Ishar and Kelsier!

[Aspiring Writer]

Wait! Ishar has been trying to bring spren into the physical realm. Kelsier is a CS and very similar to a spren. What would whatever Ishar is doing do to Kelsier? Would it bring him back to life? Will the Ghostbloods find out and try to steal his research to bring Kelsier out of the cognitive? I needed to get this out there in a moment of grand inspiration. Someone bring this up to BS tomorrow in the livestream if I am unable to!

 

Edit: I was able to ask the question and get an answer, which was yes, this would help him, in a roundabout way.

Edited December 18, 2020 by Aspiring Writer

[Gyirin]

Haven't Kelsier already got a new physical body? 

[Lecky Twig she/her]

 

4 minutes ago, Gyirin said:

Haven't Kelsier already got a new physical body? 

I could be wrong, but i seem to recall him... 

Spoiler

Appearing at the end of Bands of Mourning 

 

[Aspiring Writer]

16 minutes ago, Lecky Twig said:

 

I could be wrong, but i seem to recall him... 

  Reveal hidden contents

Appearing at the end of Bands of Mourning 

 

 

22 minutes ago, Gyirin said:

Haven't Kelsier already got a new physical body? 

He has somehow attached his soul into another body, but we don't know how effective that is, if he still has the body or it's aged and died, and he is still very connected to Scadrail. This might be able to fix some of those problems.

[Kingsdaughter613 she/her]

2 hours ago, Aspiring Writer said:

 

He has somehow attached his soul into another body, but we don't know how effective that is, if he still has the body or it's aged and died, and he is still very connected to Scadrail. This might be able to fix some of those problems.

I suspect the Hemalurgic spike is doing EXACTLY what Ishar is doing: giving Kelsier a Connection to the Physical Realm. A new string. With that he can just manifest fully in the physical realm.

The only thing Ishar could do different would be to allow Kell to manifest physically with two eyes.

[Frustration]

Answer from livestream is a sort of yes it could be done.

[Aspiring Writer]

MY THEORY HAS BEEN PROVEN BY THE GREAT SANDERSON HIMSELF! I WAS THERE! I ASKED THE QUESTION! HA! (Also, the way I asked does support kelsier being Thaidakar)

[Frustration]

59 minutes ago, Aspiring Writer said:

MY THEORY HAS BEEN PROVEN BY THE GREAT SANDERSON HIMSELF! I WAS THERE! I ASKED THE QUESTION! HA! (Also, the way I asked does support kelsier being Thaidakar)

He all but confirned it at the begining, and in the book, and deleted comments that said it.

[Kingsdaughter613 she/her]

4 hours ago, Aspiring Writer said:

MY THEORY HAS BEEN PROVEN BY THE GREAT SANDERSON HIMSELF! I WAS THERE! I ASKED THE QUESTION! HA! (Also, the way I asked does support kelsier being Thaidakar)

Brandon basically admitted it when he asked us not to use Thaidakar’s actual name. Implying that he knew we knew that name and he’d intended for us to know. So... 

And then revealed that we’d seen Thaidakar in another series.

Edited December 18, 2020 by Kingsdaughter613

[Aspiring Writer]

Just now, Kingsdaughter613 said:

Brandon basically admitted it when he asked us not to use Thaidakar’s actual name. Implying that he knew we knew that name and he’d intended for us to know. So...

Well, he still confirmed that whatever Ishar is doing would help Kelsier, so it's still a victory! Also, I was the one that said hi, btw.

[Kingsdaughter613 she/her]

Just now, Aspiring Writer said:

Well, he still confirmed that whatever Ishar is doing would help Kelsier, so it's still a victory! Also, I was the one that said hi, btw.

Well, hello again! Now you know why I keep my username consistent! And congrats on getting your question answered!

Now, don’t take this the wrong way, but... he said, ‘in a roundabout way, yes.’ Which, knowing Brandon, can mean ‘Ishar is manipulating Connection. And Kell’s problem is Connection. So what Ishar is doing could help Kell, but actually has nothing to with him and isn’t even directly related to his problem except in certain fundamental ways. But if Kelsier knew those fundamentals he could use them to figure out how to solve his problem.’

So it doesn’t prove much beyond ‘Kelsier’s problem involves Connection.’ Which is still a pretty nice confirmation of what we suspected.

[Aspiring Writer]

1 minute ago, Kingsdaughter613 said:

Well, hello again! Now you know why I keep my username consistent! And congrats on getting your question answered!

Now, don’t take this the wrong way, but... he said, ‘in a roundabout way, yes.’ Which, knowing Brandon, can mean ‘Ishar is manipulating Connection. And Kell’s problem is Connection. So what Ishar is doing could help Kell, but actually has nothing to with him and isn’t even directly related to his problem except in certain fundamental ways. But if Kelsier knew those fundamentals he could use them to figure out how to solve his problem.’

So it doesn’t prove much beyond ‘Kelsier’s problem involves Connection.’ Which is still a pretty nice confirmation of what we suspected.

Thanks. I was quite surprised that my first try at asking a question worked. (This was the third or fourth question I asked him on the stream, but this was my first stream.)

Yeah, but I got to confirm and theory to stroke my ego, and it was just a hypothetical anyway. I knew Ishar wasn't actually doing it for him, though it could become important if the Ghostbloods steal it, seeing as Dalinar now has it he isn't great at keeping it safe.  Plus, it might help with the investiture problem. It's just interesting all around!

[Kingsdaughter613 she/her]

23 minutes ago, Aspiring Writer said:

Thanks. I was quite surprised that my first try at asking a question worked. (This was the third or fourth question I asked him on the stream, but this was my first stream.)

Yeah, but I got to confirm and theory to stroke my ego, and it was just a hypothetical anyway. I knew Ishar wasn't actually doing it for him, though it could become important if the Ghostbloods steal it, seeing as Dalinar now has it he isn't great at keeping it safe.  Plus, it might help with the investiture problem. It's just interesting all around!

Agreed! This was my first too. I’m not surprised they didn’t ask my question though; I worded it non-spoilery but the answer would have had major Mistborn spoilers and Brandon was clearly trying to avoid those. I’ll try again when we have a Cosmere spoilers one.

[POTUS24]

So hemalurgy has always fascinated me. Especially since mistborn era 2-3 where they go into a little more depth with the implications of what it means and can do. That being said I want to know A. What would happen if you used shattered shard plate to make a spike. And  B. Have we already seen hemalurgy used off of Scadrial.

That being said there are some different implications that I haven't been able to wrap my head around. We know kelsier has a physical body from tBoM and RoW now (kinda). We know that he used hemalurgy to get said body but we don't know how specifically. And we know he has a similar problem that the heralds do. 

So hemalurgy. If the wiki is accurate to Sanderson's plans on this front which I kinda assume it would be. Duralumin steels connection and identity. So it's likely that's what his spike is made from that you see in the coin from tBoM. But hemalurgy doesn't effect the cognitive realm the spike tears a hold directly from physical to spiritual. My guess is that maybe some how marsh and spook could have possibly found the right feruchemist, and tried the ritual, or what ever it should be called, inside the perpendicularity so that the intent could effect the cognitive shadow that is kelsier. I think there are still problems with connection and identity between the bodies that don't work quite right for that to be what happened I wish I knew if someone has tried to ask without getting RAFOed 

 

As to the problem that he has that he wanted kalak for. I think he also wants to leave Scadrial, but I'm also shakey on this too. I'm not sure that he hasn't already left at least once before. But shalan was told that he basically doesn't show up to talk to people in person and that he's not from Roshar. We know the heralds are  cognitive shadows that where tied to all three realms by the Oathpact. Which gives them the connection to the Roshar system forcing them to stay like all other forms of investiture. Kalak wanted off and the ghostbloods obviously wanted what he had found out. Kelsier doesn't have the same connections that the heralds do but it obviously comes with the same boundaries.

Long story short I think kelsier is trying to sever his connection with Scadrial somehow or another to leave the planet. I wouldn't be surprised if the easiest way is to get someone that really knows how to use Ishar's honor blade to do it. However I think the easiest way would be to look no farther tham Zahel. He flat out says he's a cognitive shadow. I don't know if the return operate on different rules but it seems like he keeps most things consistent unless I'm just missing a lot.

Sorry if that's hard to follow and spoils a ton...

 

[Aspiring Writer]

36 minutes ago, POTUS24 said:

So hemalurgy has always fascinated me. Especially since mistborn era 2-3 where they go into a little more depth with the implications of what it means and can do. That being said I want to know A. What would happen if you used shattered shard plate to make a spike. And  B. Have we already seen hemalurgy used off of Scadrial.

That being said there are some different implications that I haven't been able to wrap my head around. We know kelsier has a physical body from tBoM and RoW now (kinda). We know that he used hemalurgy to get said body but we don't know how specifically. And we know he has a similar problem that the heralds do. 

So hemalurgy. If the wiki is accurate to Sanderson's plans on this front which I kinda assume it would be. Duralumin steels connection and identity. So it's likely that's what his spike is made from that you see in the coin from tBoM. But hemalurgy doesn't effect the cognitive realm the spike tears a hold directly from physical to spiritual. My guess is that maybe some how marsh and spook could have possibly found the right feruchemist, and tried the ritual, or what ever it should be called, inside the perpendicularity so that the intent could effect the cognitive shadow that is kelsier. I think there are still problems with connection and identity between the bodies that don't work quite right for that to be what happened I wish I knew if someone has tried to ask without getting RAFOed 

 

As to the problem that he has that he wanted kalak for. I think he also wants to leave Scadrial, but I'm also shakey on this too. I'm not sure that he hasn't already left at least once before. But shalan was told that he basically doesn't show up to talk to people in person and that he's not from Roshar. We know the heralds are  cognitive shadows that where tied to all three realms by the Oathpact. Which gives them the connection to the Roshar system forcing them to stay like all other forms of investiture. Kalak wanted off and the ghostbloods obviously wanted what he had found out. Kelsier doesn't have the same connections that the heralds do but it obviously comes with the same boundaries.

Long story short I think kelsier is trying to sever his connection with Scadrial somehow or another to leave the planet. I wouldn't be surprised if the easiest way is to get someone that really knows how to use Ishar's honor blade to do it. However I think the easiest way would be to look no farther tham Zahel. He flat out says he's a cognitive shadow. I don't know if the return operate on different rules but it seems like he keeps most things consistent unless I'm just missing a lot.

Sorry if that's hard to follow and spoils a ton...

 

There is a new year's stream Q&A happening where you can try and ask BS these questions.

[Kingsdaughter613 she/her]

16 hours ago, POTUS24 said:

So hemalurgy has always fascinated me. Especially since mistborn era 2-3 where they go into a little more depth with the implications of what it means and can do. That being said I want to know A. What would happen if you used shattered shard plate to make a spike. And  B. Have we already seen hemalurgy used off of Scadrial.

That being said there are some different implications that I haven't been able to wrap my head around. We know kelsier has a physical body from tBoM and RoW now (kinda). We know that he used hemalurgy to get said body but we don't know how specifically. And we know he has a similar problem that the heralds do. 

So hemalurgy. If the wiki is accurate to Sanderson's plans on this front which I kinda assume it would be. Duralumin steels connection and identity. So it's likely that's what his spike is made from that you see in the coin from tBoM. But hemalurgy doesn't effect the cognitive realm the spike tears a hold directly from physical to spiritual. My guess is that maybe some how marsh and spook could have possibly found the right feruchemist, and tried the ritual, or what ever it should be called, inside the perpendicularity so that the intent could effect the cognitive shadow that is kelsier. I think there are still problems with connection and identity between the bodies that don't work quite right for that to be what happened I wish I knew if someone has tried to ask without getting RAFOed 

 

As to the problem that he has that he wanted kalak for. I think he also wants to leave Scadrial, but I'm also shakey on this too. I'm not sure that he hasn't already left at least once before. But shalan was told that he basically doesn't show up to talk to people in person and that he's not from Roshar. We know the heralds are  cognitive shadows that where tied to all three realms by the Oathpact. Which gives them the connection to the Roshar system forcing them to stay like all other forms of investiture. Kalak wanted off and the ghostbloods obviously wanted what he had found out. Kelsier doesn't have the same connections that the heralds do but it obviously comes with the same boundaries.

Long story short I think kelsier is trying to sever his connection with Scadrial somehow or another to leave the planet. I wouldn't be surprised if the easiest way is to get someone that really knows how to use Ishar's honor blade to do it. However I think the easiest way would be to look no farther tham Zahel. He flat out says he's a cognitive shadow. I don't know if the return operate on different rules but it seems like he keeps most things consistent unless I'm just missing a lot.

Sorry if that's hard to follow and spoils a ton...

 

Returned work differently. So do Seons, but if the GBs could figure those out it would go a long way to solving their questions.