Cosmere THUNDERDOME

[+Invocation]

14 minutes ago, not an Evil Librarian said:

The Lord Ruler has the most valid claim to Godhood out of any character in the Cosmere so far. 

I'd dispute this, since Hoid exists.

[not an Evil Librarian]

3 minutes ago, Invocation said:

I'd dispute this, since Hoid exists.

Yea. Not counting Hoid

[Pathfinder]

20 minutes ago, not an Evil Librarian said:

While regarding Rashek, I think that we must consider one crucial point. The Lord Ruler's purpose, that is, the very reason Brandon Sanderson wrote him, was to be overpowered. he has not written any other character in the Cosmere, aside from the shards for this reason alone. 

That's not to say that there are not any other OP characters in the Cosmere, however none of these characters were created from a base trait of overpowerdness. 

In my opinion, aside from the shards, The Lord Ruler has the most valid claim to Godhood out of any character in the Cosmere so far. 

The Heralds were literal beings who would regularly come back to life to stop the very end of the world using the very fundamental forces of nature on a global scale that were enough to destroy their prior planet. So I do not think Rashek has a monopoly on such a statement lol. 

[not an Evil Librarian]

17 minutes ago, Pathfinder said:

The Heralds were literal beings who would regularly come back to life to stop the very end of the world using the very fundamental forces of nature on a global scale that were enough to destroy their prior planet. So I do not think Rashek has a monopoly on such a statement lol. 

I agree that the Heralds are overpowered, however, I don't think that they were written for the sole purpose of being overpowered. At least not in the same way that the Lord Ruler was.

[Jace21 he/him]

4 hours ago, Pathfinder said:

True, though one would imagine they would be barefoot as they would know they would be limiting their combat effectiveness, and wouldn't need to worry about stubbing their toe lol. Thank you.

You're probably right, but I could also see powerful, majestic beings worshiped as gods believing it was beneath their dignity to go around barefoot. And a few seconds to de-shoe could make all the difference.

3 hours ago, Invocation said:

I'd dispute this, since Hoid exists.

I am pretty much the only one who feels this way, but while I love Hoid, he hasn't impressed me from a power-level yet. In my opinion his seeming immortality and invulnerability are no more impressive then Rashek's but his outward manifestations of investiture are not as notable. I would give the edge to Rashek as a God over Hoid for that reason.

3 hours ago, Pathfinder said:

The Heralds were literal beings who would regularly come back to life to stop the very end of the world using the very fundamental forces of nature on a global scale that were enough to destroy their prior planet. So I do not think Rashek has a monopoly on such a statement lol. 

True but they also died a lot and were eventually joined by a group that shared many of the same powers while clearly being normal men. Simply by being more mysterious the Lord Ruler comes across as the most God-like I think, at least if you compare their treatment by people of their words. I am also unsure the it was the traditional surges that destroyed Ashyn, or just another outward manifestation of investiture they call "surges". The same way Rosharans call several different things "spren".

But to go back to the OP, I still put Rashek/Fullborn first, followed by pre-aharietiam Heralds, then Mistborn with Atium, then by prepared Elantrians, followed by everyone else.

[Pathfinder]

16 hours ago, not an Evil Librarian said:

I agree that the Heralds are overpowered, however, I don't think that they were written for the sole purpose of being overpowered. At least not in the same way that the Lord Ruler was.

Eh I feel we are arguing semantics at this point. Just because we meet the lord ruler at the height of his power while we meet the heralds at the low point of their power does not change the fact that the heralds at their peak had planet destroying capabilities. The lord ruler even with all his compounding (read not holding preservation's power) could not destroy a planet. The Heralds could and had to fight off enemies that literally set back an entire race's advancement multiple times. I will also add that while the lord ruler was worshiped as the sliver of infinity, some cultures on roshar worship the heralds as direct divinities. So I feel narratively we are supposed to ask ourselves "given how powerful the voidbringers are implied to be to be a global extinction threat, then one must wonder how incredibly powerful the heralds must have been if they originally held back the tide by themselves."

12 hours ago, Jace21 said:

You're probably right, but I could also see powerful, majestic beings worshiped as gods believing it was beneath their dignity to go around barefoot. And a few seconds to de-shoe could make all the difference.

I am pretty much the only one who feels this way, but while I love Hoid, he hasn't impressed me from a power-level yet. In my opinion his seeming immortality and invulnerability are no more impressive then Rashek's but his outward manifestations of investiture are not as notable. I would give the edge to Rashek as a God over Hoid for that reason.

True but they also died a lot and were eventually joined by a group that shared many of the same powers while clearly being normal men. Simply by being more mysterious the Lord Ruler comes across as the most God-like I think, at least if you compare their treatment by people of their words. I am also unsure the it was the traditional surges that destroyed Ashyn, or just another outward manifestation of investiture they call "surges". The same way Rosharans call several different things "spren".

But to go back to the OP, I still put Rashek/Fullborn first, followed by pre-aharietiam Heralds, then Mistborn with Atium, then by prepared Elantrians, followed by everyone else.

Lol and I could see combatants that have fought a war for ages that involves preserving all human life, dispensing with formalities if it means they would win. Vasher would be a good example of this to me. 

Well the prime reason you would not be impressed is because he cannot actively hurt people. So he has to think of round about ways of using his abilities to accomplish his goals. But take away that restriction and one can only imagine what he could potentially accomplish

I responded to most of this already above. The only power that the lord ruler could theoretically use to destroy a planet using compounding is weight and even then I believe I read a WoB or two that said it wouldn't quite work that way. You have beings that have access to the fundamental forces of the universe, with an unlimited supply and still they just barely hold back the voidbringers. What does that tell me? The voidbringers are a danger magnitudes greater than the lord ruler ever could be. 

I still think based on what I presented, the Heralds could take Rashek. 

[goody153]

Quote

I still think based on what I presented, the Heralds could take Rashek. 

Highly doubt it. I mean Heralds are overpowered sure but if you have read that part where Marasi and Wax are accessed fullborn powers. They basically won like nothing and that's a not even a minute fullborn users.  Think about fullborn's who know what they are doing like Rashek, Marsh and arguably Kelsier.

A fullborn is literally superman(speed, strength, invulnerability and flight to the point of sonic boom levels of flight) who can predict all your movement prior to even moving a muscle (Atium + Zinc Feruchemy)

I mean the Heralds can be killed by thunderclasps(this has been stated on the prelude/prologue of WoTK). Just giant rock creatures. 

[Jace21 he/him]

On 1/29/2019 at 8:32 AM, Pathfinder said:

Lol and I could see combatants that have fought a war for ages that involves preserving all human life, dispensing with formalities if it means they would win. Vasher would be a good example of this to me. 

Oh I absolutely agree that they could and probably would. I was just pointing out that from what little we know about the Heralds personalities, it wouldn't surprise me if they wore shoes either.

On 1/29/2019 at 8:32 AM, Pathfinder said:

Well the prime reason you would not be impressed is because he cannot actively hurt people. So he has to think of round about ways of using his abilities to accomplish his goals. But take away that restriction and one can only imagine what he could potentially accomplish

No, the main reason I am not impressed is because his known powers aren't particularly scary. Even if we let him hurt people then he is a mistborn/ 1st ideal lightweaver of the 2nd heightening. No where near full born level. Even if you factor in his vague, imprecise way of predicting events and realmatic knowledge I can't see it overcoming the power gap. Which is why, outside of his immortality I don't find him that impressive. I love him, but until more powers are shown it is only his immortality/ivulnerability that makes him Godlike, nothing else.

On 1/29/2019 at 8:32 AM, Pathfinder said:

I responded to most of this already above. The only power that the lord ruler could theoretically use to destroy a planet using compounding is weight and even then I believe I read a WoB or two that said it wouldn't quite work that way. You have beings that have access to the fundamental forces of the universe, with an unlimited supply and still they just barely hold back the voidbringers. What does that tell me? The voidbringers are a danger magnitudes greater than the lord ruler ever could be. 

Faulty logic. Based on what we know of a Herald/Radiants capabilities and the capabilities of Voidbringers, particularly in early despolations before they mastered the surges, the more logical leap is that the Heralds were not as powerful as they seem.

They had unlimited power from Honor, sure, but what was the rate they were limited to? The Fused seem to have unlimited Voidlight but still can't accelerate as fast as Kaladin, presumably because while they never run out, they are limited in how much they can use in one go. Maybe the Heralds were the same. There is also the fact that unlimited Stormlight makes you practically unkillable whereas the Heralds repeatedly died, possibly before the Fused even got surges. Clearly their direct line to Honor did not equate to unlimited power.

And since the Lord Ruler and Voidbringers have varying styles and provide completely different power sets, the ability to beat or not beat one of them doesn't necessarily relate to beating the other.

[Pathfinder]

9 hours ago, goody153 said:

Highly doubt it. I mean Heralds are overpowered sure but if you have read that part where Marasi and Wax are accessed fullborn powers. They basically won like nothing and that's a not even a minute fullborn users.  Think about fullborn's who know what they are doing like Rashek, Marsh and arguably Kelsier.

A fullborn is literally superman(speed, strength, invulnerability and flight to the point of sonic boom levels of flight) who can predict all your movement prior to even moving a muscle (Atium + Zinc Feruchemy)

I mean the Heralds can be killed by thunderclasps(this has been stated on the prelude/prologue of WoTK). Just giant rock creatures. 

Using comic books as an example, Rashek would be like superman as you said, while the heralds would be like Franklin Richards with matter, energy, and reality manipulation. That is why I feel the Heralds as they were originally directly fueled by Honor could take Rashek

33 minutes ago, Jace21 said:

Oh I absolutely agree that they could and probably would. I was just pointing out that from what little we know about the Heralds personalities, it wouldn't surprise me if they wore shoes either.

No, the main reason I am not impressed is because his known powers aren't particularly scary. Even if we let him hurt people then he is a mistborn/ 1st ideal lightweaver of the 2nd heightening. No where near full born level. Even if you factor in his vague, imprecise way of predicting events and realmatic knowledge I can't see it overcoming the power gap. Which is why, outside of his immortality I don't find him that impressive. I love him, but until more powers are shown it is only his immortality/ivulnerability that makes him Godlike, nothing else.

Faulty logic. Based on what we know of a Herald/Radiants capabilities and the capabilities of Voidbringers, particularly in early despolations before they mastered the surges, the more logical leap is that the Heralds were not as powerful as they seem.

They had unlimited power from Honor, sure, but what was the rate they were limited to? The Fused seem to have unlimited Voidlight but still can't accelerate as fast as Kaladin, presumably because while they never run out, they are limited in how much they can use in one go. Maybe the Heralds were the same. There is also the fact that unlimited Stormlight makes you practically unkillable whereas the Heralds repeatedly died, possibly before the Fused even got surges. Clearly their direct line to Honor did not equate to unlimited power.

And since the Lord Ruler and Voidbringers have varying styles and provide completely different power sets, the ability to beat or not beat one of them doesn't necessarily relate to beating the other.

I understand.

I do feel the need to point out since he has a prohibition from directly harming people, he would seek powers, and employ them in more subtle ways in order to accomplish his same goals. All he has accomplished says to me that if that prohibition was not in the way, what he would do and accomplish would be far more scarier. But I recognize this is purely opinion based. 

I have to disagree with you here. We know via WoB that the honorblades were originally powered directly by honor. It was only because of Honor's shattering that they no longer work quite the same way, coupled with the subsequent users not knowing how to fully employ their abilities (for instance Szeth believing they require 10 heartbeats, so it thereby takes 10 heartbeats to summon). When have we seen an individual fueled directly by a shard? Vin when fighting the Inquisitors and as you mentioned Marasi/Wax with the bands. Vin was able to steel push the trace elements of Kredik Shaw and level the building. So using that metric as a guide, why would the surge of transformation fueled directly by honor be limited? What is to stop a Herald from turning an entire city into smoke? What is to stop a Herald from increasing the gravitational pull of an area the size of Alethkar enough to turn everything to pulp? I can go on with cohesion, tension, division, abrasion, transportation, regrowth, illumination, and adhesion. So then I say by proxy, if the Heralds held this level of power, and had to fight off to hold off an enemy that they barely defeated, then we have not seen anywhere near what Odium can bring to bear yet. 

I think their power levels do in fact relate to each other. 

[not an Evil Librarian]

I think that I should point this out, but this fight specifically excludes shards. In my opinion, being directly powered by a shard counts as a shard being involved in the fight. So I don't think that we can count the heralds being powered by Honor anymore than we could count Rashek in the Well of Ascension, or Vin being powered by the mists.

[Pathfinder]

1 hour ago, not an Evil Librarian said:

I think that I should point this out, but this fight specifically excludes shards. In my opinion, being directly powered by a shard counts as a shard being involved in the fight. So I don't think that we can count the heralds being powered by Honor anymore than we could count Rashek in the Well of Ascension, or Vin being powered by the mists.

I am fine with that. Exclude Heralds, Rashek (and any other fullborn), and Vin powered by the mists. Theoretically we could say Elantrians are directly powered by a shard, but given that they have to draw the aon first, I think that balances things out. Thoughts? OP?

[goody153]

6 hours ago, Pathfinder said:

I am fine with that. Exclude Heralds, Rashek (and any other fullborn), and Vin powered by the mists. Theoretically we could say Elantrians are directly powered by a shard, but given that they have to draw the aon first, I think that balances things out. Thoughts? OP?

Eh Rashek only drew from the mist once. After becoming a fullborn like Kelsier or Marsh he never did make use of it. So he definitely counts cause if we are going by rough definition nobody ever is allowed to participate lol

Vin as Mistborn without the mists can count.

Heralds count. 

Quote

Using comic books as an example, Rashek would be like superman as you said, while the heralds would be like Franklin Richards with matter, energy, and reality manipulation. That is why I feel the Heralds as they were originally directly fueled by Honor could take Rashek

Still gets killed by giant rock monsters(yes the unlimited investitures still gets killed by thunderclasps or even odium's fused). Meanwhile Lord Ruler literally is unstoppable until he has metals within him or from the metalmind

And you make it sound like Heralds have shard levels manipulation. Which they don't. (even surge of transformation is limited to how much resistance through investiture and will a certain thing/person has which if it meant Rashek means you are talking about the guy who have Ruin inside his head for 1000 years and as invested as a person can get)

They may have access to Honor's investiture but they can only apply it view Honorblade(they basically can't make use of that investiture without honorblade .. aka they are powerless ) which makes them no different from the Radiants when Dalinar decided to make a honor's perpendicularity (basically they only have excess investiture .. if that means that rock monsters still manages to kill them would mean unlimited investiture doesn't really matter much for surgebinding) lol

Rashek or any fullborn kills any radiant or just about anything in cosmere for that matter that isn't a shard. 

You just can't do much against something who moves faster and thinks faster before you could even respond or think. Not to mention they don't suffer the "flash problem" as they have atium which predicts the enemy movements + zinc hemalurgy. 

Edited February 1, 2019 by goody153

[Embrisk he/him]

Duralumin x 1kg of brass

 everyone does of heart attack. 

[Bigmikey357 he/him]

Renarin as a 3 Oath Radiant killed a thunderclast with a look. Jasnah broke a Fused with a soulcast wall. Shallan took an arrow to the face and healed. I brought up these examples of the prowess of Radiants, and not even fully Oathed Radiants to prove a point. If these limited people can do things like this then image how much more powerful a Herald with a direct connection would be. You have to remember the enemy they fought had their own direct connection to a Shard and were vastly more numerous than they. Yet they overcame that threat time after time. Underestimating the Heralds in this battle would be a mistake. 

Now, Rashek is powerful, extremely so. But I give the Heralds a better than even chance of besting him. Why? Because of all the people in the dome the Heralds are the only ones he cannot kill with one punch. And as fast as he is the moment he goes for a Herald, even if he kills the Herald, he has got to stay in place to finish the job, giving the other Heralds time to bring their gifts into play. Rashek can take a punch too but his goldminds are not infinite even with Compounding. No matter how powerful Rashek is he still has a limited fuel source, and some of those metals burn really fast. Plus, if he doesn't go for the Elsecaller first he's screwed in a prolonged engagement. She'll just soulcast his metals away or change their composition to poison him.

[Jace21 he/him]

7 hours ago, Bigmikey357 said:

Renarin as a 3 Oath Radiant killed a thunderclast with a look. Jasnah broke a Fused with a soulcast wall. Shallan took an arrow to the face and healed.

The Spren animating it left after it was crippled by multiple Shardbearers. The Spren didnt die and the "look" almost certainly wouldnt have worked pre-crippling. And Renarin is weird, we dont know if that contributed.

The other two are no more impressive than metallic arts users have done.

7 hours ago, Bigmikey357 said:

Because of all the people in the dome the Heralds are the only ones he cannot kill with one punch. And as fast as he is the moment he goes for a Herald, even if he kills the Herald, he has got to stay in place to finish the job, giving the other Heralds time to bring their gifts into play. Rashek can take a punch too but his goldminds are not infinite even with Compounding. No matter how powerful Rashek is he still has a limited fuel source, and some of those metals burn really fast.

Speculation. We have no idea whwt the Heralds healing powers were. They were fueled directly by Honor, not Stormlight. Unlimited Stormlight makes you essentially unkillable and the Heralds died a lot. Multiple times to Thunderclast, who the Lord Ruler can match for strength easily with feruchemy. 

He has had 1000 years to compound I am willing to bet his fuel is as good limitless, as in, he can kill anyone that is killable before he runs out. The fastest burning one is pewter but he'll be relying on Feruchemy for physical attributes anyway.

7 hours ago, Bigmikey357 said:

Plus, if he doesn't go for the Elsecaller first he's screwed in a prolonged engagement. She'll just soulcast his metals away or change their composition to poison him.

It would be incredibly tough/impossible to soulcast the Lord Ruler, the metals in his stomach or his metalminds. Could work but its hard to say definitively that the Elsecaller would be the biggest threat.

[Pathfinder]

16 hours ago, goody153 said:

Eh Rashek only drew from the mist once. After becoming a fullborn like Kelsier or Marsh he never did make use of it. So he definitely counts cause if we are going by rough definition nobody ever is allowed to participate lol

Vin as Mistborn without the mists can count.

Heralds count. 

Still gets killed by giant rock monsters(yes the unlimited investitures still gets killed by thunderclasps or even odium's fused). Meanwhile Lord Ruler literally is unstoppable until he has metals within him or from the metalmind

And you make it sound like Heralds have shard levels manipulation. Which they don't. (even surge of transformation is limited to how much resistance through investiture and will a certain thing/person has which if it meant Rashek means you are talking about the guy who have Ruin inside his head for 1000 years and as invested as a person can get)

They may have access to Honor's investiture but they can only apply it view Honorblade(they basically can't make use of that investiture without honorblade .. aka they are powerless ) which makes them no different from the Radiants when Dalinar decided to make a honor's perpendicularity (basically they only have excess investiture .. if that means that rock monsters still manages to kill them would mean unlimited investiture doesn't really matter much for surgebinding) lol

Rashek or any fullborn kills any radiant or just about anything in cosmere for that matter that isn't a shard. 

You just can't do much against something who moves faster and thinks faster before you could even respond or think. Not to mention they don't suffer the "flash problem" as they have atium which predicts the enemy movements + zinc hemalurgy. 

I was not going to go through the effort of replying as I had responded to all these points in my prior posts, so if you after having already read those, you still disagree, then its reached the point of agreeing to disagree. These are extinction level events that still nearly wiped out humanity even with the inclusion of the heralds, and a fully staffed army of fully oathed radiants. If a dam has broken in the past, and people are concerned of flood waters, while you only got to experience a slight rising in the water level from a casual rain storm, does not mean the past rain storms that did break the dam are weak. It just means you have not experienced the full strength of that past rainstorm yet. Odium was convinced he would win with Dalinar. he didn't need his full forces. Things will change when we reach book 4 and 5. But as I said, I already made these points, so I am unsure what the purpose is to persist. Thank you. 

14 hours ago, Sharshiblarb said:

Duralumin x 1kg of brass

 everyone does of heart attack. 

Lol depending on the individual effected it would do nothing. 

 

2 hours ago, Jace21 said:

The Spren animating it left after it was crippled by multiple Shardbearers. The Spren didnt die and the "look" almost certainly wouldnt have worked pre-crippling. And Renarin is weird, we dont know if that contributed.

The other two are no more impressive than metallic arts users have done.

Speculation. We have no idea whwt the Heralds healing powers were. They were fueled directly by Honor, not Stormlight. Unlimited Stormlight makes you essentially unkillable and the Heralds died a lot. Multiple times to Thunderclast, who the Lord Ruler can match for strength easily with feruchemy. 

He has had 1000 years to compound I am willing to bet his fuel is as good limitless, as in, he can kill anyone that is killable before he runs out. The fastest burning one is pewter but he'll be relying on Feruchemy for physical attributes anyway.

It would be incredibly tough/impossible to soulcast the Lord Ruler, the metals in his stomach or his metalminds. Could work but its hard to say definitively that the Elsecaller would be the biggest threat.

Two of the heralds also have access to regrowth which as per Renarin accelerated healing with natural healing to an insane level, and that is just a normal radiant, not counting a herald. 

[Bigmikey357 he/him]

Compounding for 1000 years but he still has to store that Investiture. The storage medium, the bracers, are finite. Metalminds do not have unlimited storage. And we see an example of how fast one can run through the power of those bracers when Wax holds the Bands. He's going to have to refuel in a prolonged battle.

As for the Heralds, its all speculations. We know Heralds died. We know the enemy they fought and an inkling of their capabilities. What we don't know is how they actually bit it, how many Fused or Thunderclast it took to end a Herald. Logic suggests it had to be a crapload of punishment considering that they ended up surviving Apocalypses, 10 against thousands. It cannot be as simple as one rock monster smashing one Herald; if it was there'd be no surviving humans on Roshar. After all, Renarin also got stomped in that same battle by that Thunderclast and shrugged it off. Unless you think a Herald is weaker in power than a less-than-fully upgraded Radiant.

Stormlight IS Honor's Investiture, in gaseous form. The Heralds with their direct connection works similar to Kaladin fighting in a highstorm. And we've seen how powerful a direct connection to a Shard is in Mistborn, how it breaks rules. Vin with a direct connection checkmated Rashek after all.  Battar can soulcast at a distance; she may not be able to soulcast metalminds but the metal in his stomach or the vials he'd be carrying should not pose too much difficulty if she knows the significance. 

All I'm saying is Rashek ain't going to crush the Heralds quickly. It can be done but not quickly. Especially if they get fitted with some Shardplate too. If you think that Rashek just murders the entire field of battle in less than 3 seconds then I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

[Fezzik]

4 hours ago, Bigmikey357 said:

Battar can soulcast at a distance;

What? Source please. Last I knew, the Heralds did not get resonances, and we didn't know whether ranged soulcasting was a resonance.

[Bigmikey357 he/him]

If Jasnah can do it then Battar, the Elsecaller Herald should be able to as well. Ranged Soulcasting is a feature, not a Resonance. Could be wrong.

[Pathfinder]

1 hour ago, John203 said:

What? Source please. Last I knew, the Heralds did not get resonances, and we didn't know whether ranged soulcasting was a resonance.

Actually we do not know that heralds do not get resonances. We only know in Jezerin's particular case he did not get squires because none of the heralds did and that happened to be the resonance that the windrunners get (strength of squires). I have bolded the relevant part. 

 

Ray745
You have stated that each Knights Radiant order gets their own unique ability, for lack of a better word, due to the combination of their surges. For instance, you have stated this ability for the Windrunners is strength of squires. My question - is this due to the Nahel bond, or just inherent in the surges combining. Would a non-Radiant get these abilities from the Honorblades, or would they be out of luck due to no Nahel bond?

Brandon Sanderson
Good question! The unique abilities have more to do with the powers interacting, same as how twinborn will often manifest some odd side effects of the powers interacting. But there are limitations. For example, Jezrien didn't actually have any squires, as none of the Heralds did.

 

Also note to the side about comparing the heralds to the radiants, WoB below, bolded pertinent portion

 

WindRunner88 [PENDING REVIEW] (paraphrased)
So far during The Stormlight Archive we've seen that the spren bond appears to have some distinct advantages (i.e. armor, more efficient Stormlight consumption, access to a variety of weapons) over what Tanavast via the Oathpact provided the Heralds. With the exception of Nale, and the fact that the Heralds had no need for Stormlight, can you please tell me one way in which a Herald had a distinct advantage over a level 5 Radiant of their corresponding  order?

Brandon Sanderson [PENDING REVIEW] (paraphrased)
Rebirth. *pause* The Heralds had access to raw levels of power that no Radiant could obtain.

Edited February 1, 2019 by Pathfinder

[asterion137 he/him]

On 1/28/2019 at 8:42 AM, Shard of Thought said:

I would argue that we're not really certain of any of Kelsier's powers at this point. I mean, I agree that he's definitely a force to be reckoned with, but we don't know what his actual power set is. 

We do know he can create the Bands, which means he's a Fullborn, no?

[Zephrun’s Imperium]

3 hours ago, asterion137 said:

We do know he can create the Bands, which means he's a Fullborn, no?

Eh, true. I'm still skeptical. 

[Stormblessed Dolphin he/him]

Since his whole thing was "I'm gonna go annoy Spook with hemalurgy." I think it's reasonable that he would be a Fullborn or close to it. 

ofc, he's also bound to Scadrial.