TheWarriorPoet

I didn't meant it as a personal insult, just said it in the premise as you keep telling me my using chat gpt doesn't make sense, i didn't think it was personal insult to me but if you felt i insulted you, i honestly didn't mean it. Write he said it, and in wind and truth as you said it was done by Retribution and i just finished it but since he already had a backup plan prepared says something about wit, doesn't it? He didn't prepared a cell culture in 10 days since dalinar's meeting with odium to the night of sorrows, right? Can we assume he was lying about it earlier? I suppose its part of storytelling because if we know everything about hoid/wit then he wont remain mystery for the rest of cosmere series books. Now another thing i want to point out, Retribution with combined power of 2 shards used his might to vaporize wit, now how will he feel if Wit just returned? If i understand the premise before vaporization, retribution did it becaue he was afraid of "the only person who can harm him". Now i do not know about anyone else but if i felt threatened by someone and killed him by vaporizing him and found him strolling in streets a few weeks later, i will be terrified of the person for sure. Once again, there was no formal contract before the one between Honor and Odium, if there was i am not aware of it. For me what they were doing before they agreed to contract was non binding. What frost had is a Nonintervention policy which is something personal to him and not any contract, what i wanted to point out when i mentioned those letters was that hoid definetely have some power which can have a big impact on cosmere I think i may have badly phrased it earlier but to clear it - Non-intervention here meant he will not do anything about anything happenning in cosmere but it was about frost and not Hoid. If hoid was in Non-intervention pact, we probably wouldn't have the cosmere series of books. If i am correct in my understanding, before the final day of the Fight of champions specifically Rysn's interlude, all the shards and everyone in the cosmere including the readers knew that Hoid had a dawnshard but he gave it up and the effects have altered his soul, now all of a sudden we know that he was holding the dawnshard all along, maybe he gave it up for a little while but then he quitely picked it up again and no one noticed, right? Can this mean that we still have a lot to figure out about hoid? Hi, Frost's nonintervention means he will not intervene in anything throughout the cosmere, which i am pretty sure he will reconsider when we come to hoid's storyline but for Hoid i am saying he will not directly fight a shard, he had been interfering in the cosmere probably since before it was called cosmere

If you think this about Hoid then you probably know less about the entire cosmere then you claim chat gpt knows. i dont know which book or interview or tidbit gave you this idea that hoid is so powerless that he could be wiped from existence by any shard with barely a thought. I dont think brandon is working so hard into building a character who is almost the only consistent character throughout the cosmere to be so powerless. My Point is that once a contract is made, it is binding to everyone. I don't think that the only contract in existence is between these 3 shards; there can be other contracts as well. And i talked about a pact between Hoid and vessels at the time of shattering. I assume at that time, vessels were not planning to kill each other or take multiple shards hence they didn't needed a contract between themselves. You might be right, but i searched and i didn't find anywhere Brandon confirming this, at best it was "Maybe" And have you read about the Letters, where Hoid and Frost are conversing with each other? I think they imply that Frost and Hoid are powers more ancient and more powerful than we understand as of now. It is my understanding that frost regrets the shatterring mostly because of its outcome when he says " is not the destruction we have wrought enough?" and "Our interference so far has brought nothing but pain." and most importantly "You, however, have never been a force for equilibrium. You tow chaos behind you like a corpse dragged by one leg through the snow. Please, hearken to my plea. Leave that place and join me in my oath of nonintervention. The cosmere itself may depend upon our restraint." I think that these words clearly shows that hoid is not as powerless as you assume him to be. And i will say it again, its just a anti theory i have come up with, i don't think we are going to get a answer to this till the time we have Hoid's story published

i am, but i am someone who reads spoilers before i read book. but don't tell spoilers now because i am almost finished with day 8

Hoid can interfere, what i meant is he can not directly fight shards. And i know shards fight each other but if there is some sort of formal contract, they are bound by that. Exactly my point I didnt find any definitive answer to hoid being unable to kill because of Dawnshard, maybe i missed something but on coppermind i found something, in one line it says what you are saying, in the very next line it says lumanor says hoid can't hurt others because it is forbidden by other gods, pretty sure other gods here means shards and not dawnshards. I am attaching screenshot Unfortunately i can't do anything about your choice of not understanding, i mentioned very clearly on discord too that the thought and theory is all mine but i used GPT to format it and i don't see any issues with that, i have been using gpt plus for more then a year for many tasks and it produces result with human insights. ofcourse if you ask it to write a cosmere novella it will produce something weird but if you will tell him "that you believe hoid can be the villain who is working towards a long term goal of becoming a God who is more powerful then shards or maybe even adonalsium and you want to expand on this theory, it will give you pointed answers which you can counter and then rework. it can be wrong and it can be write, but ofcourse its about personal choice, i am comfortable working with GenAI tools so i am ok with it, i know people who don't understand how to use these and will always say dont trust them. You chose what you believe and i chose what i believe You are right about it if you are talking about wind and truth, still on day 8

We know Hoid. The clever storyteller. The worldhopper. The man with many names — and too many secrets. He doesn’t kill. He doesn’t fight. He doesn’t rule. But what if that’s not because he’s good — but because he’s bound? What if the greatest con in the Cosmere… is the one Hoid played on the gods themselves? THE SETUP At the Shattering of Adonalsium, sixteen individuals ascended to become Shard Vessels. Brandon has confirmed that Hoid was offered a Shard and refused — and that he was friends with several of the Vessels before the Shattering. But what if that friendship was a mask? What if Hoid’s true motive was always to remove Adonalsium from the board — not to take power for himself, but to ensure no one else could stop him later? THE PACT After the Shattering — regardless of how or why it occurred — Hoid and the 16 Shards formed a cosmic pact: No direct violence between Vessels. No direct interference in mortal wars. No unification of the Shards. No Dawnshard-fueled conquest. This was not peace. It was containment. Each Shard was terrifying. But Hoid… Hoid was unpredictable. And they all agreed: “We will not strike with swords. We will strike with story.” HOID’S REAL GOAL: REPLACE ADONALSIUM WITHOUT TAKING A SHARD Instead of seizing a Shard, Hoid began a new path: To collect the echo of each Shard’s power — and rebuild divinity inside himself. Every magic system in the Cosmere is a manifestation of Shardic Intent. And Hoid is deliberately gathering them, one by one: Magic System Shard Hoid’s Access Allomancy Preservation Consumed a lerasium bead (Secret History) Feruchemy? Preservation/Ruin Strongly implied in The Lost Metal Awakening Endowment Confirmed; may hold a Divine Breath AonDor Devotion + Dominion Can use; seen in Lost Metal epilogue Surgebinding Honor/Cultivation Bonded a Cryptic (Lightweaver) Lightweaving Yolen (???) Origin unknown, possibly pre-Shattering Fortune ??? Uses it to be "where he needs to be" Yolen Magic Pre-Shattering Unexplained, but likely fundamental He’s not hoarding Investiture at random — he’s building a spiritual resonance that reflects the entire Cosmere. A self-made god without Intent, without Shardic madness. When the Shards eventually fade, Splinter, or collapse (as we’ve seen with Honor, Devotion, Dominion, Ambition…), the power will flow to the only being capable of harmonizing with all of it: Hoid. WHY HE DOESN’T INTERVENE Because he can’t. He’s still bound by the Pact of Peace — or possibly by his Dawnshard’s limitations (we know he once held the Dawnshard of Change). He doesn’t kill. He doesn’t fight. He tells stories. He manipulates events through words, art, and chance. Because that’s the only weapon the pact allows him to use. He is playing by the rules… While bending the story to his will. ENDGAME: THE COSMERE WILL BECOME HIM What if Hoid isn’t trying to stop Odium… He’s waiting for Odium to burn through the other Shards — until the power is free. What if he’s preparing to become something worse — or more divine — than Adonalsium? Not a tyrant. Not a savior. But a narrative being with the power of all, and the binding of none. The Shards are gods fractured by Intent. Hoid will be a god unified by story. TL;DR: After the Shattering, Hoid and the Shards created a Pact of Non-Intervention — no direct violence, no mortal warfare. Hoid doesn’t intervene because he’s bound by the pact — not by morality. Instead of holding a Shard, he’s collecting resonances of each Shard’s power via magic systems. His endgame is to replace Adonalsium, not by taking power — but by becoming the only soul compatible with all of it. The final threat to the Cosmere might not be Odium… It might be the man who’s been narrating the whole thing. What do you think? Could Hoid be preparing to override the Shards by becoming the soul of the Cosmere itself? Or is this just another trick in a very long story? Looking forward to your thoughts and counter-theories. -The Warrior Poet

There maybe something about HOID obtaining Investiture of all the shards, since he had some of Shaod, he is also a mistborn or atleast have the ability to be one, he have Breaths from warbreaker too. But why exactly would he be trying to hide himself as Lightweaver? Since he is practically the forefather of this magic? He don't even need stormlight to create illusions as was shown in Liar of partinal? And then if it is just about studying the investiture of Honor, i think he had this opportunity long ago, since heralds know him, it is safe to assume he influenced them in some form thousands of years ago, when the vessel on honor still lived, i think it is safe to assume that he knows the process of investiture as much as vessels do. Someone commented that we should think or speculate about HOID on a bigger scale then just a small world of stormlight, i agree. HOID is not someone to bother himself with things like desolations, he will let humans kill voidbringers or vice versa, he is out there to take on Shards in battle so whatever his objectives for obtaining that cryptic, they are much bigger then just Stormlight. And in Secret History, he is shown fighting Kelsier, so i think it is forbidden for him to fight only in Physical realm but not in cognitive realm Sorry if all this have been discussed somewhere earlier, it is not possible to keep track of every thread on this forum

Hi, "Kal" reminds me of another protagonist "Kel", both kelsier and kaladin were broken, then they gained the powers of respective shards, both hate Nobility/Lighteyes but behave like they themselves are one, both carry grudges against those who oppressed them, both grew up to be inspirational leaders. So keeping these in mind, i don't think Kal can let go because Kel never did, he is not letting go even after dying. So i think the fourth ideal for Kaladin would be something like "I will remember those who fell/died and protect the ones who live" I am sorry, i am not too good in these either lol

@BraidedRose I have to re read it but I am fairly sure It is in book. Dalinar mentioned that Odium planned to bring back his memories at a time when he can break him. Although his memories returned earlier, I think it's safe to assume that Odium could've removed cultivations effects at his chosen moment. Here you go, it's chapter 122

I think Odium can remove Cultivations effects from him, like he tried with dalinar. And taravangian is best candidate, since he is already willing to work as Odiums agent

Couldn't agree more, Adolin is a pure hearted man who will die rather than become Odiums champion

But he is not a cold blooded murderer, or someone who can be manipulated by Odium. If there was any chance of that, it could've been where Adolin saw Kal and Shallan, but his character handled that situation brilliantly, no bitterness, no "kill kaladin" feelings or no running away. He is one of those rare guys who are pure at heart, he might not be an KR yet but he is not Odium's tool Kaladin is passionate about saving people, not killing them. Unless Odium offers him a deal that the fate of rosher will be decided by Kaladin and Dalinar's dual. Whoever wins will reign on rosher and other one will leave planet without killing any human or voidbringer, only in that case Kal can be convinced. Odium can't break him with pain, he had already been there and recovered, whenever Kal had been put under pressure he had always came back shining bright. Not Odium's champion

Jashnah and Kaladin, NAAAAAAA Jashnah might be willing to marry Kal for political purposes, Kaladin won't. Jashnah is 15 years his elder, more like his mom's age, which Kal would ignore. Jashnah is cold blodded murderer, if Kal was there in WOK when she killed on street he would've fought her till one of them died because he is the one who protects I agree that it is just a fantasy to draft Kaladin in some kind of romantic relationship just because he don't yet have one. I think someone will be there, but she is not been introduced to the world yet.

This is one post which i agree with 100%, Stormlight is still young with 7 more books yet to come. We will have many more significant character's being introduced in rosher If it was all about Stormfather's siblings, i think he would have mentioned it somewhere in his conversations with dalinar about the tower but he didn't so i don't think that Urithiru is waiting for a bondsmith. We might know more about is soon since now humans have Shalash in their possession who is one of the Heralds who are not yet insane. As for Navani being a bondsmith, it might have been a good idea if Dalinar was not already one, Navani is more likely to play his political advisor then his military aid.

I think none of them will be Odium's champion, because they all had been through that phase and their character have developed significantly. Most of readers believe that it will be Moash but i disagree, Moash is a good soldier or maybe a good second/third in command but Odium's champion will be the commander who will lead armies for him, who will prepare strategies. Since we have no indication of who was Odium's previous champion it might be wrong to assume that it will be one of these 8. Here is a name which is very easy to dismiss, "Taravangian". He is already working with Odium, he is a cold blooded killer, he can plan and lead armies (Odium can remove nightwatcher's curse). He have two kingdoms under his rule and a full network of people capable of working against KR's. At this point he looks like the best character to staand against Dalinar. I may be wrong, but i think there is a purpose for Taravangian in future books and he might serve as Odium's champion.

Calling HOID a mere human can only be rants of a drunk. Whatever else he is, he is definitely not "mere human"

Hmm ok, but he is powerful enough to fight shards. Since it is said that he came on roshar to hunt an old acquaintance but is now hiding (ref to Odium) so he is definitely powerful

Yeah sure, why not. Since it is been said that there was a force which was opposing Adonalsium and it caused shattering and we know Hoid was present there, my theory (conspiracy theory) is HOID can either be that opposing force or Adonalsium itself. In both the cases he was more powerful than the people who now hold shards. 2. Brandon said that hoid is very old, but he hadn't spent all these years awake or alert, is it possible that after shattering he went into some kind of hibernation for a long time and now he is awake and alert and gathering his lost powers back. 3. He definitely hold a shard, maybe it's shard which tells him future, that's how he knows where he have to be and when. All conspiracy theories, so please pardon me if they don't make sense. I think I will re read liar of pertinal and see if there is something there. Though I think it's forbidden to discuss that here

I love conspiracy theories but this one is completely out of the league, as to the protagonist of this theory is Kaladin, who bonded a honorspren. Now as soon as Kal even thinks about doing this the bond will be snapped (This almost happened when he turned against Elhokar), as soon as this happens he cease to be a KR anymore and in that case, dalinar can imprison him easily or Jashnah (who is considered his bride to be by other conspiracy theorists) will have him soulcasted into dirt without any trouble. This conspiracy theory really doesn't hold any ground to support it. HOID is the one who invented Bitcoin might be a better theory than this

Maybe Hoid is Adonalsium. He was confirmed to be present at the shattering, and since he is the only one without a shard, might mean he was the one who was source of all the shards

Seriously, it is the only thing which i don't wish to see in cosmere. Kaladin suffered hell twice already, why do you want him to suffer for eternity again? And then Jasnah is almost 15 years elder then Kal, almost of his mother's age. Jasnah is shown killing people in cold blood, Kal froze when he saw his friends in front of him in battle. Nope, that is something which should never happen

HI, It is hinted that dalinar might hold shard but for now he doesn't holds it. He used honor's perpendicularity but it moves with highstorm so it might be due to Dalinar bonding stormfather. And then Dalinar is still shown as a human after the fight, I suppose it is not possible for anyone to retain his human form once they hold a shard. So for now, dalinar is just a KR, though a powerful one

This is in reference to first book, Jasnah already knew shallan to be a surgebinder. So events in Book 2 and 3 had not effected that decision in way. Why is it about her marriage, let's see it as per the situation. We are in a meeting, she gave her ward a task to take notes (which shallan hadn't denied) so is it not acceptable for her to reprimand her when she is drawing sketches instead of doing her work? Well we are talking about a love triangle, everyone is contradicting everyone else. I might be doing it to myself unknowingly

It is important since it involves three main characters, but maybe we are reading too much into this. Perhaps we should ask HOID to visit this forum and guide us in the right direction I don't think that OB have anything to do with this. Jasnah knew Shallan is a surgebinder, that's why she arranged the betrothal at first place. I still think that Jasnah's manipulations are more about her nature of seeing herself as superior and not about marrying shallan for the purpose of gaining power

By that logic, why Jasnah is not going honey eyed over Kaladin, he is bigger power then Shallan, probably second after dalinar, so if Jasnah is trying to form alliance through marriage, her obvious target would be to marry Kaladin

This whole topic reminded me of a dialogue from G.I. Joe "The world is about to end, and we are still fighting over the girl" Seriously, this story have much more to offer then the love story, lets focus on those things. We will know who will get the girl at the end anyways