BlackYeti

So he's used to seeing the spren, and she's talking to him, referring to him by name, something that we haven't seen any spren do besides Radiant spren... Edit: that quote's from Chapter 41.

This was in part 2, I haven't read further. Edit: it's in the chapter from Teft's PoV.

Didn't we see that Teft has already bonded a spren? We already have our next Windrunner, don't we?

So, I've just finished part 2, and haven't read any of the other comments yet. We got confirmation that the Stonewards Tension Surge abilities are different from those of the Bondsmiths! This makes me very happy because this goes some way towards confirming (though it's not quite there yet) a minor theory that I'd come up with. I never actually posted a topic about it, but I did write a little about it here: Per this theory, the Stonewards would be able to use the Tension the same way that the Bondsmiths can as well, just as the Bondsmiths can use Adhesion the same way that the Windrunners can, and also another way that we haven't seen yet. Also, based off of Navani's reaction to seeing the Regrowth fabrial, I think I was also right in my theory that ancient fabrials are something completely different to modern fabrials. Rather, ancient fabrials are an alternative way to access the Surgebindings, whereas the modern fabrials are their own system. The epigraphs were fascinating, was that first letter actually from Bavadin? That's my best guess at the moment, and if so that would reveal so much about her. She would actually have a presence on multiple worlds, not just Taldain. The second letter was much less interesting to my mind since it was clearly from Sazed (or meant to look like it was), and so it didn't actually reveal all that much. I'm not sure that I understand what's going on with the fused yet: it sounds like the ancient listener Cognitive Shadow spren are actually possessing the bodies of the [listeners? What do we call them now, it looks like I was wrong about this being the name of their species?], yet that doesn't match what we've seen of the Stormform listeners. Does that mean that the fused are something else than the Forms of Power? The only other reactions off the top of my head: Jasnah's put down of Amaram was absolutely perfect. And it looks like Lift will be joining the cast , her interaction with Dalinar was likewise superb.

So this has nothing to do with Audible, but I think I just had my own Oathbringer related mini heart attack. See, Oathbringer isn't due to be published in the UK until Thursday, and I'd resigned myself to waiting until then. However, I just checked the bookstore's website, and I found this: I guess I'm going to be getting a new book tomorrow, rather than Thursday!

@hoiditthroughthegrapevine, as @Blacksmithki and @Naerin have already addressed your point on the spren vs. the Surges quite well, allow me to come at this from a different direction. If your theory is true, then the Bondsmiths have two Surges of emotion, the Truthwatchers have two Surges of nature, and every other Order have one Surge of each. However, the symmetry of the Surgebinding chart does not allow for this. I've made a quick diagram to illustrate this, assume that a red circle is an "emotion Surge" and that a green circle is a "nature Surge". As you can see, both the Windrunners and Lightweavers also share a single type of Surge in this configuration. Certainly, there are other configurations you could try, but all of these have other Orders than the Bondsmiths and Truthwatchers sharing the same type of Surge. The only way to eliminate this would be to assume that the Bondsmiths and Truthwatchers have one Surge of each type, just as the all of the other Orders do. I'm sorry to shoot another hole in your theory, it was rather nicely thought out, but I don't see how it's viable at this point.

Spren can remain hidden from humans, but not from listeners: they apparently see all of the spren. There are lots of examples that show this, the most obvious is probably the listeners being able to see Yixli while Kaladin couldn't. Also, it's probably a result of Horneaters being human-listener hybrids that Rock can see the spren as well.

This isn't speculation, it's in the books: This, on the other hand, is speculation. I don't recall anyone suggesting that each of the Surges is related to a specific Shard: the generally accepted view is that the Surges are independent of the Shards and that the magics each access all of the ten Surges. Do you have anything to substantiate this claim? I disagree with this on multiple counts. Firstly, the intents of Honour and Odium do not seem to be opposed to me, why would you necessarily be incapable of acting honourably if you happen to hate someone or something? I also disagree that Cultivation doesn't have a goal, the word "cultivation" has a very clear meaning which is to grow or to develop. I don't see how this could imply neutrality, to my mind this would be far more opposed to odium than honour would be. Then I also disagree with how you're trying to assign the Shards into a D&D style alignment system. None of the Shards are good or evil, they are forces defined by their intent. Finally, I'm fairly convinced (this is my speculation) that Voidbinding is of Odium and Honour, not of Cultivation. Partly because of the "binding" in the name, which I'm fairly sure is referring to Honour, and partly due to the Voidbinding chart being based on the Double Eye of the Almighty.

Link: https://wob.coppermind.net/events/4/#e4841 Existing Text: Revised Text:

I'm on mobile at the moment, and I can't figure out how to highlight the text on this interface. I've underlined the differences instead, I hope that's okay. I'm sorry if it's a problem. Link: https://wob.coppermind.net/events/34-arcanum-unbounded-seattle-signing/#e5717 Link: https://wob.coppermind.net/events/34-arcanum-unbounded-seattle-signing/#e5901

@Chaos, you are going to show us the unredacted versions of those paragraphs after the release of Oathbringer, aren't you?

What makes you think that he can't have been the son of a previous monarch of Idris?

I agree with you. I was just trying to make the point, in a roundabout fashion, that not all Shardblades are spren, and thus the issue regarding whether Shardblades can be living spren as well as dead spren (which they obviously can be), is rather redundant.

Unless it actually is an Honourblade, in which case it's a Shardblade that isn't actually a spren at all!

@Calderis, where, precisely, did I state that the Stormfather was just a Cognitive Shadow? As I recall, I never made that claim. Also, it was the third WoB that was paraphrased, not the second, and as I was the person he was talking to in the paraphrased WoB, I can say with certainty that he said the words: "The stormfather is a cognitive shadow". And I disagree that an answer being a simplification invalidates the WoB, he could have easily have simplified it in a way that doesn't involve lying. E.g. "the Stormfather has gained Honour's memories", or "the Stormfather merged with Honour's Cognitive Shadow" (he's actually used that one before. I'm also far from convinced that the definition of Cognitive Shadow is as restrictive as you claim. I realise that you're using a definition set by WoB, but that could easily have been simplified itself. It wouldn't be the first time that Brandon's given us a definition that excludes edge cases. In any event, I agree with @Yata's revised claim of the Stormfather's nature being a hybrid. It doesn't mean that he can't be categorised as a Cognitive Shadow, but also indicates that there's more going on.

You clearly stated that the Stormfather is not Tanavast's Cognitive Shadow. Brandon clearly stated, on multiple occasions (my list of WoBs wasn't even exhaustive) that the Stormfather is a Cognitive Shadow, and even specified him as Honour's Cognitive Shadow. This is as plain a disagreement as you could possibly get. I do not disagree with any of your other points: the Stormfather obviously hasn't always been a Cognitive Shadow, this does not mean that he is not a Cognitive Shadow now. The WoBs explicitly indicate that he is. I actually suspect that he's a fundamentally different entity now than he was back before his merger with Tanavast's Cognitive Shadow, neither the Stormfather of old nor Tanavast, but something new, born from them both.

Brandon apparently disagrees with you: (Mistborn Era 1 spoilers)

This is wrong: skin colours are in absolutely no way, "social constructions". We do not live in the Cosmere, perception does not shape reality. Skin colour is determined by the quantity of melanin in the skin, which is in turn determined primarily by genetics. Thus skin colour runs in families; your children will have the same skin pigmentation that you have unless you have them with someone who has a much different skin colour to you. A perfect example of this misunderstanding is your example of the Burakumin. The Burakumin are not a race, they have no distinguishing physical traits from the rest of the Japanese population. This is an example of a caste, and thus has no connection with racism; rather, a completely different example of human stupidity.

@Aleksiel, yeah, that's weird, I'm the one being quoted both times, not just the second time. The point I was trying to make by bringing up Jesus was that the artwork is not a realistic depiction of the Heralds. The Heralds may well have been of different races, I was just surprised that this would have been captured in the artwork. And finally, on the point of Jesus' skin colour, I'm not saying that he was very dark skinned, but he wouldn't have been what most people consider to be white. However, this is a deviation from the topic, and the point has been made, it would probably be best to leave it alone now.

There's actually a more definitive WoP here: Aether's are canon, we just don't know where or how they're going to appear, or even if they already have.

Some very good points here. On Jesus' race, I wouldn't consider Middle Easterners to be white. They're certainly not black, but there isn't a simple divide between "white" and "black". And on the subject of art, it's true that I'm not in any way an art historian (and even less so when it comes to religious art), so I'll readily concede the point here since you seem to know far more about this than I do. I suppose that the artists depicting him would use their own race as a reference point, so what you say does make sense. Being British, I suppose the standard image of him that I'm used to seeing looks something like this, which I think you'll agree is nothing like what he would have actually looked like. (Image in spoiler box for space.) I did consider that the Oilswarn might well not be Alethi (I don't believe that we know his nationality), which is why I based my reaction on Amaram's perception. While the Heralds are often depicted by sculpture, that doesn't mean that there aren't other forms of art used: I remember Shalash slashing up a painting in her interlude, the Ardents in Shallan's Devotary encouraged her to draw the Heralds, etc. Maybe the Oilswarn wasn't Alethi, and Amaram was used to seeing Alethi depictions of the Heralds. But then that would raise the issue of why the Oilswarn would have depicted them as different races rather than painting them all as his own race. And regarding the clothing, I'm actually not that surprised. Artwork is often held to different standards than people are in the societies that produce the said artwork. E.g. this Victorian painting of Adam and Eve: And Shalash is the Herald of Beauty, consider how similar figures from mythology are often depicted (e.g. Venus, Aphrodite, etc.).

Yes they are per WoB:

I'm actually more surprised that Shalash is depicted with dark skin. I would have expected all of the Heralds to have been depicted as Alethi as that's Amaram expected them to appear. This suggests to me that Vorin artwork of the Heralds depicts them that way, much like how Christian artwork of Jesus typically depicts him as being white despite how absurd that is.

Yes, it is! Thank's so much. Have all the upvotes!

Does anyone remember a WoB that said that there might exist evil honorspren? I've tried searching theoryland, @Pagerunner's excellent excel document of Reddit WoBs (not to mention a search of Reddit itself), and I've tried searching google for it, but haven't been able to find it. Either I'm severely misremembering, or it's buried somewhere that I've haven't thought to look.