Why are all Recreance-era Shardweapons blades?

[Vissy]

So yeah. We've seen a bunch of Radiants use different weapons, from Shardforks to Shardblades to Shardspears. So why are all of the Shardweapons from the Recreance in blade form? It stands to reason they also would have had their weapons of choice. What is the reason that all of their Shards turned into blades, then? Is sword-form some kind of a basic spren form? Is it cultural (and why would there be such an overpowering cultural influence on swords opposed to other weapons, with no room for deviation?) Did the spren revert to sword-form when the bond was broken?

[Droughtbringer]

Well, Take a look at this WoB: https://wob.coppermind.net/events/216-jordancon-2014/#e6446

Quote

Questioner

What was the reason for choosing the base form of Shardblades as blades, why not another form? Was it because of the spren?

Brandon Sanderson

Why was the base form of Shardblades chosen to as blades, as swords? It’s because the Shardblades were devised--I can’t spoil the second book--They were devised as imitations of the Honorblades, which were created and given to the heralds. And so since the original pattern was the Honorblades, they were built to feel like the Honorblades.

The form of the Sprenblades were designed after the Honorblades, so they naturally revert to the sword form when the bond is broken. So even though a Radiant may use it in a different form, the base form is the blade.

[Vissy]

Huh, thanks. So the spren themselves, every spren in Shadesmar, was built with the Honorblades as the blueprint?

[+Lewis Nethur He/Him]

41 minutes ago, Vissy said:

Huh, thanks. So the spren themselves, every spren in Shadesmar, was built with the Honorblades as the blueprint?

More like, the spren modeled the Nahel Bond after the Heralds' bonds to Honor and the Honorblades. Even that's not 100% accurate, but I think it's a slightly better metaphor.

[Vissy]

It is a better metaphor, yeah. But I guess this is just an area where ultimately you just gotta shrug and say "well, it looks awesome, so who cares why?" 

Edited January 26, 2018 by Vissy

[Weltall]

His use of 'devised' and such in that WoB is intended to talk around the big reveal in Words of Radiance. The spren weren't 'built' to become shardblades but the fact that they were consciously imitating Honor's Investiture in the form of the Honorblades meant that when they did form Nahel Bonds, their default form in the Physical Realm was 'giant sword'.

And only some types of spren can form Nahel Bonds, and not all who can will. Spren also predate the appearance of surgebinding (some even predate the arrival of the Shards) so even those who can form bonds weren't 'built' to do so. FYI

[recneps he/him]

Additionally, a sword is basically the most efficient shape for a weapon which can cut with no resistance. Kaladin's spear is nice, except everything which can be done with it can be done with a sword.. In addition to fatal sweeps, not just stabs.

[amflare]

Spear fighting and sword fighting are two entirely different forms will little to no overlap. Sure, a sword can mechanically perform the same actions as a spear head, or any other blade for that matter. But a spear is 85% handle, you hold it and move it and swing it differently. You can't use the handle of a sword in battle, but that is an important part for spearmen. 

[CrazyRioter she/her]

true which is one reason why Kaladin doesn't use Syl as a sword, he's not really trained in swords and doesn't feel comfortable with them. Also he wants to give a big middle figure to the convention that lighteyes use swords.

But Shardblades are really more efficient as swords because the long cutting edge is especially helpful.

[SallyA she/her]

[OB] . . . 

Spoiler

I thought the mentions of Syl turning into a giant shield when Kaladin was recovering from a particularly effective battle tactic was nice!  it realy set a precident for the versatility of the Shards, and possibly for spren having  "sharp sentience"!  Kudos for that particular tract in the manuscript!  It goes a long way toward investing spren with value beyond their peek-a-boo crossover fragments from Shadesmar.

 

Edited February 3, 2018 by Pagerunner
Hiding spoilers.

[Skybreaker156]

On 26/01/2018 at 11:11 AM, Weltall said:

His use of 'devised' and such in that WoB is intended to talk around the big reveal in Words of Radiance. The spren weren't 'built' to become shardblades but the fact that they were consciously imitating Honor's Investiture in the form of the Honorblades meant that when they did form Nahel Bonds, their default form in the Physical Realm was 'giant sword'.

And only some types of spren can form Nahel Bonds, and not all who can will. Spren also predate the appearance of surgebinding (some even predate the arrival of the Shards) so even those who can form bonds weren't 'built' to do so. FYI

But if I am correct some common windspren could be used to 'build shardplate' and does anyone know which ideal needs to be spoken to gain plate?

 

[Landis963 he/him]

5 minutes ago, Skybreaker156 said:

But if I am correct some common windspren could be used to 'build shardplate' and does anyone know which ideal needs to be spoken to gain plate?

 

Generally, it's the 4th.  Known exceptions include the Skybreakers (need to complete a quest first) and the Lightweavers (Truths rather than Ideals make things squirrelly).  

[Weltall]

45 minutes ago, Skybreaker156 said:

But if I am correct some common windspren could be used to 'build shardplate' and does anyone know which ideal needs to be spoken to gain plate?

We suspect that 'common' spren associated with a particular Order may be involved in the creation of shardplate, due to what we see happen around Kaladin at times that he's being especially Windrunner-y but that doesn't mean it's a confirmed fact. And as mentioned, Fourth Ideal seems to be the typical threshold but we also know that not all Orders do things in the same way so that's not a hard and fast rule.

37 minutes ago, Landis963 said:

Generally, it's the 4th.  Known exceptions include the Skybreakers (need to complete a quest first) and the Lightweavers (Truths rather than Ideals make things squirrelly).  

Their Fourth Ideal is a two-step process but I don't think it's really an exception to the general swearing process. You declare the quest you intend to dedicate yourself to and the spren approves it, but the Ideal doesn't 'count' until you've actually done whatever it is you swore to do. In this it's not too different from what we see in Oathbringer, where it's clear that just knowing the words you're supposed to say isn't enough to swear an Ideal, there's another step involved. In the case of the Skybreakers this step just happens to be an external rather than internal one.

[Skybreaker156]

Ok. Now IF 'common' spren do form the shardplate how are they stored if you will? I don't believe that they're summoned the sane as the sword because the radiants can touch these without hearing screaming. I think that the spren are 'trapped' in gemstones that power the plate

 

[recneps he/him]

I'd say that they're "stored" in the same way. The Radiants can touch them without hearing screaming because they're lesser spren. They're not sentient.

[Calderis he/him]

23 minutes ago, recneps said:

I'd say that they're "stored" in the same way. The Radiants can touch them without hearing screaming because they're lesser spren. They're not sentient.

I disagree for multiple reasons, primarily based in Identity. 

But lesser spren are sentient. They aren't sapient like Nahel Spren. 

[recneps he/him]

I don't really believe they count as sentient. Do we have evidence of them responding to stimuli other than just their attraction to certain things? They behave much more like a fundamental force of nature - although bound by being cognitive entities - than they act like animals. The wind commonly has the cultural connotation of being fickle and fey.. So windspren mess with people. Spren reflect people's opinions, so when you measure one it stops changing in whatever aspect was measured. A definite size is known, and so that size is correct.

[Yata he/him]

3 hours ago, recneps said:

I'd say that they're "stored" in the same way. The Radiants can touch them without hearing screaming because they're lesser spren. They're not sentient.

The Radiants hear the screem for the Blades because they are in pain.
A Plate could be simply made of fully fine lesser Spren waiting for orders....No pain, no scream