that case is if we have come to a consensus about who the target should be and then, late in the day, someone comes in with a vote for that person when it is unlikely that we'd be able to change the target of the lighteyes vote. It is not about punishing those who disagree with the target before that time. After we have picked someone though and it's late in the cycle, they already know that that person will likely have a vote on them and are likely using that to try to get that person lynched or to save someone else that is on the chopping block. While this is unlikely, as it is blatant, by putting the idea already out there, it eliminates the excuse that someone didn't know that such an action would be considered suspicious. The entire plan is about eliminating options for the Spies to wiggle out through. That leads me to my second point. One of my favorite tactics is to try to take away options from the Evil Faction. They either have to play by our rules or out themselves in the process of doing something that is more favorable to them. So, no Eoldren, this likely won't net us any lighteye spies unless they felt that it was worth it to them to go against what we want them to do, but it also takes away the option of them being able to use the lighteyes' vote to help get someone lynched without us finding out about it. Finally, I don't understand why you guys think that the "innocent" would deserve protection. That's not the idea. As you pointed out at the very end, Aonaran (and as I've hopefully clarified here), this is a fluid plan that would change every cycle. It's not that the person is actually an innocent (unless we do know of someone, like with the shardbearer and even then, I'd be hesitant to put the lighteyes' vote on them, in case of any voting shenanigans by the spies to get the shardbearer killed), just that they're not up for the lynch that cycle, so there would be no need to necessarily put any protection on them. The protection roles would still have free reign to use their abilities where they felt best. And it wouldn't be an "easy kill" for the spies, as we never cleared that person, we're just keeping the lighteyes' vote away from influencing the rest of our voting until we actually want it to become a factor. So, hopefully that explains the plan a little better. In my opinion, you're all guilty until proven innocent and putting the lighteyes' vote on someone for a cycle isn't going to change that for me!
  6. Metacognition
    Just wanted to say, that a good plan to keep the Lighteyes vote from being used to get someone lynched would be for all of us to agree on someone that we don't suspect for the cycle and have all the lighteyes put their secret vote on them. If anyone votes for that person, then they'll likely be trying to instigate a lynch and should be suspect. This way, we know exactly where that vote should be and if it goes elsewhere, then we'll know that the lighteyes didn't follow the plan. True, this means that the person that they agree on will automatically have one vote against them, but it's better than trying to guess what each lighteyes did with their vote. I gladly volunteer myself for it, if Araris would be willing to remove the vote from me. My reasoning is that I'm typically a large target anyways, so if the spies wish to out themselves to get rid of me, let them do so in public so we can get something out of it!
  7. Metacognition
    "The foremost support needs better grounding. Fix that," Meller stated to one of his underlings. "A shaky bridge is like a shaky house; neither is trusted for support and I won't have my bridges be thought of as unstable!" Of course, after hearing the announcement from the Blackthorn about spies, it seemed that they were all on somewhat unstable ground. Meller didn't really want to bother with that kind of nonsense, as he was on the verge of a breakthrough in bridge design, one that would allow the armies that used them to dictate the field of battle and likely be victorious; mobile bridges. Before now, armies crossed the canyons and rivers of the Alethi countryside on already established bridges or new ones were built where they were needed. Both avenues took time and resources and established choke points. If Meller could get his new concept to work properly, the army could bring their own bridges and cross wherever they wanted to, surprising the enemy and it would all be because of Meller. ...Now that he thought of it, that seemed like a good reason for the other armies to send spies into Dalinar's army. In fact, he wouldn't be surprised to find out that there were more than one group of spies. In fact, while the brightlords and ladies seemed to think that they were dealing with a unified front of enemies, it was far more likely that there were individual pairs of spies from each of the armies. This would likely make rooting them out even more difficult as they were just as likely to work against each other as they were to work together. Yes, he'd have to guard his blueprints carefully and hide his initial constructions from view, just to be on the safe side.
  8. Metacognition
    Meller, a bridge builder for the Blackthorn is in. Even he isn't sure exactly why people are asking for his opinion in such important matters. In fact, he'd much rather they left him alone. He had some new designs for the bridges that he's trying to work out and all this nonsense with spies is just distracting.
  9. Metacognition
    That's cold, Wilson. I need that plate so I can survive a game again! You truly are evil.
  10. Metacognition
    Quite possibly one of my favorite bits. I literally laughed out loud reading that, Mail! Liar. Not only are you easily on par as a threat to me, you surpass me as if I was some idiot on his roof, with paper wings, and you're a freaking bird. Admit Wilson, and revel in it. Every time you've been evil, you've either won or been the last one standing. You should embrace it! I've been evil once and I was picked up early, but every time I've played as good, I've been a force to be dealt with. There's nothing wrong with having that level of renown and if anyone deserves it, it's you!
  11. Metacognition
    This was a fun game to watch, even from the Spec Doc! As I've said there, well done, Alv and I look forward to round 2. I like the extended story line concept you're working with and it will be great to see how it all plays out! I'll make Gamma or Wilson sit out that one so I can play next time!
  12. Metacognition
    Sorry Newan. I pretty much got the exact same message Alv did, so I was just hoping you'd help me find the rest of your brethren. Unfortunately, I've had to be away from my computer all day. If I makes you feel any better, I was actually somewhat defending you until I got the PM. Well Played!
  13. Metacognition
    If this information is incorrect, we're down to 5-4 players left. We'll only have one last shot at finding one of them before it's game over. Still, I don't think the LB would take the chance of revealing themselves to someone without being pretty sure about it, so it's a chance I'm willing to take. Sorry, Newan.
  14. Metacognition
    Wait, so she had a vote on her from yesterday (pretty sure she was active yesterday) or was the vote messed with or does a tie, even of 1 vote, still cause a lynch? Because she only has the one vote right now. Okay guys, we really need to actually get a lynch today. We aren't going to find Hoid or the converts if we just keep sitting here. Everybody is complaining about lack of information, but if you don't do anything, then you will always have no information! If you're not helping us today, then you're against us. We don't have the time or numbers to mess around anymore.
  15. Metacognition
    M remained skeptical of Aonar after he finally resurfaced. He tapped his pen against his lips as he stared off into space. While it didn't seem like his attention was on Aonar, his words seem to indicate that. "You come in, begging for your life, and yet you offer nothing in return. Past studies of your behavior suggests that this is unlikely. You ask us to go back to being directionless. Unless you can provide more than just a desire to continue living, you're still hindering us by providing an available hiding place for Hoid and no new information. "I will have to stand by my convictions at this point."
  16. Metacognition
    M nodded to himself, as if he was hearing someone's voice in his ear. "Well, if you claim that Damon will be taken care of, I will move on to the next extremely quiet person. Do note, that if he is not, you're time will me limited. Aonar basically abandoned us to figure this out on our own, while he gallivants across the worlds, searching for his own purposes. Or is he? What if he just wants us to think he's left? That would make it far easier for Hoid to hide himself."
  17. Metacognition
    Did this not work for you Jain? M sat in his typical place, as far away from everyone that he could get and began his transcribing. "Initial attempts to catch Hoid have failed. Yet, my removal of my voice against Heron, late into the day does reveal much of his motives. "First, it shows that he is unwilling to manipulate the crowds' perceptions. It could mean that Hoid has little interest in swaying the crowd until he has more influence. It could also mean that Heron is Hoid. Further research is needed. "Second, this limits Hoid to only two options left, as he had no fear of death from the Renegades or the voice of the people. Either he disguised himself or masked himself as a Researcher. This is telling of how he plans to handle things, going forward. "His intent seems to be to hide. He seems motivated by his ability to remain unseen. Damon has already shown a desire to remain unknown. Even if he is not Hoid, his presence is of no use to the group and, if allowed to live, will remain a wild card within future equations. "I will attempt to eliminate such variables, so as to allow a better understanding of the situation as a whole."
  18. Metacognition
    As the day and the shadows grew long, M grew more and more anxious. Something was about to happen; he could feel it. Also, his deductions claimed a 92% chance of Hoid likely growing impatient with them and stirring the pot some. From what he could gather on Hoid, he didn't seem like the patient type. It seemed he wasn't the only one. Almost everyone, including Heron, had fallen silent, though some of that was likely due to how exhausting the day had been. M found himself moving more and more into the shadows, trying to conceal himself. After all, remaining hidden and as an unknown element had worked for him in the past. With luck, he hadn't drawn Hoid's attention too much.
  19. Metacognition
    M listened as everyone chattered on, his pen never really leaving the paper unless it was to turn to the next page. "Accurate counts seems to put the movement of the crowd, as such," he mumbled to himself as he drew out the following table: Vron (l) - Aonar Hadrian (l) - Heron Lucy (l) - Karlin Damon (l) - Aili Heron (l) - M "The general consensus is to avoid killing, unless the target is Hoid. Considering the probability of finding Hoid so early, I'm inclined to agree; though this tactic could have circulated through the crowd due to us getting too close early on. More information is required. "Initial estimates of the groups' experience may have been skewed. There is likely only one Letter-Bearer, due to the difficulties within the need for multiple, considering the minimal number of subjects. New calculations will require additional information before a new paradigm can be created." M flipped to a new page and began drawing what looked like doodles, but as they evolved, they seemed to start to develop a pattern. As he did so, he whispered, "So where are you hiding, Hoid? Make no mistake, I have already set in motion ideas and concepts that you cannot stop. In this game you can not win." M sat, relatively undisturbed, and continued to draw and write his notes while those around him continued to try to say as little as possible.
  20. Metacognition
    Wait, if anything, I'd still be voting for Aonar, unless you're saying that my clarification of how the color editor works is being taken as an actual vote... Am I being punished for trying to help people out, Joe? Cause that's not cool...
  21. Metacognition
    M didn't like how many people were still hiding in the shadows or only wanting it to be known that they were here. The second ones weren't giving him much to work with to establish a personality profile to weigh against later, in case of conversion. That made them unknown factors and he preferred to be that unknown element! At least Aonar was among those that were here, though his responses didn't allay any of M's doubts about him. Unfortunately, Heron was right, they weren't likely to find Hoid on the first day. Hoid was far too clever for that, but without the early discussion, they wouldn't ever find him!
  22. Metacognition
    Karlin: Votes are done in red typically. Considering so many people have had difficulties with the color editor (hi, Jain!), here is what I've noticed with this site which should help you and everyone else, going forward. The color editor works off of how/when you highlight something. If you don't mind, I'll use your post as an example. If you type: "I'm going to vote for Lucy, totally evil!" and then you highlight "Lucy" and set it for red, it will post as follows: I'm going to vote for Lucy, totally evil!" Now, let's say that you type it up that way and then decide to highlight everything and change the text color to blue. Here's what you think would happen: "I'm going to vote for Lucy, totally evil!" That isn't what will happen though. What you end up with is exactly what you wound up getting: "I'm going to vote for Lucy, totally evil!" If you highlight text that you've already changed the color to, it will only recognize the last color change you did to it. So if you're you're trying to type out, "I'm going to vote for Lucy, totally evil!" then first change the color of everything to blue and then change the color of the individual text; in this case, "Lucy." I'm leaving this as is, so as to show how the color coding works, as far as I've seen it work for me. Hopefully this helps players in the future. Obviously, this isn't my character trying to explain it... or could it?
  23. Metacognition
    M stayed far back from the rest of the crowd, lest they start asking him questions. M had joined the 17th Shard specifically because they hadn't asked him many questions. Once they found out he could world-hop, the only question they asked was, "would you like to join us?" M liked an organization that understood the desires for secrecy. That didn't mean that M didn't enjoy learning though. In fact, one of the main reasons he didn't like to be known was likely due to his urge to know so much about everyone else! Before Jost had even finished his speech, M was already hard at work, organizing his thoughts and suspicions so that he could begin the work of tracking down Hoid. "If this is just being brought to our attention, then Hoid has likely been here longer than they're letting on; thus I suspect that he's had enough time to recruit at least one person to his cause," M mumbled to himself, as he nonchalantly started making diagrams in a notebook (not that notebook!) he had on his lap. "He presumably hasn't had much more time than that. He'll likely be looking for more recruits early, so focus on the mannerisms of those today to match again future behavior." While he looked like he was staring off into the distance, he was was actually scanning the crowd and yet his writing never even faltered. His gaze lasted possibly a fraction of a second longer on Aonar, but he quickly moved on. "Initial analysis of the crowd suggests that there are likely two of each of the following archetypes: Letter-Bearers, Nurses, and Renegades, though there may be more of one and less of another. Probability states at least one Researcher. "Notes for predictive activity of the archetypes. Renegades will likely be aggressive and look to attack early. Attempts should be made to get them to refrain. They're statistically more likely to attack an innocent at this point in time. Letter-Bearers will likely be hubs of information. They should be protected while they go about their task. Nurses will need to be preemptive. If they can prevent deaths by guessing likely targets for Hoid and his recruits, their utility will be more effective than if they only attempt to stop the bleeding once it has begun. "Final notes before beginning investigation; if there are alterations to the voting, Researchers will be able to be confident with their results, as only Hoid can affect them and that means that he can not use his ability to hide himself at the same time." I always prefer more time to less. Today is the day in which we want as many people talking as possible so that we have a better chance of catching them in faulty logic later on. I would rather just have another full 24 hours and not throw off the schedule any.
  24. Metacognition
    It's not like we're going to break time. People assume that time is a strict progression of cause to effect, but actually, from a non-linear viewpoint, it's more like a big ball of wibbly wobbly - time-y wimey... stuff. I suppose you could think of it like a rug, or lace; An Age Lace, if you will. I'm sure the Pattern can handle a little time travel!
  25. Metacognition
    Georgia. I choose one of the more readily accepted ones, just in case, but you can do with it as you want. I just wanted to highlight the name a bit more, since having a single letter as a name is sometimes difficult to notice!
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