Nepene he/him Posted March 24, 2014 Posted March 24, 2014 Presumably, Preservation could cut off the flow if he had to. Maybe- Brandon has said that the shards can't always choose who gains their powers. Sazed might find it tricky to ruin a person, even if he had good cause. He might have to send a kandra in to intervene.
Swimmingly he/him Posted March 24, 2014 Posted March 24, 2014 Of course, the compounding issue applies for all Allomanctic compounding.
PorridgeBrick he/him Posted March 24, 2014 Posted March 24, 2014 It applies to all Allomancy, actually. All that power comes from Preservation, so burn enough and you're taking away considerate portions of his power temporarily. Of course, compounding is more significant a threat because that power can be stored and held, whereas normal Allomancy's power will eventually find its way back to Preservation.
Swimmingly he/him Posted March 24, 2014 Posted March 24, 2014 I wonder, would fully charged compounded nicrosil act like user-specific lerasium, given that it would essentially be filled with pure Investiture?
Moogle Posted March 24, 2014 Posted March 24, 2014 (edited) Not so fast, Moogle. Recall that the metals aren't actually the source of energy for Allomancy, and thus for Compounding, and so you wouldn't have any net gain in Investiture if you compounded Feruchemical nicrosil. It all still has to come from somewhere. Just because the energy comes from elsewhere doesn't mean you can't get a lot of it! I mean, the theory assumes that you'll get more Investiture out than you put in through Soulcasting, but even if it doesn't, it's a great way way to convert Stormlight into a long-term storage. Perhaps you'd just want Feruchemical nicrosil if Compounding didn't do much, but I do think that Compounding should be able to give you greater returns. When you burn pure Investiture (atium/lerasium), it burns fast relative to when you get the Investiture from elsewhere. Compounding should get you a lot of bang for your buck. And, as other people have brought up, you should theoretically be able to steal all of Preservation's Investiture. That would be pretty cool. I wonder if Preservation could cut off Allomancy/Feruchemy if you tried? It's an interesting thought... Edited March 24, 2014 by Moogle
bartbug he/him Posted March 24, 2014 Posted March 24, 2014 Compounding Investiture is a fairly useless skillset, though. While it would be great to be able to store your Investiture, you don't need Allomantic Nicrosil in order to do it. Feruchemical Nicrosil is great, but Allomantic? Not so useful. (See, the key here is that Compounding is different from what many think it is. All that Compounding does is turn a Feruchemical ability into an Allomantic one, and then you store the excess in your metalmind. But you could take any source of Investiture to put in that metalmind, and I'd much rather have a useful metal that I could use in another way then Nicrosil. (For example, a coinshot could presumably store their steelpushes as Investiture)).
ccstat he/him Posted March 24, 2014 Posted March 24, 2014 Are there images of the "Where's My Chull" book? I really want to see it. Also, who is it from? That was a brilliant idea.
WeiryWriter he/him Posted March 24, 2014 Posted March 24, 2014 Are there images of the "Where's My Chull" book? I really want to see it. Also, who is it from? That was a brilliant idea. Here ya go. It was created by a whole ton of people, (I'm not going to try to list them, but they are all in that link) and I am so impressed they were able to make this over the course of a week! 1
The Rooster he/him Posted March 24, 2014 Posted March 24, 2014 Do you think Dalinars super oathtaking and lie detecting powers he exhibits at the end of WoR is the Bondsmith extra power? I referring to when he takes Aladar's word specifically. It seemed like more than just trusting the man.
Argent he/him Posted March 24, 2014 Author Posted March 24, 2014 I doubt it. Lie detection doesn't really fit nicely with any of the surges or divine attributes of the Bondsmiths.
+Aletus he/him Posted March 25, 2014 Posted March 25, 2014 oooh he mentions the big hint in elantris for eviddence of worldhopping. my theory that worldhopping via shadesmar caused the reod is now completely valid in my mind.
WeiryWriter he/him Posted March 25, 2014 Posted March 25, 2014 My own theory is that Shardpools facilitate transitioning to the other Realms (specifically the Cognitive Realm).
Argent he/him Posted March 25, 2014 Author Posted March 25, 2014 Maybe. Though from what we've seen from Shadesmar, it looks like shardpools might be too complex of a solution. I really have to wonder about that massive hint in Elantris though. I was going to ask him about whether it's the traveling Aon - so a magic system with built-in potential for transportation between worlds - but I forgot...
Argent he/him Posted March 25, 2014 Author Posted March 25, 2014 I should add this - another interesting bit from the lost audio dealt with the significance of the number 10 on Roshar. Brandon talked about something he called "Honor's purposes" or maybe "Honor's Purposes," and how they are the reason 10 is such a holy and dominant number - I assumed it meant Honor has (had) 10 of those Purposes. It was heavily implied in the conversation that Odium, if he has similar Purposes, does not have 10 of them.
Moogle Posted March 25, 2014 Posted March 25, 2014 (See, the key here is that Compounding is different from what many think it is. All that Compounding does is turn a Feruchemical ability into an Allomantic one, and then you store the excess in your metalmind. But you could take any source of Investiture to put in that metalmind, and I'd much rather have a useful metal that I could use in another way then Nicrosil. (For example, a coinshot could presumably store their steelpushes as Investiture)). If you're right here, and you can store Coinpushes, then Allomantic nicrosil is indeed not very useful. I get the impression that you can't store Allomantic effects like that in Feruchemical nicrosil, however. My assumption was that you could just get pure Investiture from Compounding Nicrosil and that would be what you store. I'm not very certain though. The Ars Arcanum in AoL does say that you "start and keep an Investiture running" when you burn a metal, so perhaps you're right and Feruchemical nicrosil can store that. I'm just not sure if that counts as an attribute of yours that you can store - but I suppose we have an example with Allomantic pewter helping fill goldminds/pewterminds (can't remember if it's both or just one).
ROSHtaFARian2.0 Posted March 25, 2014 Posted March 25, 2014 I should add this - another interesting bit from the lost audio dealt with the significance of the number 10 on Roshar. Brandon talked about something he called "Honor's purposes" or maybe "Honor's Purposes," and how they are the reason 10 is such a holy and dominant number - I assumed it meant Honor has (had) 10 of those Purposes. It was heavily implied in the conversation that Odium, if he has similar Purposes, does not have 10 of them. It would make sense if those 10 Purposes were basically the 10 mini-Intents that made up Honor, and shaped the way Honor Splintered. Ie Truth, Justice, etc. The various facets of the Shard of Honor, each of which forms the Ideal or focus of a Herald and an Order of the Knights Radiant. Further, that could explain Brandon's statements that while the voidforms of the Parshendi are pretty much Odium's response to the surgebinders and Knights Radiant, there's not a one to one correlation
Argent he/him Posted March 25, 2014 Author Posted March 25, 2014 Yeah, I was thinking about mini-Intents, or aspects (didn't I write aspects somewhere?). I have to wonder though, have we seen any of the other Shards express themselves in such a way? Preservation maybe, kind of.
SpringWarmCold he/him Posted March 25, 2014 Posted March 25, 2014 Signing & Personalization Line (1/2) Quote Q [7:06]: Has Hoid been on Roshar before The Way of Kings? A: Yes. Quote Q [7:15]: Who would win in a fight, Kaladin in Kelsier. A: Kelsier would probably find him in his sleep and kill him there. I would say Kelsier because he would not fight fairly. those two were the questions that i asked. i'm glad that he gave an answer about Kaladin/Kelsier honestly. Kaladin is clearly more powerful than Kelsier, but Kelsier has always had more tricks up his sleeve and a general nastiness about him when he fought so i'm glad that he didn't just say Kaladin because he's more powerful.
ROSHtaFARian2.0 Posted March 25, 2014 Posted March 25, 2014 (edited) Yeah, I was thinking about mini-Intents, or aspects (didn't I write aspects somewhere?). I have to wonder though, have we seen any of the other Shards express themselves in such a way? Preservation maybe, kind of. I don't think so, but none of the other Shards we're aware of have been quite as faceted as the concept of Honor? By that I mean, Honor is such a subjective concept, it means something different to everyone, hence its easy to see how it could have 10 Purposes, or Splinters or Aspects or mini-Intents, whatever you want to call them - to some, being truthful in all things is what it means to be honorable, to others adhering to your oath no matter the circumstances is most honorable (Skybreakers), to others, perhaps Honor means doing what needs to be done for the sake of the many, even at expense to yourself (such as one of the Orders who would find Adolin's actions at the end of WoR honorable). In contrast, preservation, ruin, odium, endowment are all fairly cut and dried - they might manifest or express themselves in different ways, but conceptually, when one person visualizes preserving something, chances are its going to look very similar to how another person visualizes it. Of the seven shards we have names for, the ones I would expect to have multiple Purposes or Aspects might be Devotion or Dominion. Might that have something to do with how diverse the expressions of the various region based magics are? Edited March 25, 2014 by ROSHtaFARian2.0 1
RShara she/her Posted March 25, 2014 Posted March 25, 2014 I wonder if the shards are numbered at all and whether their number is what determines the number tht is common on that world? Like, Honor is 10, Preservation was 16, etc.
PorridgeBrick he/him Posted March 25, 2014 Posted March 25, 2014 I wonder if the shards are numbered at all and whether their number is what determines the number tht is common on that world? Like, Honor is 10, Preservation was 16, etc. But what about Ruin? His magic has 16 metals too. And on Roshar, all three systems have ten orders, even though Honor is likely involved in only 1-2 of the systems.
cosmosofclay Posted March 26, 2014 Posted March 26, 2014 (edited) oooh he mentions the big hint in elantris for eviddence of worldhopping. my theory that worldhopping via shadesmar caused the reod is now completely valid in my mind. I think the hint in Elantris may actually refer to the first time they're going to the pool, and Galladon looks at a painting of someone falling into the pool and specifically says that it looks like someone going through a gate. Now that its looking like the shardpools CAN be used as gates (into Shadesmar?) I'm willing to bet this was the big hint he was talking about. (Also: first post!) Edited March 26, 2014 by cosmosofclay 3
Windrunner he/him Posted March 26, 2014 Posted March 26, 2014 I should add this - another interesting bit from the lost audio dealt with the significance of the number 10 on Roshar. Brandon talked about something he called "Honor's purposes" or maybe "Honor's Purposes," and how they are the reason 10 is such a holy and dominant number - I assumed it meant Honor has (had) 10 of those Purposes. It was heavily implied in the conversation that Odium, if he has similar Purposes, does not have 10 of them. This is very interesting, we'll have to try to get him on record about this later. If Honor's Purposes are something intrinsic to the Shard, perhaps they have survived in Vorinism as the Glories. People choose one of the attributes of the Almighty and try to emulate it. Even if there isn't a direct correlation any longer, perhaps something of that concept has survived to the Era of Solitude. 4
Argent he/him Posted March 26, 2014 Author Posted March 26, 2014 But what about Ruin? His magic has 16 metals too. And on Roshar, all three systems have ten orders, even though Honor is likely involved in only 1-2 of the systems. Except, I am no longer convinced any of this is true. Ruin's magic system, Hemalurgy, might not have anything to do with metal - it looks like a Metallic Art to us, because it's limited to only Scadrial, where metal is the focus of all magic. But what if Ruin had went to Nalthis instead of Scadrial? Awakening is a very metal unfriendly magic system - would the Hemalurgic spikes there depend not on the type of material / metal they are made of, but on their color? I very much think so. Because, remember, Hemalurgy can affect all magic systems, not just Allomancy - so it seems strange to bind it to the same focus as Allomancy. It's restrictive. Roshar... maybe. We have Brandon on record telling us that one way to count the magic systems on Roshar is three sets of ten. Sounds pretty solid, but he is also pretty sneaky.
Lance Alvein he/him Posted March 26, 2014 Posted March 26, 2014 I think the hint in Elantris may actually refer to the first time they're going to the pool, and Galladon looks at a painting of someone falling into the pool and specifically says that it looks like someone going through a gate. Now that its looking like the shardpools CAN be used as gates (into Shadesmar?) I'm willing to bet this was the big hint he was talking about. (Also: first post!) Considering that Hoid came through what is potentially a shardpool into Roshar (from what Rock said, at least) It's probably a good bet that the pools are a gate between worlds.
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