Whysper
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Everything posted by Whysper
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Alright, not sure what to make of that new info from Dannex. I guess it sort of sounds like a Villager thing to do. I don't know why an Elim would try to claim this towards EoD. It doesn't seem like it would help much on the surface. But I think I have to keep my vote on Dannex just in case if only for self-pres. Especially if he has vote manipulation also. I can't really be sure he's not Elim making up this crazy story. EDIT: Oh wait, I didn't realize the wagon on Dannex had grown so large.
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Ummm wait, are you claiming that you used vote manipulation to move a vote off yourself but didn't vote Illwei directly to self-pres?? Didn't you also say you weren't on at the end of the day? Or did you not use your vote manipulation and all that was done by someone else?
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Oh man, this bothers me too. They do this a lot on my home site, and usually for certain players. There are certain players that get slapped with a Village read almost instantly, like the moment they make their first post. People seem to be confident that they have an accurate meta read of them. But I think it's really just that always giving someone a Village read will be correct around 75% of the time just based on the chance of rolling Villager. So after a few games of doing this, they feel like they've gotten it mostly correct.
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I was a bit surprised to see Books and Elandera as your top Elim reads. Well, maybe not so much for Elandera since I think one or two others voiced suspicion of her. Books I've kind of had as null because I hadn't seen much from him, but I think I'll need to go back and review his posts in isolation to see if I missed something there. BTW, I probably won't make it back before EoD. Maybe I'll be able to check the thread quickly but probably won't have a chance to post.
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First of all, being 24 hours later means nothing. People take the time to go over the thread later and notice things they didn't at first. Secondly, Gears posted like 2 minutes after me with his wallpost going over everything in the thread so far and he had the same thought. So again to my first point, after going through the thread carefully, someone else picked up on it. You seem to be nitpicking the way I posted as a defense. I put my vote first before anything else so it was easier to pick out and notice that's what the post was about. Also, it was a singular post because you hardly did anything else! And that was part of my point and something you leave out. My point was that you threw up this comment shading a bunch of people, then basically left and did nothing else. I thought it was worthy enough of a D1 vote to see where it went. At least this was more than a bunch of the poke votes getting thrown around.
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Dannex (Striker) Hmm, I think you are probably right that Dannex's flip will give the most info regarding everyone else surrounding that vote. I may have jumped too quickly on voting Striker just because I thought he was intentionally shading me. It's still a possibility that he's Elim and that he was indeed doing so, but from his response to me since I could see him as Villager. I think I need to get some distance from the situation and come back later to judge things better.
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Hmm okay, perhaps I got a bit too sensitive on this. Your apology makes me feed bad about how I took it. It's just that I've had stuff like this happen before and know I need to react to it before tunneling starts to occur. It's frustrating to have to deal with that the whole game through and pretty much have no way to counteract it because everything I say anymore just gets twisted to fit the initial impression that was put forth. How are Araris and Dannex connected for their alignment? Was it just by the vote? I'm not sure that I understand the part where you talk about what happens if Dannex flip Village. You were kind of suggesting that an Elim might vote to break a V/V tie. I guess that's possible, but I don't really see how that's anywhere more likely to consider instead of just a Villager breaking a tie. Basically Dannex being Villager is NAI for Ash. I suppose you are saying the same thing in your own way. But it just feels weird for you to somewhat emphasize the Elim possibility instead of simply saying that the Village read on Ash isn't as strong.
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Okay, this has got to be one of the most insidious forms of shade I've seen. Usually when I've seen people shade, it's for a more specific action or thing that's been said. Like where Dannex was saying the misunderstandings could be Elim handiwork. However, Striker's comment is basically crafted in a way to discredit anything I say for the rest of the game. It's like, if I say anything that sounds reasonable, then I'm just an Elim staying on the edge of reasonableness (that reminds me of that Tom Cruise movie Edge of Oblivion or something like that ). Then of course if I were to say anything unreasonable, then people aren't going to take much stock in it anyway. So basically don't listen to anything from me. Oh, there might be some perfect Goldilocks level of reasonableness or interactions that Striker would say is just right for me to have. But then with this kind of game, people are always leaning towards suspicions. It reminds me of a game I played where I was tunneled the whole game through. I had been discussing thoughts with someone and expressed something about keeping an open mind. And I think I said something about keeping an eye out for deep wolf possibilities because that had happened in the game I played right before that. Well, one player in the town core just railed on me for that. She was saying that I was pushing an agenda for seeking a deep wolf. And that my open-mindedness was somehow anti-town behavior and I'm trying to get people to not listen to the town core. Oh man, it was ridiculous. So yeah, not liking what Striker is trying to do here. And if it was just this, then maybe I could just see it as a Villager with crazy expectations like in that other game I played. But then there's the chain of executions that he's trying to set up in the same post. So he's got a chain going here: Araris => Dannex => Ash So like he wants to focus on Araris today. Says that if Araris is Elim, then Dannex probably is also. Yet he hedges by saying he thinks Dannex is an okay exe today, which means that even if Araris is Villager, he'd still keep Dannex in the PoE and probably go after him next day. Then what's up with saying that if Dannex is Elim, then Ash would probably be one, too? I think everyone has been agreeing that Ash's tie vote on Dannex makes him likely Villager. With the degree based on whether Dannex is Elim or not. So like if Dannex is Elim, then Ash is most certainly not Elim. BTW, not saying that I've cleared Dannex from the PoE. I had voted him yesterday and do still consider him within the PoE. I'm just pointing out this chain Striker has going. Dannex could very well still be Elim within this and Striker is just pre-bussing him. Preparing to get some nice Villager cred. Then maybe use this to try getting us to exe Ash next. Anyway, going to drop my vote on Striker for now. He's gone to looking worse than Dannex. StrikerEZ Oh, scanned back through Striker's post to see if I missed anything. Saw this and probably should go ahead and reply to this also. In general, I feel Elims avoid getting too involved in the votes because people tend to look closely at them after-the-fact. So something like suggesting to tie the vote seems to draw unnecessary attention for no purpose. So that was my original thinking. But yeah, I guess an Elim could still do this to look like a Villager. An Elim that's comfortable enough might do anything like this. So I guess you've talked me into discounting this as Villager AI for you.
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I'm finishing up brunch now. I'll try to get back later today to reply to that longer post. Couple areas I have something to say about.
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Oh, I just realized. There wasn't a 2nd NK for the Assassin. I wonder if they forgot to submit their action.
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Ahhh yes, maybe that's all it is. Them being nice. I remember playing a game where Gears was killed N1 and people just thinking how mean that was since he'd been killed a lot in recent times before that.
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Oh okay, got it. It doesn't exactly affect the Villager read other than making it stronger if Dannex is Elim. Okay, I see now.
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Could you explain this more? I went back and saw that Ash voted Dannex right at the end there. Sounded like it was to avoid a tie. How does Dannex's actual alignment affect the read on Ash?
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Haha, I was just noticing that myself.
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They've mostly been RPing and hasn't contributed much, but that isn't uncommon for a new player. I'm reading them as slight village because elim!FMN might have been advised by their teammates to keep a lower profile or use their newness more. I'm definitely opposed to exeing them. Haha, what you just said sounds contradictory. I'm not sure how she could go any lower profile than mostly RPing and not contributing much. But just to be clear, I'm assuming she's Villager for now and want to give her a chance to do more and get use to the game.
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I'm leaning him Villager. Though I'm still confused about what he was doing with the insistence on tying the votes earlier then later going against that himself. I think he argued that it made more sense earlier in the day and not later, but I still don't get that. But as far as alignment, I really don't think the Elims would even try doing anything like suggesting to tie the vote, so this comes off as a Villager suggestion that's just confusing. Hmm yeah, I don't think TUO really even talked much, so not sure why they bothered killing them. I thought Elims usually kept around the null slots as potential MLs for later. But you might be right about it simply being to keep from revealing anything with another kill. Just for the record, I did post during the night. With a bit of a long post actually where I explained my vote on Dannex since some people were suggesting there was no reasoning behind the Dannex wagon.
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Just to further expand on the reasoning for voting Dannex, here's what I said originally. So it's really a combination of the shading for all the misunderstandings, plus doing it in a rather hedgy way. Then also that he only posted that and nothing else up to that point. And on the vote manipulation, even though Dannex didn't vote to self-pres, the fact that a Spokesperson saved them is indeed interesting. If it's V!SP, I'm wondering why they specifically chose to save Dannex over Illwei. If it's E!SP, then either saving an Elim teammate who couldn't be online to save himself. Or making Dannex look bad as Gears mentioned as a possibility. Which I guess would be rather clever to get us focused on him for the next day. EDIT: I started with 0 spheres.
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Yeah, SE (and Forum Mafia in general) are definitely a whole new experience. It's actually nice to get introduced on this site. Most of the games here involve quite a bit of mech, so at least there's that to get involved with. Because the social read aspect can be kind of confusing and intimidating at first. Other sites often have games purely based on social reads. But stick with it because it does get addicting.
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Hmm, I think I respected your vote more when I thought it was just some random poke vote. Given that I generally don't post a whole lot at once unless I have to combine responses to multiple posts due to catching up. And there hasn't been all that much to respond to so far. And when I have, people have posted in between so haven't needed to combine. So yeah, kind of looking like you are stretching for reasons on this.
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Haha, mindmeld on this Glad you noticed this also.
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Dannex Getting a bit of an Elim vibe from this. He pops in with this post that basically shades people for the misunderstandings. And in a hedging way at that. And then nothing more from him. I don't think Elims would draw such attention with a tactic like this since misunderstandings are easily cleared up by other players and by the host.
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Ahhh okay. I went back to check and you are correct.
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I know people like to do the whole RVS and poke/pressure votes, but it's never really been my thing. But I guess it's fine people do it for discussion. I was curious about forget me not. Don't want to vote them, but I think that's the only completely new name for me. I've only seen a couple RP posts from them, so just hope they can get involved more. @forget me not hello What's your experience with SE and/or Forum Mafia? EDIT: Oh, and I just realized the irony if somehow they were the only person I forgot about from other games.
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Thanks for this. It's a good explanation behind the mechanics/reasoning for the order, so now I understand it better. This is a good point. We shouldn't have the Highprinces claiming. Hmm, can't any claims wait until such a situation occurs? I mean, I have a feeling that any Elim HPs aren't going to do anything so obvious anyway. They will probably just go along with the suggested order of events. EDIT: Haha, reminds me of that one game where we were on a spaceship and had the anon doc for people controlling that one entity and you were PMing everyone to get info to figure everyone out.
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The order Gears presented makes sense. The Highstorm C3 is automatic. So then waiting for Democracy until after both Highstorms is good.
