Jaconis

This was how I interpreted the situation as well. I think Odium helps whomever has the most passion for him to “take” (or whatever he does). When humans first came to Roshar, it was them: conquest, war, the Thrill, everything Odium tried to take from Dalinar. Then, he helped the singers, as their passion, anger at the humans, far exceeded that of the humans. This is why I believe Rayse is now known as Odium, as the primary emotion he feeds on is anger. Not sure I understand his end goal, because there are several things I don’t understand about him in general. On Odium the Shard. Do any other shards feed on anything in this way? Ruin didn’t “feed” on destruction. I don’t understand what’s happening here. Why and how is he a void where passion goes? Does he gain power from this? What we saw of him in OB is nothing like what I was expecting from the hints we got in the epigraphs of WoK and WoR. I was expecting him to be more...unhinged? Ati was far more mentally unstable, and Rayse is supposed to be worse if anything. He seems completely in control of himself, where the letter writer from WoR says he suspects he is more a force than an individual. I apologize if this derails the thread, and I’ll start a new one if necessary.

That was a good catch. Might be shardplate there. Another I think is Shallan, though this is confusing because of her multiple personalities. When the images of her mother and father threaten to overwhelm her, first Veil comes, then this: Then, later, when exhausted: We also have a WoB that Shallan was one level above Kaladin as of the end of WoR, which is plate level based on the epigraphs from the gems. I think Shallan was in her own plate here, but it’s hard to say considering how confusing she is.

Firstly, blown away by the book. Secondly, my initial thoughts were a bit of disappointment, but mostly because one of the biggest reveals I was wanting in this book we didn’t get, which was: HOW IN THE WORLD IS SHARDPLATE MADE?!?!?!? We were about to find out and it got ripped from us. I think we got pretty strong hints it’s the cousin spren, with them appearing around Kaladin in shadesmar when they don’t normally come there, but I wanted hard facts storm it! In all seriousness, amazing book. The more I think I about it, I may actually like it more than WoR, but at worst it’s equal. On Adolin and Sadeas’ murder: yes, there was not much in terms of punishment for him...yet. I think that’s coming next book. Dalinar won’t keep it secret, as he learned secrets are what almost ruined everything. I’m not sure how people can say it didn’t get much attention though. It was literally Odium’s trump card in the final battle. Well, his second trump card, as making Dalinar his champion was his primary. Adolin thought about it when we got a POV from him, which wasn’t super often. All in all, it was addressed, but not finished. A fine state for a plot line in book 3 of 10. On Renarin: Eating crow about my belief that there wasn’t anything fishy about his spren. I began to realize I was wrong as soon as Wit told Shallan not to trust anyone who can see the future. Though, I’m still not of the belief that everyone who can see the future at all is of Odium. Clearly Cultivation can as well, and better than Odium, as she ruined his millennia long plan completely by giving Dalinar his memories back and preparing him for his confrontation. Renarin doesn’t seem to be bad though...that’s an open thread still. Also, is his spren a corrupted Truthwatcher spren, or some other spren entirely? On Dalinar’s Spiritual Adhesion: Firstly want to point out how clever Sanderson has been with his book releases in general. This wouldn’t have made near as much sense, and couldn’t had been done as it was, if Also, opens the door for all sorts of possibilities for the other orders, and partially supports a theory of mine regarding Kaladin and Shallan specifically. People spiritually gravitate (gravity) to Kaladin, and are exceptionally loyal (adhesion). Shallan spiritually transforms people. Haven’t thought about the others much, but seems we might be able to extrapolate. On Nalan: as others have said, he is even more coocoo for ChocoPuffs than we originally thought. His logic to side with Odium is insane. I wonder how many of the Skybreakers will go with him. While talking about the Skybreakers though, I wonder if the other orders talked about their Ideals’ contents so openly, or if that was strictly a Skybreaker thing. Also, Nalan says Ishar’s mind was the most stable...doesn’t bode well for the rest of the Heralds. On Kaladin’s struggle with his Fourth Ideal: I guess I see why it had to happen, but I personally didn’t like it. It sort of felt to me like it was only there for the reason people seem to like it, to avoid Kaladin being the savior each time. I fully realize that may be my bias, as I am Kaladin fan. Though, it seems that this Ideal is tough for all Windrunners, based on the one epigraph. That said, perfectly fine with Dalinar being the savior this time, and if possible done in an even more gut wrenching way than Kaladin’s Big Moments. There are so so many other things, but I’ll have to get to them after a reread where I can quote better.

We should have known (or guessed) this already, but one of the bigger takeaways from chapters 29, 30 and 31is that our heroes have just barely scratched the surface of what their powers can do. And that’s not even considering what they might be able to do with Shardplate. Shallan making an army of light, Kaladin manipulating the wind. Lightweavers and Windrunners indeed... @WhiteLeeopard and @DSC01 Not according to the Ars Arcanum at the end of both WoK and WoR. Pulling the arrows to his shield and bridge was Gravity, manipulating the gravitation field around the object he was touching to have things attracted to it rather than the planet below. Theres the possibility that this is wrong and we are being misled (via unreliable narrator), but I can’t fathom why, as it doesn’t really make a difference which surge is responsible, other than whether Dalinar or Nale can do it.

Just to throw something out there, does Shallan’s thoughts on Re-Shepnir help or hurt the theory that the unmade are somehow related to the breaking of the Heralds?

Ahh yes. I reread it. I misunderstood the first time and thought he used an oathgate to get back to Urithiru at the end there. I see now he just ubered with the Stormfather.

So which was the oathgate Kaladin used? I don’t think Kholinar, because that would have been mentioned that he saw the city. All others seem too far away.

Well, the text doesn’t seem to be clear to me, but is this a floor to ceiling pillar? I pictured it in my initial reading as more of a podium type thing rather than a full column, but the text doesn’t indicate either way I think. I ask because of the below quote from chapter 24: Emphasis mine. It seems to me, if this powercore in the basement is floor to ceiling, there may have been several throughout the city that were removed. Why wasn’t this one removed? We can only guess. Maybe it wasn’t known, maybe Re-Shephir was already there, maybe there are a bunch that weren’t removed and they just haven’t found them yet. Either way, if there is a connection here, hat indicates to me that it wasn’t the prison, but something to power the city as is suggested.

I think Shallan found the Tower’s furnace. Or, maybe that’s just one of its functions. Now all that duct work has a purpose, and everyone won’t be so storming cold.

Or locking something away...

Vedev seems to have something similar, though bigger, as earrings. Maybe it’s what they used to hold Stormlight?

My new pet theory is that it's written by Tanavast. Highly unlikely, but would be a huge twist.

I'm not saying making them light. I'm talking about their color specifically. I don't have books or references handy, but Kaladin's eyes weren't dark blue before, but when he summons Syl they turn light blue now. Shallan's eyes should turn ruby colored if the pattern continues.

Can anyone tell me if Shallan's eyes have ever been noted as having changed color when she summons her blade the way Kaladin's have? I understand it's not quite as noteworthy, as for Kaladin it's jumping several stations in society, but I still look it would have been mentioned that her eyes changed color? I ask because I thought there was a WoB that the eyes changed to match the color of the associated gemstone of the order. If this is true, why did no one notice her eye color change with the couple times she summoned the blade in WoR? Or in chapter 8 of OB, when she had just brought people over?

Well, Hoid has taken a special interest in encouraging each of our other proto-Rafiants. He speaks to Kaladin, Shallan, and Dalinar to help them through their issues. The only other person he specifically tries to help (that we've seen) is Renarin. In that very same conversation he says he only helps those that could benefit from it.

I agree. This seems like one of those lines that would be ignored by most of the readership, even those who post here, if we were reading this as part of the whole book. Talking about the spanreeds made me remember something else that I haven't seen posted here yet. I am mightily happy that we didn't go a significant portion of the book with Kaladin and others having no Stormlight. I just hate when the main characters finally start to gain some power, or come to terms with their power, and suddenly their power source is gone. I understand the need: you need conflict, and for your characters to have a sense of danger. You achieve neither if they have significant power advantages over their enemies, so you need to either depower your protagonists (right after you spent chapters or books making them awesome) or empower your antagonists. It should have been obvious given the end of WoR, but I'm glad Brandon went with the latter approach. We were with them to see Kaladin and Shallan and everyone slog through so many of their issues and become awesome, I would have hated the payoff for that was for them to not be able to use their awesomeness.

Is that just a gut feeling or do you have evidence to support that? Either is fine, just wondering if there's something I missed or just have a different feeling from reading his scenes. I agree that something seems off about him, but my personal opinion is that this "off-ness" is explained by a combination of the nature of Truthwatchers and Renarin's nature as a person.

I've been thinking about the two visions Dalinar sees that the Stormfather does not (the childhood with warm light at the end of WoR and seeing what he calls the champion in the beginning of OB). Is it plausible that they come from Renarin? Perhaps they, unknowingly, did what Shallan and Dalinar do with the map and Dalinar somehow enhances Renarin's powers and sees some future or past (or both). We can't really know one way or another since we don't actually know what Renarin can do, or what was going on with Dalinar and Shallan. I like the idea though.

Yes, Renarin seems pretty creepy and suspicious right now. I really hope he doesn't end up being Odium's champion, if for no other reason that the introvert-awkward-smart-guy-with-glasses-turns-evil thing is a huge trope I hope Brandon avoids. I think his actions here perfectly match the very little we know about Truthwatchers from in world Words of Radiance: They know things, but don't talk about it. I have speculated that their abilities involve some form of future sight, and, either as part of that or separate, they can tell when people aren't telling the truth. It would make sense, with either of those powers, to be quiet and generally secretive. I'd be morose and seem creepy too if I knew how everyone around me was going to die. And I wouldn't talk about it either. That knowledge is a burden that people shouldn't need to deal with (ask terminally ill patients how they feel about knowing even their general time and means of death). I also wouldn't want to be someone who constantly was pointing out people's harmless white lies, but would struggle with, say, knowing my brother killed someone, arguably justifiably. Overall it makes for an interesting character to me that we unfortunately just don't get to know much about just yet.

I'm thinking the author may be Renarin, because of this bit: That sounds an aweful lot like seeing into the future (and a group no less!). He's the only one we know of now that has any semplence of future sight, who would also be writing a book called Oathbringer. Also, these chapters were just all kinds of awesome. I'm a little surprised Kaladin found his parents so quickly, but I'm glad he did. Some may argue that Brandon should have built up more suspense first, but the suspense has been building for 2 books, no need for there to be more.

There's another thread here that I think helps explain people's feelings about these chapter. They are roughly half (or less) the length of the first chapters of the other Stormlight books. I think this explains why they feel strange. I definitely felt like they were short, but I thought that was just because I was desperate for more. If they were in fact significantly shorter than previously, it may explain why they feel less...complicated? than previous books.

That's been what I've been saying. Look at the beginning of all of Sanderson's other sequels (and not just his). They are all like this. I think the problem is that people are expecting it feel like the end of WoR, which it can't possibly be. The beta readers, who are not all die hard fans, all seemed to love the book, so I'm not worried.

I like this idea. I like it a lot. Would also explain why they "went away" after Kaladin started hanging around him. I've been expecting (or maybe hoping) Elhokar's story arc to be one of redemption. He's a terrible king, taking bad advice from the wrong people and making bad decisions at nearly every turn, but he finally grows up, gets his stuff together and becomes a good leader (maybe with some help from The Lopen and his mother). But that's not the way a person like Elhokar would react to the situation he finds himself in. We don't know for sure what he was like as a youth, but it's easy to speculate that he would have been selfish and/or spoiled, accustomed to getting what he wanted and for things to be easy for him. He had money and rank in a world where that meant he could do more or else whatever he wanted with little consequence. Then he gets thrust into a role he's not ready for with enormous responsibilities he can't handle. When he continues to fail to live up to what they have done, he would start to become bitter and resentful of Dalinar and Kaladin. That bitterness would turn to anger, and instead of continuing to try and improve himself, he'd embrace the easy path to power that the darkness would offer. A tale as old as time.

I'm following the thread, so I get email alerts for each new post. My email typically groups them as one email chain, each new email a response from the other. I've recently learned (because of this and the prologue thread) that it won't go beyond 100 emails in a single chain. It starts a new one. Barely 24 hours from the release of these chapters, and it's on the third chain already.

If that's true, then my original question still stands: how did people on the other side of the planet see this storm? Is it because it's that big? If so, why in the world wouldn't they believe it's a new Highstorm-esque thing?