Sophrosyne

For what it's worth when I first read the quote I wrote in my reading log (Don't judge they're helpful!) "Is this why they killed 'em!?" I suspect that this is one of those things that was meant to provoke that response. I don't know if the perspective shards have on time is something that would have been considered when Sanderson was writing but now that you've brought it up it seems like it'd be a big oversight. I do think it needs to be said that WoBs aren't 100% Cannon s Sanderson could decide to take back the 'only one dragon statement' and suddenly the time aspect becomes a weaker point. Question.: Do we know the life span of Sho Del?

I don't recall him complaining about that. I know he notes it that its curious that each only has half but his shards are comingled so there is no doing something as one other. it's the whole reason he needed a sword.

I have the impression that shardic telepathy was connection based. Like spren and radiant. TLM and WaT: I'm actually pretty sure Ruin was only able to talk to people with cracks in their souls because of Preservation's prison. but their specific situation was so... specific there no telling IMO. It's implied at least that all godmetals have unique properties, right? likely these two things are connected.

I've seen this around before (maybe you?). Where's it from I need to educate myself! Other wise you're 100% correct, I'd forgotten about the veins and just conflated the tower with The Sibling which is close to the truth but not it in actuality.

Well we do know from RoW that Nightblood CAN be satisfied though that was when attacking a shard. The important part is that it didn't seem to do any real damage to the shard. so somewhere before that point Night blood gets full up. Here's the issue. we don't know how much Towerlight The Sibling can make before hurting themselves. it's never been an issue. so, there's a few options. 1. The sibling can 'easily' satisfy Nightblood's investure requirement allowing him to be safely used in Urithiru. 2. The tower strains and or gets injured trying to sustain Nightblood. (This has implications, but I think they'd recover with abit of time.) 3. Nightblood is able to consume the whole of the spren that is Urithiru. We don't have hard numbers for spren, Nightblood, or really anything to do with Investure outside of SP4 so there no telling which if an any of those is more likly.

I think I like this idea MORE with refinement it could work. Honestly X happens Amass is a good way to make mistings feel like their doing jobs. TBH Mistborn is going to be prone to mana brakes, right? I mean anyone, in theory, can be a coinshot. A-gold and A-Copper U A-Iron and Steel Red A-Electrum White?

nah I get you, but I think Energy counters or 'Vial' tokens are the only ways to do to it. I like snow myself, but I don't think a mechanic in that vein is the right call here. This is a very good point. Is vial tracking actually something you want in the set. Another option is metal born get their base abilities, but vials let them flare.

I think the resource route is the way. spend X vial tokens or Investure get Y keyword. I don't think keywording the metals themselves would be silly though. Imagine someone not familiar with Mistborn having to memorize 16-42 keywords. Oof! I'd say many of the Allomatic abilities have parallels. Pewter =Firststrike and or indestructible. Steel = Fly or just tap for X damage.

Wow. The state of MTG sounds not great right now. I can't imagine having so little faith in a project so far into it. I'm with you Treamayne different border color would have gone a long way into making UB feel better. Coincidently I dropped MTG JUST before the first couple sets of UB, mostly due to set frequency.

HIHI! I'm not huge on MTG these days but i did play for years so maybe I can be of some help. So before I read your ideas i had a few 'low hanging fruit' ideas. * Bring back the old creature onesie Planeswalker other side for Mistborn characters. * Investure as a resource rather like energy or snow. * Some kind of land/metal mechanic. (TBH likely took complicated.) After reading I'm with Treamayne I think narrowing in the focus will help. I'd dare say pick one or two center pieces and build up around them. EX if you wanna focused on crews then we can make a set around planning and having as many bases covered as you can with limited resources. (Sorry I can't type more ATM leaving work)

That would imply that THREE dawn shards were on Roshar wouldn't it? I find it more likely that this is a survive situation where a common phrase is just Shadric command, a little 'd' Dawnshard.

Short Version: I don't think it makes sense. Maybe because I never read Wheel, I just don't see what this accomplishes. Heralds are already super powered matches for the unmade, why double up on them? To what end? Merging two halves of a magic system sounds nice but they aren't that. The Unmade are mini god spren that seem tailored for specific purposes. the heralds are generals and chain t bind a god. Surgebinding and void binding have Parrales because their two methods for the same powers, but issue is the Unmade have nothing to do with voidbinding so we're not bring anything together. TBH it's a cool idea, and feels like the sort of thing that could be extremely meaningful, but you can have allied spren without bonding them, see Notum.

Chills mate! This post has been reported for attempting to skirt the ruleThis post has been reported for attempting to skirt the rules chills! The heralds being made of Strom light is my second guess behind Sylphrena Strommother. I don't see much reason they couldn't give part of themselves to Radients and naturally reclaim that over time. Retribution COULD do that now; he's got no oaths stopping him. issue is the other shards are after him and he needs a base to defend himself. Plus, if he blew up Roshar he'd further scatter the spren and make it trivial for the heralds to sit in the SR for shards know how long and keep that much mor of Honor from his grasp.

YO! I'm well suited for this one. Saficed to say I've converted religions in my life and now well over a decade later I still use the 'wrong' swears when I'm scared, excited, or sleepy. So, from personal experience even if you have good reason to use another word a lifetime of using a particular one can be hard to impossible to fully overwrite. I think that younger people would have an easier time but even then, it'd take a generation or more to fully switch. 100% something like " That old man is swearing to harmony even though we've been saying to Discord now for 5 years!" Could set off alarms but I imagine it'll be a slow shift regardless.

Two things about shards: 1. They embody parts of a being and the Cosmere. Honor is all bonds from oaths sworn to gravity's tug. 2. None of their intents have been as strait forward as we want them to be. Ruin wanted change as much or more as it wanted destruction. With that in mind I just can't believe Virtuosity's intent is "skill at art/music". I think it's more in line with the second definition from The American Heritage Dictionary "An appreciation for or interest in fine objects of art" a lesser used meaning that goes as far as to explain why the Vessel willingly splintered her power. and fits Change/Feel extremely well. TBH I've just no clue about Endowment. complete mystery that one is. if I had to guess here intent is JUST gift giving, and that's why Edgil so content to just do nothing. she acted to change her world and people, and the power will request nothing more of her.

Shards, I hope you're right on this one, my #1 complaint about Brandon is that all his worlds lose their special sauce before the 1st arc is done. Yeah, I'm p sure their minds experience Ashyn and their bodies go to Braize. Funny thought that the fused try anti-light and capturing but because part of them is just elsewhere they just keep reforming and slowly drain from Retribution.

I think this is a good question but it's not one we can answer. It was only in SP4 we got a unit of measurement for investure and to be frank it's not helpful on scales like this given we don't even have how many BEU say a mistborn has or a given spren. It seems clear to me that the 'basic'/'mindless' spren (Flame, Gloom, etc.) < Raidentspren (Mist, Honour), < Uniquespren (Cusicesh) < Unmade (who have their own Tiers) and finally Godspren like the Stormfather and Nightwatcher. Again, to the best of my knowledge there's no way to know how big the gaps are. I'd assume based off standard storytelling that the amount of Honor left unclaimed is enough to make Retribution weaker than Harmony but still massively stronger than the other shards forcing them to team up to deal with him. 100% it protects both Honor and Cultivation's and it likely protects Odium's either directly in the wording of the 'contract' or indirectly in that the only counter to spren is other spren. and killing them with antilight is an option but HUGLY inefficient as compared to just killing the heralds and dissolving the pact. Pure speculation but I think unclaimed bit's of Honour had to go SOMEWHERE and alot of it 'chose' to go to not Retribution, thus the power boost to Sylphrena. Maybe other Spren will benefit? Sadly they can't. The Sibling can only make tower light, it's mention here and there that it'd be useful if they could make the others but it's just not within their power. Hopfully this was legible!

Amazing post my Dofurion! All of the Dawnshard posts are really. I think you may have me onboard with your groupings. I've never been big on the idea of two dawn shards effecting each shard, it felt like we were going a bridge to far seeing as we only had the 'it makes sense' argument to work from. but with the paring of shards, you demonstrated in chapter 3 I think it's abit too neat to be coincidental. and what with us knowing Bradon was very intentional when he split Ado. you have me sold. On a different not this confirms to me that it will be a long while before we get DS 3 &4 because as soon as we have one, we can sort out the rest without too much issue.

I could see both shards caring about their world. The whole 'if you destroy the planet what can you rule?' Covers Dominion and Devotion is supposed to be a love stand in. Nice catch Aldar!

Welcome to the shard, if you're sticking around, I highly recommend an intro post, tell us what books you've read and how you feel about the (lowly) Windrunners~ Soo, Maybe? I see your point but I raise you this. I'm pretty sure in Harmony, the shard's, case it refers to definition 2. Thus Harmony‘s intent covers all forms of non-destructive coexistence. This DOES fact exclude Ruin from the equation but that's kind of the point with the Harmony/Discord thing. Sazed is channeling them in such a way that he can prevent Ruin but that also inhibits his own actions. I think this may be a case in which the vessel's interpretation of a shard matters so maybe someone else holding Retribution would instead have IDK Grievance? I think the reason Harmony feels weird, because it DOES feel weird, is that 1. The word harmony is being used in a very different way than is expected. 2. The combination of Preservation & Ruin is naturally Discord in the "Tension or strife resulting from a lack of agreement; dissension." sense. Man, I hope that made since I got interrupted a lot. PS I like the bolding of a Shard's name I'll be using that from now on me thinks~

If your point is simply that someone holding Honor's power has always accepted the words therefore Honor's Intent matters, The Wind, Dalanar, The Sibling and Cultivation have all accepted words on various occasions, so that's moot. I'm really not trying to be argumentative for the sake of it I'm just not sure what the root of this is. So I'm having trouble doing much more then, trying, to debunk the last thing you said. What about Radiant bonds makes it so that Honor's intent is a factor? and why is Cultivations intent, seemingly, not one? I mean look at sand mastery. What does that have to do with Autonomy?

I wonder if he's a unique fused, and guess that if it were the case, it's likely because he has a Radiant spren bonded one way or another.

@scudalarm is pretty much right to the best of my knowledge. Though h w EXACTLY, the Nightwatcher and Sibling were made isn't completely clear to me. but The Stromfather is said to be a simple humans feared the storms so much they made a spren of it.

What I was saying before is that Honor's power means very little when discussing Radiant oaths. so what the power wants is irrelevant to the system that was made. Preservations Intent means nothing to an Allomancer right? So I guess my question is: Why is Honor's intent important to this conversation but Not Cultivations? Or the many fragments of gods running around?

I think you're making false comparisons here. The shard Honor cares only about the oaths. This is new information. but Radiant oaths are Honor's power. They're a system set up by Tanner and the True spren. The system makes it so the Nahel bond is super charged by oaths. the whole, having to be ready and an external force accepting the words are a sign of this. As for Why Gavilar's words didn't work. I've no clue but it's important to note that just because the Stromfather is of honor doesn't mean he has the same rules or thought process.