Void89

He has a personal healer, his brother, plate and blade - sure he might not be as powerful as a full fledged radiant but as it is now he is far from useless or 'dead weight' - if he actually becomes an edgedancer and can't swear the first 3 ideals instantly he would actually be more in danger than he is now. Because, as we all know, blade comes with the 3rd ideal. And until then he wouldn't even be able to use a dead spren because of the crazy screaming action in his head. That said it's actually more likely he dies if he becomes an edgedancer because I can't think of any scenario where it's 'good writing' or believable where he's close to death and then: 'Wait I got this - Life before death, strength before weakness, journey before destination - I will remember those who have been ignored - wait don't kill me yet there is one more - just need to catch my breath first... right aaaand I will listen to those who have been ignored' Yeah... probably not... PS: thanks to whoever fused my 2 posts

Was talking about edgedancers as well, I thought that was obvious given the topic and the ideals I wrote down after the first, my bad Also, because it's somewhat relevant and fitting Oh, Adolin, Shallan thought. He’d arrived at a theory he liked, and now wouldn’t let it go. It was a common mistake warned of in her scientific books.

I do too, but given the evidence it probably will happen, although as I mentioned almost certainly not as soon and as 'easy' as some people here hope for

Ok my post might have been too long to see that easily sorry about that I'll shorten it since I think you misunderstood: How he did it is important, it was butchery - also no remorse on that, and he had violent thoughts against him throughout the entire 2nd book. His actions when he finally did it weren't reasonable it was anger - he later reasoned with himself and others that it was the right thing to do. But at the very moment he did it there was just anger there - no noble driven self sacrifice for the 'greater good'. You might be right on elokhar, I have to admit I don't remember that if that really stood in the book ok, my bad - still not the only point I mentioned

Kaladin never told Moash about roshone, all he said to him was that he was responsible for the 2 dead silversmiths moash blamed elokhar for. Also, until Kaladin has ascended to radiance he was technically dead and invisible - I doubt they bothered a lot keeping their paperwork in order after he got famous, since they had much bigger problems at hand

I think it's a certainty that adolin will become radiant, sometime. Enough foreshadowing was done, so something probably will happen - either some half alive maya giving him minor surges or so or some miraculous way to actually revive her fully... that said, the operative word is 'sometime' Let's not forget that in order to become radiant you actually have to swear the oaths and mean them! That's the basic stuff for alive spren. So I can imagine that you have to really mean and live them as well as having some help or whatever else is necessary to revive a dead spren. And Adolin as it is is nowhere near ready to swear the oaths. The very first words of the first ideal are 'Life before death' yet Adolin was eager to punch/kill/maim sadeas from the very start, and that never changed throughout WoR, if you pay attention to the dialogues and monologues he had on that subject, until he acted on it in the most brutal of ways. (Regardless if he deserved it or not, that is not the issue here - Ameram and Elokhar deserved it too at that time and Kaladin lost Syl because of only considering it). And at the end of OB he didn't even show remorse for how he did it, nope, he would do it again this instant if given a chance. Regardless of the other stuff that comes next I actually think the killing of sadeas is the biggest issue that stands between him and his possible ascension to a knight radiant. The second ideal is 'I will remember those who have been forgotten' and although he does occasionally show signs that he might understand that ideal, at several times he also forgets about other people or simply ignores them like elokhar after he died. I think he didn't mention his dead cousin once at any time in shadesmar, or how he hates and dismisses his bodyguards simply for the fact that they were kaladins men in WoR as he told Renarin. The third ideal is 'I will listen to those who have been ignored' Let's recap: Ignoring Kaladin at several Warcouncils, going so far to say 'Does the bridgeboy have to be here?' - Dismissing Dalinars visions for the better part of a book - Ignoring Shallans objections about learning how to duel, etc Obviously he didn't only mess up all the time, but all the stuff he actually remembers and would speak for him getting radiant have already been mentioned several times. But fact is that, as far as we know, spren don't say stuff like 'mhh right you did care that time and the other time, let's forget about the one time you didn't then - all good let's bond' That wouldn't be enough for a spren that is alive as far as we know so it most certainly isn't enough for a dead one. He might be on the way to become radiant but the fastest date that will probably happen is at the very end of SA4.

How would they know? Not like they have social media or computers or anything of the sort. Darkeyes don't even have surnames, Stormblessed is just a name he was given by his men. Would be storming difficult or a hell of a coincidence if they just ask around 'hey any of you know that windrunner guy?' And somebody actually knows (especially since he isn't the only one any longer)

Don't know if this has been mentioned before but another quite interesting quote about Shallan that is easily missed because it's so very short: When Pattern talks with Shallan after the Chasm scene in WoR on how she could progress as a Lightweaver: "There is something more you must do". - "Words?" Shallan said. - "You have said the words." Pattern said. "You said them long ago. No. It is not words that you lack it is truth." - "You prefer lies." - "Mhhh, Yes and you are a lie, a powerful one. However what you do is not just lie. It is truth and lie mixed. You must understand both." (WoR, Chapter 75, True Glory) That really leads me to believe that we haven't seen the real Shallan quite yet, various aspects of her, more or less truthful sure, but an illusion nonetheless.

Well Veil still has all the shallan memories as well, could be some parallel to the way she tried to soothe her father. He did take the blame and was influenced to act the way he did, and shallan knew she was somehow softening the whole thing, that's why she didn't want to leave with balat "father would have no one and we would let him alone with that monster" (or something like that, don't remember the exact quote). That as well was something alike "throwing a thimbleful of water into a bonfire" That's just on top of my head, could be something else entirely too As for the above stuff, no idea - could be way too much, like Shallan losing herself completely and just adapting to whatever situation she's in - part of her "evil side" shining through after fragmenting too much... dunno, that part is interesting though!

Malchin was stymied, for though he was inferior to none in the arts of war, he was not suitable for the Lightweavers, he wished for his oaths to be elementary and straightforward, and yet their spren were liberal, as to our comprehension, in definitions pertaining to this matter, the process included speaking truths as an approach to a threshold of self-awareness that Malchin could never attain. That said, I think Shallan simply speaks way too few truths and is lying far too much compared to her truths which leaves her clueless who she even is. I think that self awareness is so freakishly important for Lightweavers because if they don't exactly know who they are they will get lost in their power. Let's just kind of reverse engineer that: Shallan "lied" to herself all those years about what happened to her mother. That's one lie and everything was more or less stable at that time. Then she had to go to Jasnah and steal the soulcaster, on her way there she didn't yet lie to anybody - she knew what she was doing and so did her brothers, she accepted it, she was sort of free - also when she told jasnah later about it - all in all when she came clean with her stuff she was happier, more relaxed and I think the so far "truest self". (Shredding Book merchants, talking to sailors the way she did, giving Jasnah lip at her "examination", etc) And then when Jasnah "died" the whole stuff started to fall apart. She had to infiltrate the ghostbloods, talk herself into wooing adolin (at that time she didn't made it out of love or affection but because she had a plan "she couldn't mess this up" - sure the fact that he is handsome helped, but it wasn't something she made out of potential feelings someday but pure calculation) After that she lied a lot, to Adolin, to herself, to the Ghostbloods, to Ameram to literally everybody except Kaladin (not going into that too much because not really important here - but chasm scene aside, when she talks to him she is usually nasty and the most honest with her insults than we see her at any other time). The balance of lies and truths just isn't there anymore and she creates Veil, which gives her more stuff to lie about, then she creates radiant - more lies. And somewhere along the way she just doesn't know who she is anymore, because she lied too much to cope and there is no end for it in sight, her spren might be liberal and like lies, because that's where her powers are rooted, but in order to progress in order to excell you have to speak truths as a lightweaver, and shallan just is more than reluctant to do so. All that said, I don't think any of the 3 "Veil/maskShallan/Radiant" is the true one or one more true than the other by default - it's more like a situational thing - how many truths did she speak at that time? How many lies, was there a moment of a powerful truth when she was in one or the other persona? (like Re-Shephir) - they are all her, but not constantly the same amount like 1/3 Veil, 1/3 maskShallan, 1/3 Radiant. I hope this makes at least somewhat sense to you, because I don't think I could break it down any more, this really is a freaking complicated topic

That's just the thing, the way he went about this was completely stupid if he intended to rush to a full stop at the end of OB + Don't going into the way she chose adolin at the end, that already had been pointed out countless of times + We didn't see the wedding, just Shallan being again unsure about herself until she talks herself into it. + And then we know that SA 4 will be 1 year in the future from that very important event we never even see, it's just weird. It doesn't make any sense and if it really resolves that way it's the worst writing of a relationship I've ever seen. Especially the '1 year later stunt' - that's sometimes a good thing, but now, after the ending of OB it just feels like a very very cheap escape not to have to explain too much. And usually Sanderson isn't taking cheap escapes but has everything planned out one way or the other. We'll have to see I guess, but that resolve combined with the one year gap... sorry not buying it.

How can you say that? I mean did you meet a lot of Honorspren lately besides Syl? Yeah, didn't think so either. Also I'd say Syl is pretty special, considering that she was the only spren going for kal, there are a ton of honorspren in shadesmar and they didn't give a crap. Kal has now basically 1 year or so more experience with his power than any other windrunner there will ever be.. I'd say that's a decent edge

It could also be that it is "only" important for kaladins growth, and his view of nobility - helping him to accept who and what he is now and help him to get rid of that scar of his for one thing... I also do think it's important but maybe in a more subtle way

Careful what you dismiss so easily, honor might not have been a spren, but spren are tiny pieces of a God- and shardblades are copies of honorblades as we all know.

Why wouldn't somebody change their eyecolor from light to dark, I can imagine only too well how you might get sick of all the 'elites', thinking they are something greater and better, if you're one of the few people thinking rational and having greater emotional intelligence than a tablespoon full. And both Lirin and Hesina would fit into that kind of people. They even were outsiders as dark eyes so that could be their curse - never to fit in somewhere, always being outsiders not belonging to darkeyes nor lighteyes. There is also the question why they moved to some remote village in the first place, considering their rank they would have a much easier life in the city. And more friends as well. Sure they could have moved just to 'play' lighteyes and feeling that they are superior to all the lesser ranks, but then that entirely isn't how they act or even communicate they want to be seen. They don't give a damnation about their rank yet it still is an issue where they live, they are outsiders yet treat everyone with kindness nonetheless... so why did they move there? I really do think that there is a lot more to their story, if it's that one/both of them were lighteyes once or that they simply ran from something I don't know - but afaik they didn't grew up there (both of them) and nobody just moves to some remote village to feel alone between equals (usually).

Also: honor is dead

Wouldn't dismiss it outright, there are several ways this could be possible - maybe Lirin is one of the descendants of Jezrien or stuff like that. They didn't went crazy immediately and 10 000 years - I don't think they stayed celibate the whole time. Also there is the night watcher, and cultivation and so many other things we don't yet know about. So could be definitely something, could also be nothing. As for now we sadly don't know enough to assume anything concrete. I will agree with you however that Lirin acts odd even for a pacifist, it just doesn't really fit the 'roshar etiquette' - and his teachings to kaladin do sound too specific to be a coincidence. But maybe Brandon just thought 'hey surgeon is a very honourable job, let's make an order that would go with those ideals'

Well considering that 16 people killed something with the power of all the shards combined there must be some power or way to do it (I always wondered about that) I mean how can they defeat basically a 16times more powerful odium? Considering what all the radiants went through on roshar dealing with a fraction of that power. Also there are hints that much more is possible than we know radiants could do, dalinars supernova explosion unity thing was just the most obvious one, but kal for example also (on a smaller scale) did stop the highstorm with superpower and windspren that even astonished syl, which he then downplayed by 'yeah couldn't save everyone' and everybody forgot about that quickly

Like your theory but I think we don't have much to consult right now - perhaps dalinar has the potential to become a God (some resource sleeping within him we don't yet know about) Because even the original God must have grown to power at some point (and the humans who defeated him and took his power for that matter) But that's just crazy speculation right now since we don't know enough yet

Iirc 'Adolin's Character arc' was to die at some point rather unspectacular. Sanderson just changed his mind and decided to drag him along now as a main character. I don't think there are any major plans for his character yet as there is for all the others, sure I guess he has a general direction in mind where he want him to go, but I doubt it's that well thought out. Considering there wasn't a real plan for him to begin with, even if things have changed.

Other question, do we know that she can only draw power from food or is it possible that she can breathe in stormlight too and just hasn't figured it out yet? Because forget the endless eating thing, if she is actually able to draw power from both sources - endless food supply or not - that would be a huge advantage. As for only food, I guess it makes her more vulnerable than a 'usual' radiant as it is now. (Maybe once she has sworn all oaths and needs only like one bite to fight for a longer period of time it would turn into an advantage, like Kaladin uses less stormlight with each oath.) But right now she can only fight for like 10 min before starvation is looming and she's completely drained. At least it feels like that in the books.

Could be Hesina but I think there was another WoB where he already said that kal is very remotely related to Aesudan and didn't hear the song from her - so maybe Hesinas and Aesudans Parents were cousins or something like that... Also the delighted expression on Hesinas face when she saw that her son was a radiant despite the fact she never really wanted him to go to war... could be definitely something there but probably not as much as implied

I can't imagine skai or aona standing by watching odium kill the other, they at the very least had to consider 'well, if he wins - what will happen next?' They are divine beings, some basic logic isn't too much to ask for I guess... Even if he turned them against each other, how would he do that and weren't they at all suspicious? I mean there they are watching over their creation several thousand years businesses like partnership and suddenly odium crashes by and they both run rampage at each other and are oblivious to the fact that just before that 'brief visit' happens everything was the same as it was several millennia? "Hey aona - long time no see, thought I just crash by to tell you that skai said your boots look ugly as damnation, absolutely no bad intentions on my behalf, we just haven't seen each other so long so don't mind me and go slap that skai in the face now" Yeah sounds about right... well those gods would be stupid af if you ask me and the fact that they even came up with the plan to kill adonalsium was probably a lucky guess - much more so that they actually achieved it lmao

Could be though, those shards are basically gods - just because one is 'evil' doesn't mean he is the most powerful of them all. That's also something that always bothered me a little that odium seems to have no real problem fighting against several shards, and always gets out of it victorious - so the maiming thing would be a welcoming change tbh How many did he kill now? 'Brief visit to sel...' Dominion and Devotion I think they were. (Passing by and just casually killing them both... that's how it comes across at least I mean wth?) Then Tanavast, that makes 3... it's just - why the heck? How can he be that much more powerful than 3 shards? Did he get the piece that was bigger than all the other ones? Just makes not a ton of sense to me. Vin was able to kill ruin by killing herself, otherwise they just blocked each other - so why is odium so much better at it without any real sacrifice?

Didn't check it, but someone I trust just pointed out that it was indeed seven, guess I go back to double check everything