WhiteLeeopard

At first I thought she was a Stoneward, Herald or Honorblade wielder. It wasn't until the dinner conversation with Kaladin and the color metaphor that I realized who she was. I think it was a red or crimson color she used. I couldn't believe I hadn't noticed her earlier, but in my defense I hadn't expected her to have such a huge part.

22 hours ago, straits said:

I liked Elhokar's character, but from a political standpoint, a turncoat slave, from the Alethi army, ramming a spear into the head of the leader of the society that made him a slave does not constitute a moral crime.

Circumstances change everything. If Moash had killed Elhokar while he cowered behind guards and sent men out to die for him it would be very different. Except thats not how Moash killed Elhokar is it? Nope. Elhokar was protecting his 3 year old son with his own body, leading the charge to his palace in an attempt to free his city and wife from Odium, and begining to say the words to join a group of Knights based on Honor and personal growth. So Moash kicked the child aside, and killed his father before his eyes stopping his chance to gain the power to fight for his people. 

I have never been an Elhokar supporter, quite the opposite actually. But fact is, saying Elhokar deserved to die for his crimed years before against Moash is like saying Dalinar deserves to die for what he did as the Blackthorn. Are they guilty of terrible deeds? Yes. Do they deserve to die for them? No. Why? Because they are not the people they were when they did those deeds. What Moash did was the equivalent of killing Dalinar just as he came out of his meeting with Cultivation. Killing someone for past crimes just as he was about to start making amends for them. At the least it is a trickery slope.

21 hours ago, Ookla the Toasted said:

Call me silly, but I wouldn't call Moash evil. He has given up on society, and on the human race. Circumstances has formed him into the person he is. I don't want a redemption arc either, but I wouldn't say that Moash deserves to be remembered as evil. I think he is more complicated than that.

Moash is evil because he betrayed his friends. If he had given up on society, whatever. But on his friends? Brother in arms? That is evil, and there is no other way to color it. Also, everyone in the bridge crews has gone through things at least as bad as poor Moash if not worse, and now they are glowing.

3 hours ago, Dreamstorm said:

Like a lot of people expressed, I was hoping for a bit more here.  There were two points where I thought Moash could turn about - one was his first viewpoint when the Fused caught his caravan and he relied on his Bridge Four strength and the second was when he had the deja vu moment when he was put on the bridge crews of the Fused army.  

I think those were just there to show how Moash just excels at one thing. Throwing to the trash all the opportunities he is given.

17 minutes ago, Wolfbeckett said:

I wonder, would this mean that Dalinar can safely use the visions again with world rulers because Odium can't show himself to Dalinar anymore?

Probably. For all we know the visions were always safe to use so long as they were aware of the possible danger. They didn't have enough information regarding them either way.

The contest isn't over yet, it hasn't even begun. Odium fled because after Dalinar overcame the odiuous part of himself Odium was left without a champion, and Honor's three most likely champions were all on the immediate vicinity. Meaning Honor's side was ready with guns blazing while Odium's champion had just fallen appart. He fled likely to go find another champion, and because if he had stayed Dalinar could have forced the contest and Odium would be wrecked.

A silver chain from Threnody .

Shallan will never be on my favorite list of characters. But neither will she be on my most hated list of characters either. I simply find her boring. I think I have only read her chapters on WoK once, all the other re-reads I skipped her. WoR I also skipped on rereads her parts usually till she killed Tyn. On OB her chapters were often the hardest to read, and I will likely skip much of her actions on Kholinar on rereads. 

I think part of the problem is she is lying to herself all the time. If I'm reading a character's pov I like knowing what they are thinking. Reading the pov of a character who has no idea what she is really thinking is exhausting and yields little except how bonkers she is. Another problem is in OB she reminded me a lot of Perrin on WoT, crossing the exact same fence a dozen times.

She didn't seem to go forwards, all her OB progression seemed backwards or in circles. She is the only character for which this happened. Everyone else in OB went forwards on their respective paths, except her. So...what is the point of a 300 pg pov (just picked a possible number so don't shoot me on this figure) of a character that went in lots of circles and achieved almost nothing? I'd be happier if a significant amount of those pages was given to any other chaacter as I'm sure they would progress a lot more, but I know this won't happen and Shallan will always be an important part of SA. Just a boring one for me, that I have little interest in reading and that I will generally skip on rereads. The most fun part for me to read is the GB parts, and she had little contact with them in OB. 

I know some people like that and I am happy the character works for some, but I don't see myself ever becoming too excited/concerned/hyped over what Shallan does or does not do. I may have some feelings regarding her, but they won't be the maximun ones on the scale ^^. 

Toaster, you should add T in, while not my first pick for me he is always at the top of the list. 

I choose Moash because he is a traitor to his friends, and there is not a crime worse than that. That been said, I felt a bloody, dark satisfaction while reading his scenes in OB. Why? Because I had been saying since I ended WoR and joined the 17th shard that Moash was bad news and utterly doomed. And voila my predictions came true. There is something fiercely satisfying about been right about a bad apple .

Shallan is agreed the most boring character of OB, I'd be happy to have her pov diminished and swapped with any other flashback character except Venli and perhaps Lift. I like Lift but in bite-sized pieces, a lot more could get overwhelming.

Just now, Naurock said:

I wonder if Nighblood was able to consume enough Investiture if he could destroy a dead Shardblade.

Thats practically confirmed. I wouldn't be overly surprised if in the right circumstances Nightblood could also destroy living Shardblades.

Quote

Questioner

What would happen if a Shardblade hit Nightblood?

Brandon Sanderson

Nightblood would act like a Shardblade, in that it would stop a Shardblade. It is significantly more Invested than a Shardblade, so it would have some ramifications beyond that.

Quote

Questioner

How would you compare the Investiture in Nightblood to the Investiture in one of the spren turned into a--

Brandon Sanderson

Sword? They have less Investiture than Nightblood.

Quote

Questioner

I am curious about, if sprens are pieces of the god power, and investiture is the power of the god, then can Nightblood consume spren?

Brandon Sanderson

He could theoretically -- yeah, he could totally consume spren. There's not even any “theoretically” to that.

Considering how possesive Vasher tend(ed) to be of Nightblood, how Vivenna came to Roshar specifically hunting Nghtblood and called it a criminal, and that I don't see Szeth relinquising possesion of Nightblood easily I doubt the meeting between those 3 (5) beings will be amicable. At least not at first. I also suspect Vasher and Szeth will meet early on book 4, since both will be around Urithiru. Unless Szeth tells Dalinar of the Honorblades with the Shin, so he leaves to recover them. 

What I really want to see is what (if any) surges Nightblood grants .

The story of the coalition:

When Dalinar decides the world needs to unite to survive he begins sharing his vision around the world

All of them react in the best possible way

Until our hero finds the 21st century way to sucess

He tries

And tries

And tries again!

His efforts bear impressive results

Sadly its still Part 4

Just as an army comes knocking uninvited

The crescendo builds

Leaving us all scratching our heads

The End

Sacrificing in war, bringing unity and peace, ...farewell, peace and unity bringer... sacrificed in war.

1 hour ago, bo.montier said:

I don't think this is the case. I don't have the reference now, but I seem to remember Szeth somewhere in TWoK or WoR musing on the 8 other honor blades back in Shinovar. Then it becomes news at some point that one of them had been stolen. I think this is when Nale got his back.

Now, I may very well be imagining ALL of that, it's happened before, so...Anyone who has a better memory than me...

No honorblade was ever stolen from the Shin, it was a lie T made up on the spot so Szeth wouldn't kill him by realizing he wasn't Truthless. In that interlude Szeth actually asks about "one of the other seven", implying the Shin already had just 7 Honorblades.

Nale had gotten his Honorblade presumably before Szeth's time. This means Szeth likely trained with all Honorblades except the Skybreaker and Stoneward one. Meaning, some help on figuring out division for the Skybreakers will likely be nice for him. Szeth is probably familiar with Division via the Dustbringer Honorblade, which may be different from the Skybreaker use.

17 hours ago, Salkara said:

Thought I'd throw this one in here.

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/35-arcanum-unbounded-hoboken-signing/#e4067

So, it may have taken 1,000 Breaths to Awaken Nightblood, but it's more invested than some other object that had 1,000 Breaths stored in it.

Fun thought: If Nightblood had eyes, would they be red?

I think yes, Nightblood would have red eyes. That wob was amazing. Makes me wonder what Shard corruption is represented by voidbringer, Odium and...what? I assumed voidspren were just Odium spren, but now it seems they may be Cultivation or Honor corrupted spren? 

And Calderis what did you do to your name? Hard to recognize ^^.

Just now, Ookla the Idiopathic said:

Curious? 

I’d be horrified. I don’t want to see an innocent Spren permanently destroyed

Cuz I reckon Nightblood would destroy a common shardblade. It’s not guaranteed, but it’s probable. 

Thats likely...but I doubt it would happen in a single blow, and it'd be nice to know for...research purposes .

Also, I think Malata's punishment for been a traitor to the KR while pretending to be friendly should be to have her spren killed by Nightblood , before she gets executed herself. I may be a bit bloodthirsty, but it seems unfair for Malata to be punished yet her spren who pushed her to do it to walk away unharmed.

I absolutely believe any Fused killed by Nightblood are permanently destroyed. What he does is drain all investure from whatever/whoever it touches. The problem is how hard it is to safely use Nightblood. I'd love to see the reaction of the Fused when they realize they can actually permanently die now . 

As an aside, I'm disappointed we didn't get to see Nightblood vs Shardblade clash, I was curious what would happen.

13 minutes ago, bo.montier said:

While the spren often have incomplete memories, they haven't been wrong about anything they've said "This is so" thus far, I'm still inclined to trust them when they make factual statements (look at Syl & the voidspren in part 1, lots of people thought she was wrong about that, turns out she wasn't...).

Syl and the voidspren in part 1 are both very old spren, (pre-Recreance), so it makes sense what they say they know, they are right about it as they saw it personally. 

I don't think all Dustbringers or even all Skybreakers will side with Odium, I'd like to see those orders splinter into both sides. Thing is, so far I respect the Skybreakers. They make dumb choices but they stand by them, no shady deals or backstabbing there, what you are told is what happens. They also clearly respect other choices, as seen when Szeth sides with the KR and Nale says they will keep training him.

Malata

Purpose in the book: be an annoyance, be a T pawn, be a small wrench on the KR side

Purpose in world: operate Oathgates because Dalinar instinctively doesn't trust her with more (good call back to WoR Dalinar accepting Kaladin's instincts with no more arguments required to make a decision) and get Dalinar secrets for T

Hobby: break stuff because either her spren or T tells her to

Reasoning: why not

Future expectations: small annoyance, but not anything that our heroes can't overcome

Shouldn't this thread maybe be merged with Oathbringer memes? @Chaos

I know I sometimes seem to nag so much over merging threads...but the forum is already hard to navigate after OB release and I hate how so much beautiful information is getting lost in past threads ^^.

13 hours ago, RShara said:

10 people who she believes are traitors to humankind and Honor, no less.

I doubt Jasnah thinks the Heralds are traitors to humanity. As anyone that thinks that 10 people are traitors to humanity for only been capable of holding back the end of the world and the complete destruction of Roshar for ~6000 years instead of forever is not too logical. Even the Stormfather, the biggest remaining piece of Honor admits the Heralds were quite impressive and the closest beings to honorable in the world.

10 hours ago, Calderis said:

Jasnah = sacrifice the Heralds to lock away the Voidbringers again. 

Taravangian = sacrifice whatever is needed to make sure humanity survives. 

Problem is both their thinking is flawed. Sometimes, when taking such drastic measures they should follow the next step of thought. Even if the Oathpact still worked and if by some miracle a Herald in Damnation means no Desolation in Roshar the Heralds are in such great shape that they would likely break before the Voidbringers could heat up the iron pokers. As for T...tough break, but humanity is already saved. There are dozens of other worlds where humans are thriving, so no, he isn't going to save his race, because humanity doesn't need saving. What needs saving is his world. Very different.

The second point you raised did annoy me. Not only because Shallan had earned more respect than she got, but because it was a waste of resources. Like when Dalinar brought Navani and Jasnah in, but completely ignored the possibility of bringing Shallan. Not really smart considering Shallan could well be the one to get the best info out of the visions by drawing out the possible spren, voidbringers, etc and making her drawings public to all the army. 

If there is one thing I hate is wasted potential and wasting resources. Everyone suddenly wasting the resource that is Shallan was...a waste.

But Jasnah ended up redeeming herself for that mistake in Part Two with her actions at the end. If she becomes more self-aware in the future. Because using Shallan how she was doing at the start was like taking a Stradivarius and having no clue what you have in your hands,, so giving it to an apprentice to practice.

Sorry if you felt called out @FeatherWriter. I was more thinking along the lines that I was sure you of all people would have gotten the page out of him somehow . Because there was no way you'd let a Renarin piece of information unturned . 

I find Renarin to be interesting, but until now I did not speculate much, as I didn't feel I knew enough about him to make guesses. After OB I'm happy that has changed. 

Nope, he is far too stoic to snap by the everyday war, death and responsibility he faces. Only something truly earth-shaking will snap him. Meaning, he will clearly snap out of joy on his wedding night .

I suspect the Heralds, even without Honorblades are not so easy to contain against their will (except for Shards). But I still have no clue what he is up to. What I find curious is that he knew Ash would care about Taln. Its been 4500 years since the Heralds were around, how do they have information so reliable?

10 hours ago, Dragonangel said:

So, does anyone know why Sadeas started hating Dalinar so far back in the day?  I mean in the first flashback, Sadeas said that he didn't know if a rockslide would kill Dalinar and low and behold, later a rock slide tried to kill him.  Why so much hate when they were working together for the kingdom?

I don't think Sadeas hated Dalinar then, its possible he was envious that the Blackthorn was a force to be reckoned with, but I suspect Sadeas mainly admired Dalinar at that point. The rockslide comment was a compliment from Sadeas. In his own way .