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Posted (edited)

I love categorizing characters using systems outside their canon (like sorting people into Hogwarts houses, for example), so I've thought a little bit about which orders of the Knights Radiant certain characters would belong to, should they exist on Roshar. I’m curious—does anyone else do this? Do you have any thoughts about which order your favorite book/show/game/etc.’s characters would fall into?

(Spoiler tags to prevent this post from being ridiculously long.)

Avatar: The Last Airbender

Spoiler

Based on what little we know of Willshapers—they’re explorers, somewhat capracious and unreliable—I’d guess that Aang belongs to their order. Sure, he matures throughout the series as he comes to accept his responsibilities...but he never loses that spark. That said, there’s a strong thematic parallel between the Avatar and the Order of Bondsmiths: few in number (no more than three Bondsmiths, or one Avatar, at a time) and tasked with leading the whole world away from evil. Not to mention, if you take Legend of Korra as canon, Aang is bonded to a spirit of legendary renown.

Katara is an Edgedancer—look no further than “The Painted Lady.” I was going to say that Sokka was a Windrunner, but he breaks promises way too easily when it’s convenient for him; he’s probably a Bondsmith, taskmaster that he is. Suki could be a Windrunner. Zuko I want to say is a Dustbringer, but that’s a rather superficial classification based on his firebending; I could also see an argument for Bondsmith, although I’m not as sure. I have a strong feeling Toph is a Dustbringer; Stoneward seems like the obvious choice based on her powers, but “I will stand when others fall” doesn’t really fit Toph’s character, and her go-getter attitude feels somewhat similar to Malata’s.

Steven Universe

Spoiler

Steven is a Bondsmith. You could make an argument for Willshaper or Edgedancer, but bringing people together has been Steven’s thing since episode 1, and as of recent episodes it looks like he’s on track to (eventually) unite humans and gems on a societal scale. If you want to get specific, you could say he’s bonded to the Nightwatcher, since that fits both his elemental powers and the themes of change and growth that run through the series.

Rose is an interesting case. Her most relevant piece of characterization, I think, is the way she fell in love with Earth and championed its defense. My best guess is that she’s a Willshaper, although that might change once we know the order’s Second Ideal. My next choice is Lightweaver: given how many secrets she kept, she’d have some very interesting Truths to share. But in spite of all this, it seems like the image she was trying to project to the world—that of the all-benevolent healer and mother figure, hero to the forgotten and downtrodden—was closer to an Edgedancer... (Perhaps deliberately shaping her own image against the reality of her personality is another point for Lightweaver?)

For Pearl, I can’t decide between Lightweaver and Skybreaker. On the one hand, she bore the burden of Rose’s secrets for thousands of years, and one of her defining moments (from “Now We’re Only Falling Apart”) is when she starts making up stories about her own history; all of that says Lightweaver to me. On the other, she values following the rules, and she kind of reads like a Skybreakers who’s sworn her Third Ideal to Rose.

Garnet I’ll guess is a Truthwatcher. We don’t know anything about Truthwatchers’ Ideals besides “using information to help people,” but that seems fairly in line with Garnet’s modus operandi. Amethyst is either a Dustbringer or an Edgedancer, I think, depending on how her self-image issues translate to her perception of others. Just thinking back to the most recent Amethyst-centric episode (“What’s Your Problem?”), I’d say Edgedancer.

I was going to say that Connie seems like a Windrunner—after all, she says she wants to learn swordfighting so she can protect her home—but I think Willshaper is a distinct possibility. I’m starting to think that her love of fantasy novels affects the way she sees her adventures with Steven; she has that spark for adventure. Jasper is pretty clearly a Skybreaker, based on her devotion to Homeworld’s caste system. Bismuth’s devotion to the cause, her ability to get the other Crystal Gems pumped, and her beefy design all make me think Stoneward. Peridot’s love of rationality makes me think Elsecaller, though I'm not completely sure. Lapis is hard to read since most of her actions have been self-interested.

She-Ra and the Princesses of Power (the 2018 reboot, that is)

Spoiler

Thinking about Adora and Catra’s conflict in terms of the...slight difference between Windrunners and Edgedancers is kind of making my heart hurt. Catra considers the Horde a place for outcasts, for all the people who, like herself, don’t quite fit in; hence, “I will remember those who have been forgotten.” But Adora doesn’t see the Horde that way; she doesn’t see the world that way. She sees innocent, powerless people dying, and she wants to protect them; hence, “I will protect those who cannot protect themselves.” But Catra doesn't want to be protected, she wants to be remembered, and just ow my heart.

Otherwise, Frosta is definitely a Skybreaker. Seahawk is definitely a Willshaper, unless Brandon really throws us for a loop with that Second Ideal. I don’t have a good read on any of the other characters.

Puella Magi Madoka Magica

Spoiler

Madoka is an Edgedancer. From episode 4: “That’s horrible! She fought to protect everyone for so long on her own! To think that no one will even realize she’s dead...that’s just too sad. [...] I won’t forget...I’ll never forget about Mami! Never! [...] You too, Homura! You too—I swear I’ll never forget you either! I’ll never forget the way you saved us yesterday!”

Sayaka, self-styled “champion of justice,” is a Windrunner, while the morally grey and openly destructive Kyoko is probably a Dustbringer. Mami is an Elsecaller; while not a scholar, she is someone who values careful consideration over impulsive action. I’ll stake Homura as a Truthwatcher for now, again with the disclaimer that we really don’t know much about Truthwatchers; none of the other orders seem to fit her, anyway.

 

Edited by Joy
corrected formatting
Posted

Vin From Mistborn would be an edgedancer while Elend would be a truthwatcher (or elsecaller)

However from different franchises like Avatar the last airbender, Zuko would be a windrunner

Posted (edited)

@Eris I hadn't considered Zuko as a Windrunner. I guess it could work, although I don't think his sense of "honor" is quite in line with what the honorspren are looking for. He seems less driven by protecting the innocent and more by finding his place in the world (he thought it was finding the Avatar, then realized it was actually teaching the Avatar). Now that I say that, I'm kind of thinking Skybreaker? But I'm still not sure.

And I can't believe I didn't even consider characters from within the cosmere but outside Stormlight when making this post! I'll have to sleep on that. I definitely agree with Edgedancer Vin and Truthwatcher Elend.

Edited by Joy
last sentence
Posted

@Joy Though with Zuko, you could argue his searching to find where he belongs in the world is what Kaladin is doing. Zuko wanted to save his mum and blames himself, same with his uncle. He again is like Kaladin in the aspect that Kaladin fights/kills the Parshendi similar to Zuko not caring about others that aren't firebenders until he is enlightened by the avatar. However Skybreakers would not be a good one because Zuko kept breaking laws and speaking up, thus not fitting

I loved mistborn and read it first so that's why I always go back to it. 

Posted

Zuko may only become a squire because he doesn't really fit with any of the other orders

Posted (edited)

Avatar (like everybody above): 

Spoiler

 

Aang as a Willshaper (although being the Avatar might make him an Elsecaller or Bondsmith by default)

Sokka...I kinda see him being a Willshaper too. It's not his love of adventure, but his love for technology in any form points him to that, and his willingness to (eventually) let go of his own pride to see a new solution would fit in well here.

Katara...Katara would be a Lightweaver posing as an Edgedancer. Oh Katara is definitely a healing and maternal person, but I'm not sure that's who she really is. Due to the loss of her mom, Katara was more or less forced into that role (which is partially why I think people pair her with Zuko - he's one of the few characters she DOESN'T act motherly towards). But all that healing, all that maternal nature, it's a façade. Katara's a fighter; she's her best self in combat and she's darn fierce too. She fights for what she wants, what she feels like she deserves, and will use any means to justify it. In the end, she's the one who takes out Azula. Not Zuko. Not Aang. Not Toph. Katara. 

Speaking of Toph, I'd put both her AND Zuko as Stonewards (although Toph has a case for Dustbringer). Neither of these characters EVER give up. They overcome through sheer force of will and drag others to greatness on the way. 

Iroh would be an Elsecaller. I'd love to make him a Bondsmith too, but Iroh focuses on the spirits and his nephew more than the world, so he gets Elsecaller.

MCU (AVENGERS ONLY) (in Sorting Hat Chats style)

Spoiler

Captain America - Windrunner primary with both a Bondsmith and a burned Skybreaker secondary.

Iron Man - Willshaper primary with a Windrunner secondary

Thor - Dustbringer probably (although Stoneward is a potential) - we don't know enough about either to make a good point.

Hulk - Dustbringer DEFINITELY

Black Widow - Lightweaver primary with a Skybreaker secondary

Scarlet Witch - Dustbringer primary and a burned Edgedancer secondary?

Vision - Truthwatcher primary and an Edgedancer secondary

Falcon - Windrunner primary (he's a Squire of cap after all!) 

War Machine - Skybreaker primary and Windrunner secondary

Nick Fury - Bondsmith primary with an Elsecaller secondary

Spider-Man - Windrunner primary, I can't think of a secondary at the moment

Mistborn Era 2

Spoiler

Wax - Windrunner/Skybreaker - Wax's thing is protecting people by virtue of the law. But he doesn't really follow it himself, existing outside of it in the city and becoming it in the Roughs. I'd like to paint Wax as a pure Skybreaker and in a way he is. I believe that he's more or less what Skybreakers SHOULD look like. But as it is now, I think Honorspren would be all over him too. 

Wayne - Lightweaver - Wayne is a pure Lightweaver through and through. In many ways, he's the opposite of Shallan. He doesn't lie to himself when he's in character or to escape himself. He does it to reach other people and get the job done. 

Marasi - Skybreaker - Marasi is a person who loves the law, while Wax is a person who loves justice. They're not at odds, not yet at least. And they follow the same ideal, but one adheres more on the side of the law of the people while the other on the law of the world in a way.

Steris - Elsecaller - Oh Steris my Steris. This is probably the best fit for her right now, but we'll see in the future.

MeLaan - Lightweaver by ability, Dustbringer by nature.

 

 

Edited by Use the Falchion
Posted

buffyamends__span.jpg

Spoiler

 

Buffy: Windrunner

Angel: Skybreaker

Willow: This one is stupid hard, she qualifies for a bunch near-equally. I'll say Lightweaver but Truthwatcher, Edgedancer, and Elsecaller all could fit really.

Xander: Bondsmith, he's the glue.

Giles: Truthwatcher. He is, after all, a Watcher. >.<

Spike: Dustbringer.

Oz: Elsecaller, tough one but I think it fits the best out of the options.

Dawn: Willshaper, or maybe kicked out of the KR altogether. -_-

Anya: Dustbringer going with the whole Vengeance Demon thingy?

Cordelia: By the end of everything she isn't a KR, she's a Sliver, maybe even a Shard.

Tara: Edgedancer.

Riley: Skybreaker or Stoneward.

Faith: Dustbringer.

Andrew: Truthwatcher.

Wesley at the Beginning: Truthwatcher.

Wesley at the End: Dustbringer.

Illyria: Lightweaver the most, but she has varied powers. 

 

 

Posted

With the reservation that I am bad at this stuff:

Star Wars

Spoiler

Luke Skywalker - Willshaper? Or Edgedancer?

Kylo Ren - ...maaaaaybe Dustbringer?

Leia - Windrunner 

Obi-Wan - Bondsmith or Windrunner

Anakin - Totally Windrunner

 

Lets do some ASoIaF as well:

Spoiler

Jon Snow - Windrunner

Daenerys - Edgedancer maybe?

Davos - Stoneward?

Beric Dondarrion - Windrunner or Bondsmith. Probably both, because he is that awesome.

Joffrey - Yelig-Nar

 

Posted
7 hours ago, Use the Falchion said:

Sokka...I kinda see him being a Willshaper too. It's not his love of adventure, but his love for technology in any form points him to that, and his willingness to (eventually) let go of his own pride to see a new solution would fit in well here.

I can see that! I guess you could say that Sokka is a Willshaper who nevertheless aspires to the role of Bondsmith, due to his own issues with what it means to be a leader and to be a man. I'm not completely sold, since Sokka doesn't strike me as particularly capricious or unreliable (in fact, he's more of a stick in the mud about staying on task than most of the protagonists), but it's an interesting idea.

7 hours ago, Use the Falchion said:

Katara...Katara would be a Lightweaver posing as an Edgedancer. Oh Katara is definitely a healing and maternal person, but I'm not sure that's who she really is. Due to the loss of her mom, Katara was more or less forced into that role (which is partially why I think people pair her with Zuko - he's one of the few characters she DOESN'T act motherly towards). But all that healing, all that maternal nature, it's a façade. Katara's a fighter; she's her best self in combat and she's darn fierce too. She fights for what she wants, what she feels like she deserves, and will use any means to justify it. In the end, she's the one who takes out Azula. Not Zuko. Not Aang. Not Toph. Katara.

I agree with you that Katara is not, by nature, a healing or maternal person. However, I don't think that calling Katara an Edgedancer necessarily reduces her to that motherly role. She is a fighter, and the battles she chooses to fight are often for people who have otherwise been overlooked. When I brought up the "The Painted Lady," I was thinking about the argument she had with Sokka: he was thinking of the big picture, so he didn't care about helping one little village; but she refused to turn a blind eye. That, to me, says Edgedancer. In addition, I don't think someone getting forced into a role that doesn't suit them automatically makes that person into a Lightweaver; I think there needs to be some degree of secrecy, introspection, or at least creativity.

7 hours ago, Use the Falchion said:

Speaking of Toph, I'd put both her AND Zuko as Stonewards (although Toph has a case for Dustbringer). Neither of these characters EVER give up. They overcome through sheer force of will and drag others to greatness on the way. 

Iroh would be an Elsecaller. I'd love to make him a Bondsmith too, but Iroh focuses on the spirits and his nephew more than the world, so he gets Elsecaller.

I totally agree with Iroh as an Elsecaller! And Zuko as a Stoneward isn't something I'd considered, but it makes sense.

Posted
7 hours ago, Toaster Retribution said:

With the reservation that I am bad at this stuff:

Star Wars

  Reveal hidden contents

Luke Skywalker - Willshaper? Or Edgedancer?

Kylo Ren - ...maaaaaybe Dustbringer?

Leia - Windrunner 

Obi-Wan - Bondsmith or Windrunner

Anakin - Totally Windrunner

 

Lets do some ASoIaF as well:

  Reveal hidden contents

Jon Snow - Windrunner

Daenerys - Edgedancer maybe?

Davos - Stoneward?

Beric Dondarrion - Windrunner or Bondsmith. Probably both, because he is that awesome.

Joffrey - Yelig-Nar

 

That last ASoIaF got a laugh out of me. Let me see what I can do there too

ASoIaF

Spoiler

John - Windrunner. Or at least that's where he started. His Night's Watch oaths should point him to being a Skybreaker (as the Night's Watch is a neutral organization, legally bound by its purpose and now the letter means more than the word), but I agree that John and his group would definitely be Windrunners. However, where he is in the show, John is both a Windrunner and a Bondsmith. He sees the bigger picture; he sees the endgame (April 26, 2019), and he's the major one fighting to unite people to get through it. 

Sansa - Lightweaver. Sansa I always saw as a good contrast to Shallan, and it's not just the red hair. Where Shallan was down, Sansa was up, and vice-versa. Sansa could have used a Shallan in earlier books, whereas Shallan could use the woman who Sansa's become in the show.

Arya - Arya probably wouldn't swear any oaths, tbh. But if she did, I'm torn between her being a Lightweaver (her book path at the moment) and an Edgedancer (her show path). I think her and Lift would have some really great interactions, and Arya is a free spirit...I just worry her ability to slip into other roles would echo too much of Shallan's problems...

Bran - Truthwatcher. Would probably get along too well with Renarin...

Tyrion - Edgedancer - "I have a tender spot in my heart for cripples and bastards and broken things." If that's not an Edgedancer mindset I don't know what is. What makes this more ironic would be his looks and his lack of ability to wield a sword.  

Daenrys - Either what you said as a Dustbringer (I guess all Targaryens would be that with the exception of Rheagar who would've been a Truthwatcher) or maybe an Elsecaller. I find her too similar to Jasnah in some ways to not be an Elsecaller...

Sam - Windrunner. He'd be the most unlikely of the Windrunners, but he would definitely be one. 

Davos - Yup, definitely a Stoneward

Jaime Lannister - Skybreaker turned Windrunner - Jaime's a walking contradiction of vows and he knows it. But he'd rather swear to laws that keep him close to Cersei than the greater good (although he has his moments). Where he is in the book and in the show leads him to finally breaking with whatever law he needs to uphold (and in turn breaking with his sister) in order to do what is right.

Brienne of Tarth - Skybreaker - Brienne is the knight Jaime secretly wants to be. Solid, loyal, ALWAYS going through on oaths and promises. She is true to her word and true to her vows. 

 

 

Posted

Mtg

 

This is the easy one-_-

Gideon - Windrunner

Chandra - clear as sun/Edgedancer

Liliana - Voidbringer

Ral - Willshaper/Elsecaller

Jace - Elsecaller/Lightweaver

Vraska - very bad Edgedancer

Nicol - Odium

Ajani - Windrunner

Davriel - Sofasnorter

Tamiyo - Lightweaver

Sorin - Dustbringer

Saheeli - Lightweaver

Angrath - Dustbringer

Posted
16 hours ago, Use the Falchion said:

MCU (AVENGERS ONLY) (in Sorting Hat Chats style)

  Hide contents

Captain America - Windrunner primary with both a Bondsmith and a burned Skybreaker secondary.

Iron Man - Willshaper primary with a Windrunner secondary

Thor - Dustbringer probably (although Stoneward is a potential) - we don't know enough about either to make a good point.

Hulk - Dustbringer DEFINITELY

Black Widow - Lightweaver primary with a Skybreaker secondary

Scarlet Witch - Dustbringer primary and a burned Edgedancer secondary?

Vision - Truthwatcher primary and an Edgedancer secondary

Falcon - Windrunner primary (he's a Squire of cap after all!) 

War Machine - Skybreaker primary and Windrunner secondary

Nick Fury - Bondsmith primary with an Elsecaller secondary

Spider-Man - Windrunner primary, I can't think of a secondary at the moment

 

What do you mean by "burned?"  There's always another secret

Supernatural

Spoiler

Dean - Windrunner 

Sam - Truthwatcher (maybe Edgedancer)

Cas - Skybreaker

Crowley - Willshaper (I thought Dustbringer first, but obedient???)

Bobby - Stoneward

John - Bondsmith

Ruby - Elsecaller

Gabriel - Lightweaver

Jo - Edgedancer

Kevin - Dustbringer

Chuck - Honor

Amara - Odium

 

Posted
11 minutes ago, Ripheus23 said:

I gave you an upvote but I will also disagree, Amara = Cultivation!!!

I could see that too.  So Lucifer - Odium then?

Posted (edited)

Zuko's hard to pin down but I actually think I might put him in with the Lightweavers. His whole arc is about figuring out who the real him is, deep down, as opposed to the role(s) he was raised to be. I try to imagine him swearing Windrunner oaths and it lacks impact. But him slowly facing up to personal truths like "My hunt for the avatar is wrong" or "I don't need my father's approval"? The hypothetical crossover fic would write itself...

Edited by Jess
Posted
7 minutes ago, Jess said:

Zuko's hard to pin down but I actually think I might put him in with the Lightweavers. His whole arc is about figuring out who the real him is, deep down, as opposed to the role(s) he was raised to be. I try to imagine him swearing Windrunner oaths and it lacks impact. But him slowly facing up to personal truths like "My hunt for the avatar is wrong" or "I don't need my father's approval"? The hypothetical crossover fic would write itself...

YOU'RE A GENIUS 

It all makes sense now! I approve of your interpretation 

Posted
1 minute ago, Eris said:

YOU'RE A GENIUS 

It all makes sense now! I approve of your interpretation 

Haha thank you. Another thing that just popped into my head: The Blue Spirit as Lightwoven alter-ego.

Posted
Just now, Jess said:

Haha thank you. Another thing that just popped into my head: The Blue Spirit as Lightwoven alter-ego.

you're right. It was under our noses! And how he fakes being a tea person with his uncle. 

Posted
22 hours ago, NoiseSpren said:
  • Gideon - Windrunner
  • Chandra - clear as sun/Edgedancer
  • Liliana - Voidbringer
  • Ral - Willshaper/Elsecaller
  • Jace - Elsecaller/Lightweaver
  • Vraska - very bad Edgedancer
  • Nicol - Odium
  • Ajani - Windrunner
  • Davriel - Sofasnorter
  • Tamiyo - Lightweaver
  • Sorin - Dustbringer
  • Saheeli - Lightweaver
  • Angrath - Dustbringer

Gideon could definitely be a Windrunner; he could also be a Bondsmith, and I think that actually suits him better! At the start of Battle for Zendikar, he'd fallen into the Kaladin problem of trying to protect everyone, and as a result he'd stretched himself too thin. The Windrunner solution to this problem, I'm pretty sure, is to make peace with the fact that you can't save everyone; that seems to be the essence of the Fourth Ideal. Gideon, however, learns to prioritize on a Multiversal scale: tasks himself with uniting and leading people toward large-scale problems. So I kind of read Gideon as someone who tried to be a Windrunner, then became a Bondsmith.

I think there's an easy case for Chandra as Dustbringer, although I'd like to see the Second Ideal before I decide for certain. Her whole arc is about struggling with her own (self-)destructive tendencies. Liliana would also probably fit the order.

Yes to Vraska and Angrath. I'd say Jace is a little too impulsive to be an Elsecaller, although Lightweaver could definitely work, what with all his memory wipes; so could Truthwatcher, I think. I don't know any of the other characters well enough to judge.

I'm trying to think of an order for Nissa...but I'm drawing a blank. Truthwatcher? Edgedancer?

Posted
20 hours ago, Lidolas said:

I could see that too.  So Lucifer - Odium then?

Maybe. Michael and the Empty are candidates, too (though Ruin = the Empty, probably).

Posted
23 hours ago, Lidolas said:

What do you mean by "burned?"  There's always another secret

http://sortinghatchats.tumblr.com/post/121904186113/the-basics

It more or less refers to when a reason behind what they do is lost. Like the example they give for Gryffindors is that they believe that doing what's right matters, but what counts as right and wrong they really can't tell for themselves anymore (their own moral compass is gone, so they rely on an external one). 

Spoiler

So for Cap, I'm thinking of his arc from Winter Soldier through Civil War. In The First Avenger, Cap solidly believed in the government and the organizations he was fighting for. He believed that, while they weren't perfect, they were the best hope people had. Winter Soldier tore down that belief, and Civil War scattered the ashes. Steve doesn't believe in organizations anymore. Rules, as much as he'd like to follow them, as much as they help, won't get the job done. So I say he's burned - he believes in rules, but the rules of each individual person, not a higher government. 

 

Scarlet Witch I more or less put as an Edgedancer because of her background. She fights for forgotten because she herself was forgotten, but there's a lot of cynicism and mistrust. As much as she tries to help, she knows that her powers and her past will paint her as nothing more than a weapon. But she tries anyways. Maybe it's more fair to say that she's a Windrunner Squire of Cap - a knight in sour armor if you will. I'm not too sure about it just yet. 

 

Posted

I thought a little today about the characters from Gravity Falls. Dipper fits perfectly into a scholarly archetype, so I’m guessing he’s an Elsecaller. I should leave open the possibility that he’s a Truthwatcher; it might fit him better once we know more about both orders. Mabel is a Willshaper. Capracious, unreliable, loves adventure? Yeah, that’s Mabel to a T. Wendy is probably a Willshaper, too. Soos is a Skybreaker—a pretty humorous interpretation of a Skybreaker, sure, but he is dedicated to the Pines family. 

(Spoilers this time because it actually contains major spoilers for the show if you haven’t seen it.)

Spoiler

 

Stanley is Lightweaver. I mean, the dude wraps himself in lies. He’s a con man, skilled in the arts of deception and misdirection—so skilled, he was able to hide his true identity for decades as well as keep the kids in the dark all summer. Stanford is a Truthwatcher. I was going to say Elsecaller, but he doesn’t actually strike me as a “Wait and think things trough” kind of guy. I think his being a Truthwatcher still captures his love of knowledge and research.

 

Posted
On 4. 1. 2019 at 3:50 PM, Joy said:

I'm trying to think of an order for Nissa...but I'm drawing a blank. Truthwatcher? Edgedancer?

Truthwatcher, but this is hard one. We know very few about them.

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