Kadrok

So where is it confirmed that spike placement in the recipient matters? Because my experience was the opposite to Empyrus's... I knew that it mattered where you spiked the donor, but I had yet to see (or remember) evidence that placement in the recipient mattered (beyond the obvious requirement that it be on a bindpoint). So it definitely needs to be on a specific bindpoint in the recipient? EDIT: Nevermind, I followed the link. But this raises an interesting question. His description seems to imply that at the time of writing a Pewter spike could steal more than just physical Feruchemy powers, which is odd since we now know that is all they steal (well, until we find out that Pewter also steals Lashings or whatever)... so a large amount of the problem of determining "which power" seems solved by the metals keying into different things... obviously you'd need to spike different places for different Physical Feruchemy powers, but none of this seems to demand a specific bindpoint from the recipient... so why is a specific bindpoint required from the recipient? Given how he has constructed Hemalurgy, this seems kind of arbitrary... presumably a Steel Spike containing Allomantic Steel contains Allomantic Steel regardless of where it is placed, or even if it is in a body at all (Marsh carries a charged spike which contains a specific power in the books). Don't misunderstand me, I get that the spike might need to be placed in a specific location for the recipient to access that power, I just don't understand why. It doesn't seem entirely necessary, either from a narrative standpoint or a mechanical one...

Thankyou kindly

While I like the idea, there're only so many cool names and we... well... Brandon... still has to cover the names of all the Twinborn combinations... and we have confirmation that they do have names. Given that this and that Savants are fairly rare and less likely to need names beyond "Copper Savant", I can see some of these instead being the names of Twinborn combinations.

So in case anyone is kicking around here, and not in the topic of the guy who thought of it before me... I thought I'd quote this here. People, send this woman some upvotes! (In the original context, obviously: http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/2913-the-letter-the-element/page-2#entry57661)

This pleases me I'm Australian! I identify with your characters already!

One thing I'd highly recommend is having a bunch of 'junk powers', abilities which serve little or no useful purpose... if we're going with an evolutionary background to this thing in the sense that the system has arisen by chance... that is, I would think that there would be far more "useless quirks" than "useful quirks" emerging in a chaotic system like this. Though this of course depends on what determines what powers people get... is it genetic (ie, someone is genetically predisposed to developing telepathy under the influence of "Chemical X" or whatever you're calling it) or is it caused in some way by their state when they were first exposed? And is this state a mental state (say, they're cooking meat when they are accidentally exposed, so their mind is on the fire... thereafter when they use the chemical they can burn magically attuned things) or a physical state (say, they're on fire because their tenament is burning down when they are accidentally exposed... thereafter when they use the chemical they can burn magically attuned things). It either case, randomly assigned abilities, or abilities assigned by a context, I would think there would be a certain amount of junk abilities (or Gnats... that seems an appropriate analogy).

Exactly! That's a very interesting theory! Is it a topic somewhere?

Yeah Phantom, we know As skaa points out, I'm not interested in gaining their personality/identity, I'm interested in pillaging the knowledge of my alternate selves. Could you imagine gathering all the knowledge I might have had?!

The tattoos are for if you don't share knowledge in the process of burning and need to convey it visually. I couldn't remember if knowing what they know is part of the 'Gold experience' (sounds dirty). But yeah, coppermind the hell out of the shadow's knowledge if you do... which leads to an interesting question. Are the Gold-selves shadows of possibilities or connections to altenate selves which actually exist in a multiverse... because if so you're effectively stealing the memories of other selves and it's probable they would do it to you, or else it's probable they've also thought of this and store all interesting memories in copperminds.

In the MAG you can attempt to view a specific life. What I want to know is... do you know while burning what your double knows? Because if so I'd like to go to the possible life where I became an obligator and learned the secrets of the Steel Ministry. If not... I'd like to view the possible life where I became an obligator and learned the secrets of the Steel Ministry... and tattooed them on my arms for the benefit of an alternate timeline self.

Perhaps he was just terrible at it. Sazed hints, and the MAG tells us, that there are different degrees of strength or skill in storing and tapping thing. It doesn't seem too far fetched that he just wasn't that good at storing speed, compared to other things. As for my answer, I was really surprised because I thought I would be the only one saying this but... Lurcher. It would be so useful in my day-to-day, especially as I'd have non-metal things incorporate metal for that very reason. I need to get my Iphone off the table... LURCH! Ah, there're my keys... LURCH! Oooh, I'm thirsty... LURCH... SPLASH... SHATTER... *ahem* maybe I should switch to flasks... If I was allowed to be Twinborn it would be Lurcher-Skimmer mostly because I think Feruchemical Iron is just MADE to be paired with Allomantic Steel or Iron. If I had to be a Ferring... Gold. And I'd keep a spare Goldmind chock full of Health so that if I were ever maimed I could just grow back my... whatever. But yeah, Allomantic Iron would be my choice if I had to pick one.

Drat. I'm not too surprised though. Why couldn't my search find this? Thankyou for the link, I will read the old thread.

These lines appear in the letter: "Let me first assure you that the element is quite safe." I thought we could speculate as to what is meant by "The Element" Let me start by fielding my theory: "The Element" is a bead of Lerasium, or something otherwise derived from it. (I am assuming as many do that Hoid is the letter writer, and it has been confirmed he took a bead of Lerasium from the Well of Ascension). Obviously this is based on very little... other than, we know Hoid has a Lerasium bead, and a Lerasium bead seems like an "Element" worth protecting, especially if it is capable of more than just making someone a Mistborn, as we have been told... and especially since Hoid "has" a bead of Lerasium, not "had"... meaning he is hanging on to it for some reason. I've speculated elsewhere that this is because he is using it as a metalmind, but this need not be the case, nor need it contradict the possibility that the bead is "The Element". (If it is obvious what the element is from one of the books I haven't read, I apologise for wasting your time...)

Honestly I'm just glad you're here! I was getting so lonely in this topic, all on my own. I'm inclined to think that Lerasium's ability to be universally burned is because it's made from the essence of the Shard from which Allomancy is derived. My suspicion is that being able to be universally burned (which is in essence, being usable as a power-access in a specific "magic-system") is very much the exception. That said, narratively speaking we arrive at the same conclusion... if Brandon is going to RAFO what the Atium alloys do (he did, right?), it implies that we will encounter in his books someone who can burn them. If, as you suppose, Demoux can burn all Atium alloys with only Seer powers there is a good chance Demoux is our guy. Likewise if, as I suppose, Demoux is a Mistborn (and there wouldn't be that many around... possibly Hoid, or someone who burns Hoid's Lerasium? Though if certain forces on Scadrial succeed, there may be more in the future...) there is a good chance Demoux is our guy (and it's poetic if he is a Seer-turned Mistborn who is used to explore Atium alloys at some point in the future). So I suppose it is possible, but to me it seems to violate the one-or-all rule of Allomancy to which I think Lerasium, being in some sense a cradle of Allomancy, is the only exception.

I see what you're saying, but given that the stored investiture is neutral (ie it's not flavoured as Strength, or Mental Speed or whatever) I would think you still could overwrite other metalminds. Being able to access that metal in other contexts doesn't seem that relevant given that you're essentially pouring raw power into the same place where they've stored whatever trait... a place you couldn't access even if you also had that particular Feruchemical ability (that is to say, even if you can store mental speed in a piece of Zinc, you can't access another's Zinc store, and if you share the metalmind with them it is stored separately to theirs... thus having Sparker as well as Soulbearer powers don't seem particularly relevant in the context of burning out someone else's metal stores). That said, I can see how it could be argued the other way, and so I await WoB or the Alloy of Law supplement to the MAG to clarify this. As stated, I think it's too early to assume that Soulbearer is a Gnat power, but I do agree that compounding it isn't worth +4

I see what you mean, and was going to retort that you wouldn't have their pierced ones, but grabbing your opponents ears seems... clunky. Nicrosil Compounder! With Ear-Grabbing POWER! I will concede that until we get more details on how it works with Allomancy, Nicrosil Feruchemy doesn't seem that useful and is presently deserving of its 1 rating.

You'd have to use team work, perhaps a team Lurcher behind a riotshield pulling all metal into the shield, negating bullets. You'd need to pay a Nicroburst to give you a surge (you can store bursts of power caused by duralumin or nicrosil) or figure out a way to draw the power from the mists. However, if my theory is correct and Allomancy and Nicrosil are compatible, you could also potentially burn your Allomantic metal, and store the flow of investiture which would otherwise power your ability.

Unless my theory that you can use Nicrosilminds to fuel allomancy (and therefore fuel your Nicrobursting) is accurate! But even if it isn't, you can pour the contents of your Nicrosilmind into someone else's Metalmind, annihilating their charges (assuming you can touch an opponents metalmind). This makes Nicrosil-Nicrosil and interesting offensive choice as you can throw off their allomantic abilities with a sudden burst of power, and wipe their metalminds, both if you can touch them. For these reasons I think your fe-Nicro and compounding-Nicro need to be higher. I also feel as if compounding mental speed is underrated... having 'time to think' in even the fastest situation strikes me as an amazing ability. Finally, is the aluminum headband business what is keeping Zinc/Brass at a 2?

I'm not sure if this has been suggested before (I looked but found nothing) but I have a theory that Demoux is now a mistborn through Sazed-intervention or some other means. The reasons are as follows: 1. It gives an explanation as to why he's still alive, if not the motivation... Cadmium is an element and perfectly discoverable... duralumin is likewise also available... putting them together accounts easily for his presence in the future. Perhaps he was trying to reach the Survivor somehow, or perhaps one of the divine figures in his life moved him to mix the two. 2. Brandon has been asked if Demoux can burn Malatium, to which he coyly responded "That's an interesting theory" 15 SWEETNESS 3. Can Demoux burn malatium? BRANDON SANDERSON Interesting theory. TAGS demoux, atium, mistborn, allomancy, A stranger response than either "RAFO" or "No". Whatever Sweetness's motivation for asking, it is illuminating. We know that, short of Hemalurgy, no one can burn just two metals, it's a one or all deal (obviously all humans can burn Lerasium as well, let's move on). Furthermore if Demoux could burn Malatium it makes Preservation distorting snapping so that Atium and Malatium mistings could snap inconsistent (uplike for whoever finds this WoB quote, it's late and I'm running out of time). If Atium mistings also had the ability to burn Malatium, Preservation needn't have shifted out two metals from the snapping system. So if Demoux CAN burn Malatium, as Brandon hints with his answer, it almost certainly means Demoux is a mistborn. (Sazed intervening and granting Demoux full powers seems far more likely than Demoux spiking himself with an Inquisitor spike that had Atium, or else working out how to steal Malatium Allomancy, finding a Malatium Misting in a World without Atium, and spiking him for it). 3. It helps explain why Demoux can Worldhop. We can be almost certain Demoux is a hopper, and though accessing Shadesmar does fit with the nature of Atium, he'd need an ongoing source in a Pitless Scadrial. Another allomantic combination, or trick could very well be the key, perhaps an alloy of Atium if you're desperate for Atium to be involved. Demoux burning all metals increases our ability to explain his worldhopping (Since we don't know how Scadrian's do it yet) 4. It fits with the story. This is more a narrative point but, we saw Spook become a Mistborn by Sazed's hand. If we had seen the same for Demoux we may have been disappointed: "Great, now everyone cool is a Mistborn". The oddity (an Atium misting in a context in which we had been led to believe there could be no such thing) becomes just another Mistborn. Fastforward in time (with Duralumin and Cadmium if you can burn them ) and we have a world in which Mistborn are the oddity... a legend lost to the ages. Mistborn-Demoux remains the oddity. Furthermore, it keeps his powers relevant in a potentially Atium-less situation: it is doubtful he could get some from Scadrial, and he almost assuredly can't from other Shardworlds. However the main Allomantic metals should be available on each world, and even if technology doesn't allow for some metals, Mistborn-Demoux has a fair chancd at atleast the basic 8. Let me be clear that I'm not proposing that is the timeframe for Demoux's power-expansion, merely the timeframe for our discovery of it: he became a mistborn before he became a sharder, but if we had found that out at the end of HoA it would have been narratively tacky. Thoughts? EDIT: Well... this is demoralising. I take it 5AM Australian time isn't a good time to post things?

The Ascended Ancients in Stargate spring to mind. If his intent is "giving as many as possible the opportunity to make their own choices" as the Wiki claims, it is unlikely he's going to throw his weight around that much... the more he acts, the less he fulfills his intent because every action of his would diminish the choices of others. I think Harmony is going to be largely non-intervention, relying more on empowered followers than "godding around". His Shardholder fits this, given he was always an advisor and academic figure rather than a man of action.

Dammit Phantom, stop bewitching upvotes out of me with your humour and easy charisma! On the topics, the Kandra also had the advantage of being in a metal rich area meaning that even if Ruin could use their Hemalurgy to slightly influence them, it would be mitigated by the fact that unless they're on assignment, they're largely concealed from his view. As for the other topic, the Koloss... one thing bothers me about the Koloss being changed to breed true... I was under the impression it was mostly male prisoners who got the four iron spike treatment, though I suppose there could be plenty of girl-koloss, and we just can't tell under their rippling muscles and skin tearing... but if there weren't many or any female koloss... did Sazed... gender-swap a bunch of them? (I haven't finished Alloy yet, so perhaps this is explained...)

Turns out the prize was an upvote With regards to the bodies, perhaps Sazed could have used them to enhance the Scadrian spirit web since Ati and Leras were almost certainly pre-shattering people. Or perhaps he could have advanced their plain old every day physical biology. Another possiblity is examining the effects of Shardholding on a human body long term... who knows, Leras and Ati could have been riddled with cancers or had blueberries instead of testicles. All I'm saying is, there are good reasons why having the corpse of someone who was more-or-less a God for a few thousand years, not to mention part of another, potentially superior human race, could have been useful to someone who can mess around with human physiology, but only has the gathered wisdom of dead religions to guide this power.

I could have sworn we had Word of Brandon on it somewhere... that shards are good at different things and seeing the future isn't something Ruin is good at.

How do Ferrings of toxic metals like Cadmium or Bendalloy avoid getting sick? If I can quote Wikipedia for a moment (first class scholarship here): "Wood's metal (Bendalloy) is toxic because it contains lead and cadmium, and therefore contact with the bare skin is thought to be harmful, especially in the molten state. Vapour from cadmium-containing alloys is also known to pose a danger to humans. Cadmium poisoning carries the risk of cancer, anosmia (loss of sense of smell), and damage to the liver, kidneys, nerves, bones, and respiratory system." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wood%27s_Metal Metalminds require skin-contact, as I recall.

Sorry, I should have been more clear. I'm looking for the quote about Ruin not being very good at seeing the future.