yankorro

Hey, thanks folks. A few responses here: again, to help me clarify my own thoughts more than to argue or rebut your points. Two McMillion: yes, the Manticore is meant to be a bit incongruous. It's like Bigfoot or the Catty wompus or something like that. And you're right, the 'story world' is markedly sexist in many ways. It's meant to seem like a hostile environment and not just in the sense that they're in the desert... Mandamon: pg1 - They're in Angeltown (it's mentioned in the middle of the paragraph, but I should make that clear in the first sentence I suppose. Thanks for pointing that out). Meaning they head back east to buy supplies, then west again to the settlement. So yeah, zigzagging. Maybe a little confusing... p5,6 - see comment above, it's meant to seem like a folk tale for the time being p9 - They're about a three days ride from the settlement, so it's supposed he headed back that way. Is that unrealistic?

I was always terrible at cards. Either I didn't get the rules when I played or didn't really care if I won or lost in the first place. Or maybe I just just had other things I wanted to throw my money away on... That having been said, I can agree with jParker that this little story works all right. Thought I must say my eyes glazed over a bit at the end with all the blow by blow card flipping. And I got the feeling that something more could have been made of the bit with the Indian dying mid-game. The way I read it was kind of like, "Yeah, so, then like the Indian dude dies. Moving on..." Maybe paint the picture more vividly, stretch out the subjective time so that the man's death takes on a little bit more weight in the narrative, make the stakes seem a little higher. Not much else to say about this one--I hesitate to write a critique that's longer than the actual piece--so I'll stop here. Not bad stuff, not at all.

hello there, as always take my comments with a healthy dose of salt... first impressions (story, setting, character): YA fantasy, in a vaguely Asian sort of secondary world with 'physical magic' (i'm kind of imagining something like the crazy old Taoists do in a 80s Tsui Hark kung-fu movie for example). We also seem to have an orphan who's going to magic school, which as I'm sure you're aware is territory that has been trod upon before and so I'm sure you'll be careful not to Harry-Potter it up too terribly much. more specifically: in the first scene i feel there's a slight imbalance in the proportion to action and exposition. it seems awfully frontloaded with exposition in the first few paragraphs--which may mean it's a simple fix to just move some of that information further back. As a reader I like to ask myself questions about what I'm reading, and then discover the answers as I go on, which keeps me reading. i think i would get more out of a scene like the first one if you gave me more of the scene itself in the present moment--girl getting chased by boys in the alley--which makes me wonder 'why are they chasing her?' Then you come in with the exposition you're answering my questions and as a reader i feel satisfied. don't know if that makes any sense. in any case, it may be just personal preference on my part. looking forward to more...

Heres the topic for my latest thing. As I mentioned in the email I'm looking for: - problems with story mechanics (conflict? motivation?) and any concrete suggestions or ideas for how to change things - worldbuilding head-scratchers - stylistic speedbumps anything else you might feel like commenting on or pointing out thanks! ~NMW

No new blood here. Silk, if no one outside of the recent core of posters pops up I'd like to submit. Again, if anyone else has something I'm more than happy to sit out a week. Otherwise, I'd like to have a go.

andyk, thanks for catching those redundancies. one of them i'd already remedied in a more recent draft, but the one about the raindrops had escaped my attention. And I think that WE listeners are probably the best demographic I could ask help from. Story mechanics seem to be my bugbear, so it's good that the focus here is largely on that (hell, in my case at least ...)

Mandamon: Cool, thanks for clarifying. I will keep an eye on that!

You said a mouthful there! If it's any help at all, I didn't find the nominalization "The angel" throughout to be repetitive at all. I actually found it interesting.

Thanks again for your feedback (and your patience with my slow-as-molasses storytelling), folks. It means a lot. First of all I have to say, I'm wondering: What exactly constitutes 'action'? 'Things' 'happening'? I'm not being facetious, I honestly think it would help me out if we defined our terms a little bit. Because in chapter three there's some talking, some shooting, some dancing and some more talking. And in chapter 4, more talking, and yet Mandamon you say there was more action in Chapter 4. What's creating that sensation? A related question: If, as you say, "I'm ready for something to happen to reward my investment in the book", what would it take to do such a thing? Point taken about the hillfolk and their trust issues. My thinking was as Mandamon says, they may not but the most trusting people but they have their honor, and want to make amends for their wrongs. Also, good catch Mandamon about there not being any sense of setting in Chapter 4. Will go back and add it in now. They're supposed to be in the same plaza in Angeltown where Rose has a run-in with a 'loverboy' and meets Prince. It's meant to parallel a) the first scene where the grey-haired man meets Rose and the scene where Rose meets the 'loverboy'. So if you're asking yourself 'where the heck are these people?' that's bad. If you're wondering 'what's this guy's connection to the story?' I'm tempted to say that's a good thing.

After one abortive attempt I finally got out this week's email. As I noted in the mail... "Previously, Rose rolled into Angeltown after a short stay in the women's prison, just beginning her search for the legendary Western Manticore. She meets Prince, a ex-member of the Neoamerican (formerly New Mexican) aristocracy slumming in Angeltown who happens to be the nephew of Rose's protector at the prison, Amparo. Prince helps Rose find a place to stay, but the atmosphere of the Hotel El Dorado doesn't sit well with her and she decides to leave. So she heads into the desert, shacking up in an old shepherd's refuge. From there she hunts lizards and sketches maps of the territory until she runs into some of the locals, who chase her off, and one especially zealous youngster attacks her and tries to choke her out with a rope. Fade to black etc etc..." Let me know what's not working...you know * scenes that could be cut or rolled together * Parts that don't make sense * Things you liked etc.

I enjoyed this. There's a certain ambiguity about the nature of the angel that's quite intriguing, and his take on human society is quite humorous. It's curious, I remember in the other chapter, there was a bit where the narrator referred to someone with the name "Epic-beard" and I commented that it was a bit odd. Here though, when the angel calls the guy Mustache or Unkempt-Mustache it seems to fit with his detached, inhuman perspective. That said, I wonder if the set-up with this intro is going to make the first chapter seem like too much of a slowdown in tempo. We start off with bam, aliens ripping people apart and then, the stranger in town moseys into a bar. Not saying it couldn't work, but it's something to think about as you go back and revise. Looking forward to the next bit ~NMW

Hello andyk, the following are notes I made as I was reading. Hope they're helpful! I found myself having trouble following the first part. Things seem to get a little cluttered after the first paragraph. For example: >"A red-faced waggon driver blanched as Varus turned, revealing his scarred face and muscled body." To begin with, we get the reaction of the driver before we see the cause of that reaction. It might seem nitpicky but I feel that its better on the microlevel to keep the events in a sentence in chronological order (unless there's a strongly compelling reason to do otherwise). As in, "Varus turned, and the wagon driver blanched at the sight of his scarred face and muscled body." for example. Also, syntactically it's a little ambiguous whether the scarred face etc. belongs to Varus or to the driver. >"The driver was being hassled..." Normally I'm not very hawkish about passive voice. Here though it takes away from my visualization of the scene. Who's hassling him? How? What exactly is going on? I think the choice of verb 'hassle' also might be problematic. If you made the verb active, with the growing crowd doing the action, and a more concrete verb the image would come together more. Then with the meeting of the girl, I think the description of her eyecolor is a striking enough detail that it should be presented up front, to "catch the reader's eye" so to speak and let that detail color our perception of her from the getgo. Also, that level of detail tells me that this girl will probably show up again, am I wrong about that? If she doesn't, I would make her a little more 'non-descript' as they say. Also, I must say her behavior is quite strange, motivation-wise. I don't know a lot about gender in Roman society but it seems odd to me for a young girl to waltz up to some battle-hardened soldier in the street and offer him help. Or not. I could very easily be wrong. (Wait a second, i just read through to the end of the scene. Im guessing she's the one that picked his pocket. So yeah, there's her motivation. Scratch all that.) Hey look, a manticore!! =) Something similar to my qualms with the first scene happens again with the old wizard. >>Someone barged into him and he turned, sword half-drawn. >Get out of my way, you great lumox.' A man in long robes and a neat white beard was glaring up at him. >Varus stared, angry and bewildered. Who was this little old man to boss him around? Syntactically it's all a bit fuzzy what all's happening here. Which one says get out of my way? I don't want to have to read through a couple of sentences in order to figure out that it was the old man yelling at Varus and not the other way around. I think this could be fixed just by switching the dialogue with the 'beat', i.e. "A man in long robes and a neat white beard was glaring up at him. 'Get out of my way, you great lummox!' Also, the 'f-bomb' that Varus drops in interior monologue struck me as being way, way out-of-place. Honest questio(and a relatively minor point): did the Romans traditionally wear 'black' for mourning? How far back does that go? Chapter ends nicely, on a down note. I'm a fan of that sort of thing. =)

I know I've been kind of hogging up slots for the past few weeks now, but I'd like to send out the next couple chapters if no one else is going to. If a bunch of other people want to submit though I'd be fine with waiting.

Many thanks to Mandamon for the thoughtful words just now. I definitely agree that maybe the stuff I'm trying to do doesn't jibe 100% with what most folks would consider commercial genre fiction. However I'm also not the type to turn up my nose at anything. My stuff needs work. Getting a different perspective on it--even if, or especially if, it's a radically different perspective--is something I find supremely helpful, and which I appreciate quite a bit. Sometimes you know something isn't working, and all it takes is someone else pointing out what you already know--that it's not working--to somehow make it click in your mind how to do so. I've already done a revision of this chapter and it's already way better. The feedback you guys are giving is helping me make it what I want it to be, can't ask for much more than that. So, thanks again!

Hello. As usual, it's quite clear you did your homework. As Mandamon says the level of period detail is quite convincing. I also agree that the naming conventions get a little confusing. Especially in the second paragraph I think it was where we gets descriptions of all his comrades; at that point I was thinking "hooo, boy, trying to tell Marcus and Brutus and Varus and Julius apart is gonna be fun..." The whole time I was reading, I was wondering: "Is this gonna be the typical sort of first chapter where the viewpoint character gets killed and it turns out the main character is someone else?" Then of course, he gets killed. But then he survived, which was nice as it kind of satisfied my expectation and flouted it at the same time. I don't have a lot of questions per se about magic, strategy, etc. If I have one criticism it's with the interior monologue at the beginning. We spend a whole lot of time in Varus's head (or in his circulatory system, as the case may be ) before anything really happens. That said, I enjoyed it; reminded me of my phase as a kid and devouring "Asterix the Gaul" comics (I imagine we'll get some scenes from the Gallic point of view as well, right?)

Oh, man. I think I have an idea of what you guys are gonna say about the whole rest of this story. "I like the description but, like, nothing happens". Most likely I'll be smashing together the two incidents with the hillfolk into one, cutting out some other bits and strategically sprinkling about in later spots where they'll hopefully seem less wandering and aimless.

I hear you on the hatchet job I linked to and can relate--there should be a specific word in the dictionary for the type of indignation one feels when someone dumps all over what they're into. RIpe and Ruin, that's got a nice ring to it. Glad you liked Manticore Rose as a title, hopefully I'll end up with something at least somewhat worthwhile to back it up!!!

I also recognized the Rothfuss thing and I haven't even read his stuff. (Well, I tried and decided it wasn't for me.) I specifically remembered the 'cut-flower' bit from a very ornery review lambasting his prose style, which focused very heavily on his use of this sort of imagery, 'cut-flower sounds' and things like that. I decided to google it to try and find the blogpost in question. Then I got like a zillion hits for "cut-flower sound", all related to Rothfuss. The only reason I bring it up is that it seems to me (at the very least from a branding or marketing standpoint *gag*) it might not be the best move to use it as your work's title. (I eventually found the blog in question here, pretty entertaining if you like your book reviews with extra vitriol): http://ronanwills.wordpress.com/2013/03/17/lets-read-the-name-of-the-wind-ch-1/)

Hi there! Well, our two Western-themed stories do seem to share one thing, the classic "Stranger comes to town" trope. But yeah, the differences end there I think. I enjoyed reading this first chapter but there was something bugging me, and I think it has to do with the 'tone' of the piece, or the 'voice' of the narrator, which seems inconsistent in spots. Or rather than inconsistent it seems like it crosses a line it ought not to cross--specifically I'm referring to some of the more humorous asides. So if you don't mind, itll probably just be easier for me to point out and nitpick each of these. For example I agree that the line in the first paragraph about Nature is a little too ambiguously worded to be effective. Try capitalizing Nature, or maybe change to Mother Nature. Also, the paragraph break there adds to the confusion. Maybe join the two? The epithets 'epic-beard' and 'grandfather-beard' seem totally out of place to my ear. Too much of a Whedon-y thing maybe? It suggests a sort of uber-modern, parodic perspective that isn't suggested anywhere else in the text. There are flashes of humor from the narrator, in sort of 'WIld West Raymond Chandler sort of way, but this just sticks out to me. Personally I would dial it back to a simple 'The man with the epic beard' etc. Then again, the protagonist's name is Elmer Cudde. Is that intentionally similar to Elmer Fudd of Looney Tunes fame? 'If we stayed on topic' - honestly I could be wrong and this could have been a totally acceptable usage in the mid19th century, but it seems a little anachronistic 'precocious felines' - Like Mandamon Im not sure I get this one. Felines who are unusually advanced for their young age? Maybe precocious isn't the right word? Prissy, precious, pretentious? One other thing I would strip out the attribution from the first sentence. Instead of 'It was a very lucky thing, Elmer decided, that he didn't mind monotony', how about 'It was a very lucky thing that Elmer didn't mind monotony.' Curious to see how it comes along in the future!

Here's the topic for chapter two of Manticore Rose. Do your worst...

id also like to submit this week (if no one's opposed to me doing so three weeks running now...)

Hello. I've just given a quick read through Chapter 1. Looking at some of the comments above, I agree with Two McMillions about the narrative voice. I wouldn't want to put words in anyone's mouth, but I think I know what he's referring to with the narrator "performing". I'mjust not sure I can explain it properly. Basically from the first chapter I get two impressions, which are kind of important to have clear from the beginning. A) This is YA fiction. or at least I think so, I haven't read Young Adult since I was a young adult but that's the vibe I get. This is going to be a humorous piece. Or fairly humorous anyway. Keeping these two things in mind, what I notice is that there are moments where you seem to be using purposefully anachronistic language in a fantasy setting. Not like, you know, knights in shining armor being like "What up, dude?", but almost. It seems odd for someone in this type of setting to use language like "zoom out of reality". But at other times it's quite comedic, especially in the last bit of dialogue. This could actually be a really entertaining way of approaching the character if you're careful with it.

Thanks, jParker. Glad we're not stepping on each other's toes story-wise Couple things that I will respond to here if for no other reason than to help me get my head around stuff. Re mental illness: I guess I should go back at take a hard look at whatever clues I'm giving in the intro that Rose is crazy. My intention was that she doesn't actually start out clinically insane. May have to dial that back to 'eccentric' somehow. 'Azure': that bit was supposed to be from her notes, not the aunt's letter. Again, maybe not clear enough. The 'neighbors': Yeah, needs a little spice. I think I have an idea, though... Info-dump: Yeah, I figured as much. Sometimes I feel like it feels better just to get it all out of the way and move on. In fact I often feel like the judicious shoehorning-in of clues and details and so forth can feel just as conspicuous and artificial as one character spouting off an entire paragraph of exposition. But that's just me... And BTW 'sin miedo' is a perfectly common colloquial way of saying 'don't be shy' or 'don't hold back'. The actual command part is understood. Less pushy than giving an actual command ('no tengas miedo'). But since that entire scene is probably getting the hatchet, the question is moot!

Wow, y'all are quick!!! Mandamon, you have a preternatural talent for sniffing out the autobiographically-inspired episodes that I stick into my stories when I'm not sure where else to go, and then pointing out that they don't serve any real purpose in the narrative I seem to recall a similar incident with my last story. Guess I'll be hacking that apart come revision time... Maybe by cutting that out...the 'plodding' sensation that Two MIllions mentions would be lessened and the twist that he (she?) refers to would come a little earlier to draw the reader in. Thanks a lot for your candid first impressions, very helpful!!! ~NMW

Hi all, First of all, my thanks go out to everyone who read and gave feedback on the first part. Very helpful. Hopefully you all won't be too busy with NaNoWriMo (or whatever commitments you might have) and you can have a look at this next bit. Ah, and one thing I forgot to include in the email I just sent out: In case you missed the first installment, basically a woman named Rose tells her life story to a stranger on a train. Suffice it to say she's had a hard (yet interesting) life. She's on a search for the Manticore which once read lives in the mountains of southern New Mexico. She gets off the train in Angeltown, which is where this chapter starts. As I said in the email, let me know: stuff you thought was cool, boring or confusing parts, bits where suspension of disbelief is being strained, and whether the info-dump part is too transparently info-dumpy. Thanks in advance ~NMW