That1GuySpencer Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 I was wondering, with Taravangian's condition(changing mental capacity each day), would him bonding with a spren be affected in anyway. What are your thoughts, would anything happen at all? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoWibble he/him Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 Bonding a spren would do with his overall character and his overall intent, not his intelligence. He might be able to figure out the Words to say easier when he is smarter, though 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honorless he/him Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 (edited) I would say that it would be easier for him to say the Words on days of moderate intelligence and higher empathy; on days where he is more intelligent, maybe a Voidspren bond would be more suitable for him then. Umm, hey @KandraAllomancer! Could you re-post your comment on this version of the topic? OP appears to have accidentally double-posted, and two people have already commented on this side... I've copied your comment here so you don't have to go hunting for it: Quote A. With Cultivation's modifications of his spiritweb, it would probably be harder for him to form a Nahel bond B. Many spren would probably reject him anyway C. If he achieved this, though, there could some interesting new Resonance here Interesting observations, @KandraAllomancer! @GoWibble don't cross-post Quote Quote If he achieved this, though, there could some interesting new Resonance here Definitely a RAFO Can you put the WoB that says that T's spiritweb is changed? @Pathfinder said: Quote @KandraAllomancer interesting points, but I disagree slightly 1 hour ago, KandraAllomancer said: A. With Cultivation's modifications of his spiritweb, it would probably be harder for him to form a Nahel bond Both Dalinar and Lift have received modifications from Cultivation. Depending on how you view them, Lift's would be more so than Dalinar's, yet both have bonded spren without issue. 39 minutes ago, KandraAllomancer said: B. Many spren would probably reject him anyway I agree, his variable intelligence would make it difficult for him to maintain a bond, unless the spren is a bit more liberal in interpretation. 39 minutes ago, KandraAllomancer said: C. If he achieved this, though, there could some interesting new Resonance here Not sure if there would be a resonance that would grow from that interaction as his greatly increased intelligence is rare. Hey, Pathfinder! I copied your comment here, could you repost it here? OP double posted the topic. @TheBlueTaco, just go to the other page, click Moderate, click Hide, give reason "accidentally double-posted" and it's done! No need to wait for a mod. I can also copy the comments here over to the other one, if you want to keep that one, rather than this one. @The traveller, that's double-posting too... Edited October 30, 2019 by Honorless 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quantus he/him Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 The modifications seem to be significantly less than Lift, and she had no issues forming the bond. Ditto Dalinar. I suspect his biggest issue with forming the Bonds would be the personality variance between his two extremes: he'd need to fit an order where both versions of himself were willing and able to maintain the Ideals. Some would be easier than others, with Lightweaver still being the most individual and theoretically easy to adapt. Skybreaker might also work, with him swearing Fealty to the Diagram and the Past Self he worships. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That1GuySpencer Posted October 30, 2019 Author Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 13 minutes ago, Honorless said: OP appears to have accidentally double-posted sorry about that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aon Tia she/her Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Honorless said: A. With Cultivation's modifications of his spiritweb, it would probably be harder for him to form a Nahel bond B. Many spren would probably reject him anyway C. If he achieved this, though, there could some interesting new Resonance here @KandraAllomancer On the contrary, I think that such influences opens up the person’s spirit web to influence from other sprens. Lift formed the bond easily and so did Dalinar. I think it is easier for them to form nahel bonds. And I don’t think there is going to be any resonances also. Because cultivation’s influence is not the same as granting investiture. I don’t like the idea of Taravangian becoming a bond smith to NW, because he is already cultivation’s plant, why bond her godspren to him. Why not add another pawn to her long plan by bonding NW to someone else.. I like the idea of Rlain to bond NW, it would be good for the singers to have their own bondsmith on the good side. Edited October 30, 2019 by The traveller 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KandraAllomancer he/him Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 @GoWibble Here is the closest WoB I could find on spiritweb modification: Quote athos45678 Has anyone in the history of Roshar ever had Lift’s special physiology? Or is she like a whole new human Brandon Sanderson You could say anyone that has their DNA or spiritweb meddled with by the Nightwatcher is something new--that said, Lift is an experiment that hasn't been tried before. Skyward Pre-Release AMA (Oct. 12, 2018) 8 hours ago, The traveller said: @KandraAllomancer On the contrary, I think that such influences opens up the person’s spirit web to influence from other sprens. Usually, yes. But if we treat Taravangian as Cultivation's tool, whose Ultimate Empathy Day will be triggered at some point in the future, hardening his spiritweb makes sense. With all the atrocities he's gonna commit, he could ridiculously broken on his less intelligent day and bond with Almighty-know-what kind of spren (a vengeful ashspren? a sociopathic highspren? a Voidspren even?). Such spren would have no problem manipulating dimwitted Taravangian, so why not remove this factor from the equation? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calderis he/him Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 For the longest time before OB, I really hoped that Taravangian would become. Rival Bondsmith. (I still kind of hope for that, but I really doubt it.) Personally, my biggest concern, and why a think any spren would be wary even if he did qualify for their order, is that I think his changing mental state would be problematic for his ability to sustain his oaths. He's very very different people between his high and low days, and expecting both to maintain the same oaths seems like a stretch to me. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karger he/him Posted October 30, 2019 Report Share Posted October 30, 2019 9 minutes ago, Calderis said: For the longest time before OB, I really hoped that Taravangian would become. Rival Bondsmith. (I still kind of hope for that, but I really doubt it.) Personally, my biggest concern, and why a think any spren would be wary even if he did qualify for their order, is that I think his changing mental state would be problematic for his ability to sustain his oaths. He's very very different people between his high and low days, and expecting both to maintain the same oaths seems like a stretch to me. What if he is two different people? Each with a unique identity? Maybe he will bond both spren. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That1GuySpencer Posted October 31, 2019 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2019 23 hours ago, TheBlueTaco said: sorry about that It's fixed now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pathfinder Posted October 31, 2019 Report Share Posted October 31, 2019 I was thinking it over, and I think Taravangian could theoretically maintain a bond to an elsecaller spren. When Taravangian is brilliant, he is logical, which elsecaller spren seem to prize. When he is of lesser intelligence, he is remorseful, but he still holds true to his belief in the logic of the Diagram. He views it as necessary. So although he may think what he does is horrible, he still holds to the logic and potentially what the oaths of the elsecallers that he may have taken. We already know a Machiavellian could be a member without issue. So when lesser intelligence, he may lament his actions, but he still believes in them. Now I do not believe Elsecallers on whole fit this category, but potentially their spren give a little more leeway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quantus he/him Posted October 31, 2019 Report Share Posted October 31, 2019 16 hours ago, Calderis said: For the longest time before OB, I really hoped that Taravangian would become. Rival Bondsmith. (I still kind of hope for that, but I really doubt it.) Personally, my biggest concern, and why a think any spren would be wary even if he did qualify for their order, is that I think his changing mental state would be problematic for his ability to sustain his oaths. He's very very different people between his high and low days, and expecting both to maintain the same oaths seems like a stretch to me. I entirely agree, though I do think there are some that might not have much issue with it. Some traits, like his very Machiavellian "Ends Justifies the Means" worldview persists whether he feels bad about it or not. There are likely Lightweaver Truths that could work while spanning both states. And I personally think the Skybreakers brand of Ideals would be entirely consistent: they specifically dont want to rely on their own judgement, and he could swear to The Diagram itself rather than either state's perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZenBossanova Posted November 2, 2019 Report Share Posted November 2, 2019 If the Nightwatcher is primarily of Cultivation, and Mr T is 'cultivating' the Diagram, then his variable intelligence/empathy may not be a problem. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts