StormblessDave Posted January 26, 2018 Report Share Posted January 26, 2018 So, on re-reading Oathbringer, I realised that only Kaladin, a dark eyes had his eye colour change to light blue when he becomes radiant.However, there is no mention of Dalinar or Shallan's(both already light eyes)changing colour. So is there a clear reason why the light eye colour is important? Is it due to the pre-conceived notion that shardbearers are lighteyed?So when Kaladin summons Syl-blade, his self-perception changes and his eyes become light blue? Or is it due to some other reason?Im pretty sure having a shardblade doesn't change your eye colour from dark eyed to light eyed all the time, a good example is Taln'el who was dark eyed despite holding a shardblade. Are there any other theories as to why the eye colour changes once you summon a shardblade? Personally I feel self perception is more likely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calderis Posted January 26, 2018 Report Share Posted January 26, 2018 Dark eyes are a product of whatever is going on in Roshar, and it's a spiritual trait. Lighteyes don't have their eyes changed, because that part of their spiritweb has already been rewritten through inheritance. Quote Questioner My question has to do with the color of Shallan's eyes currently, because we've noticed over the books that Kaladin's eyes, as he's continued to use his Surge, changed to lighter and lighter blue. Whereas one could argue that Shallan is farther in her Ideals than Kaladin is, yet her eyes have not changed at all. Brandon Sanderson Right, 'cause they were already light. Questioner 'Cause they were already light? So it only affects lightness or darkness in the eyes, not necessarily any other color? Brandon Sanderson It's not like it is-- It's not like it's saying "Light minus 50%". Questioner It's not like Honor is blue and-- Brandon Sanderson No. It is not. It is just kind of the way that the changes the Stormlight is making the body and certain people are already descended from people who had repeated, over time, changes by the body which stopped physically... That's not to say that all lighteyes that's where they came from. There are some that are natural mutations. source 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormblessDave Posted January 26, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2018 @Calderis Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isilel Posted January 26, 2018 Report Share Posted January 26, 2018 Hm... interesting WoB. So, does this mean that it takes several generations of Radiants in a family to turn the descendants eyes permanently light? One of the epigraphs in WoR does say that a lot of Radiants used to settle in Alethela even while Uritiru was still fully functional. And how does it work with the bearers of the dead shardblades? In WoB Kaladin noticed that Moash's eyes were lightening and turning "tan", but it seems that the change didn't stick after he gave up his shardblade? At least, nobody mentioned it, including his old caravaneer acquaintance. Also - an interesting detail that I have noticed re-reading the 3 books, but there are tons of green-eyed lighteyes in the text. In fact, they seem to be even more common than the blue-eyed ones, which suggests that the Truthwatchers were a pretty large order. Of course, it turns out that garnets can be pretty much any color between yellow and violet, so some of them might be descended from the Lightweavers as well. But still, I subconciously expected the Truthwatchers to be one of the smaller Orders, which doesn't seem to have been the case. By contrast, there are really few grey-eyed lighteyes, which seems to hint that Edgedancers and Skybreakers weren't very numerous... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amflare Posted January 26, 2018 Report Share Posted January 26, 2018 (edited) Are we sure the specific eye color is an effect of the order of radiant? I can't find any information saying that certain colors or gemstones are significant to each order. Edited January 26, 2018 by amflare Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyRioter Posted January 26, 2018 Report Share Posted January 26, 2018 (edited) Well Kaladin got blue, which is strongly suggestive. Also the Windrunner from Dalinar's vision with the Midnight Essence also had very pale blue eyes. Edited January 26, 2018 by CrazyRioter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calderis Posted January 26, 2018 Report Share Posted January 26, 2018 (edited) 6 minutes ago, amflare said: Are we sure the specific eye color is an effect of the order of radiant? I can't find any information saying that certain colors or gemstones are significant to each order. Yes. Lift's eyes turn pearlescent white, and Diamond is the polestone associated with Edgedancers. Sapphire for Windrunners and Kaladin's blue. Smokestone for Skybreakers and Szeth's grey. Dustbringers are Ruby which is why we know the Radiant in the Purelake vision who's armor glowed red is one. (Garnet also fits, but she used abrasion to move more easily through the water.) The Ars Arcanum shows a polestone and essence associated with each order. And @Isilel it's not just Radiants, it's also dead Shardblades. Quote Darkness (paraphrased) When a darkeyed person obtains a Shardblade. Does their new eye color reflect the specific type of blade they bonded? Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) Yes. source Quote Questioner Is the power of the bond between humans and spren, the Nahel bond, or from the swords—the existing Shardblades—that causes the eyes to turn light? Brandon Sanderson Yes. source Edited January 26, 2018 by Calderis 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormblessDave Posted January 26, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2018 Hmm, so do the honourblades have the same effect? If they do, why does Taln have brown eyes? If not, what's the distinction between shardblades and honourblades apart from the shardblade being spren(is that the reason?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyRioter Posted January 26, 2018 Report Share Posted January 26, 2018 Honorblades turn the wielder's eyes light while they are actively using the blade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weltall Posted January 26, 2018 Report Share Posted January 26, 2018 (edited) There does seem to be a distinction between the Heralds and Radiants in this respect. In the Aharietiam vision, Dalinar is shocked when he sees that Jezrien's eyes are dark. That said, the one example we have shows that Jezrien's Honorblade does cause the same glowing effect and in the same color as a Radiant of the Order that imitated his powers so the Herald's eyes are likely to have glowed as well when using them. The effect just isn't permanent like it is for a Radiant. This probably has to do with Radiants having a deeper bond and more changes to their Spiritweb than what the Honorblades do on their own. Edited January 26, 2018 by Weltall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isilel Posted January 26, 2018 Report Share Posted January 26, 2018 4 hours ago, Calderis said: Yes. Lift's eyes turn pearlescent white, and Diamond is the polestone associated with Edgedancers. But there aren't any normal lighteyes with this (creepy) color, so I can only assume that Edgedancer descent/shardblade produces very pale grey eyes like Mr T's. 4 hours ago, Calderis said: Dustbringers are Ruby which is why we know the Radiant in the Purelake vision who's armor glowed red is one. And, presumably, results in orange-colored lighteyes, which seem to be pretty rare. IIRC, only Brightness Kalami has them and Vivenna mimics them, in all 3 books. 4 hours ago, Calderis said: And @Isilel it's not just Radiants, it's also dead Shardblades. I know this, I just wonder when the permanent change happens. Moash's eyes turned light tan within a couple weeks, IIRC, but as soon as he unbonded the blade, his previous eye-color was restored. So, would the change have become permanent with time or would it only have affected any children conceived while he was bonded to the shardblade? 3 hours ago, StormblessDave said: Hmm, so do the honourblades have the same effect? If they do, why does Taln have brown eyes? Right, I think that the Heralds aren't subject to normal rules. Taln appeared at Kholinar with his Honorblade summoned, but his eyes remained dark. And nobody ever notices Nale's eye-color changing no matter which of his 2 blades he summons or when he surge-binds, so presumably it doesn't. Yet, summoning Jezrien's Honorblade turned Szeth's naturally dark-green eyes saphire blue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calderis Posted January 27, 2018 Report Share Posted January 27, 2018 2 hours ago, Isilel said: oash's eyes turned light tan within a couple weeks, IIRC, but as soon as he unbonded the blade, his previous eye-color was restored. So, would the change have become permanent with time or would it only have affected any children conceived while he was bonded to the shardblade? I personally think it would be only children conceived while holding the bond. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willow Posted January 27, 2018 Report Share Posted January 27, 2018 4 hours ago, Isilel said: Right, I think that the Heralds aren't subject to normal rules. Taln appeared at Kholinar with his Honorblade summoned, but his eyes remained dark. And nobody ever notices Nale's eye-color changing no matter which of his 2 blades he summons or when he surge-binds, so presumably it doesn't. Yet, summoning Jezrien's Honorblade turned Szeth's naturally dark-green eyes saphire blue. But if Nale is a 5th ideal Knight Radiant, wouldn't his eyes be permanently light grey? At least I believe one common theory now is that the more oaths a Surgebinder says, the longer his eyes stay light. Kaladin is at three ideals, and his eyes stay light for several hours after he last summoned his shardblade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormblessDave Posted January 27, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 27, 2018 Plot twist Honour was darkeyed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyRioter Posted January 27, 2018 Report Share Posted January 27, 2018 If we go by real-world demographics it's statistically likely that Tanavast had dark eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vortaan Posted January 27, 2018 Report Share Posted January 27, 2018 15 hours ago, Willow said: But if Nale is a 5th ideal Knight Radiant, wouldn't his eyes be permanently light grey? At least I believe one common theory now is that the more oaths a Surgebinder says, the longer his eyes stay light. Kaladin is at three ideals, and his eyes stay light for several hours after he last summoned his shardblade. Well for one, the WoB quoted seems to indicate that the length of time with eye color changes is dependent on repeated Stormlight usage, not anything really related to the ideals. I think we assume that most Radiants make it to five, but that may not be the case. Secondly, I'm not sure Nale or the other Heralds can actually change like that. They aren't just humans anymore, they are Cognitive Shadows with a Physical aspect. They are closer to Returned than they are to normal people, and I imagine the rules are very different for them than for other people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMediocreMind Posted January 27, 2018 Report Share Posted January 27, 2018 21 hours ago, Isilel said: Right, I think that the Heralds aren't subject to normal rules. Taln appeared at Kholinar with his Honorblade summoned, but his eyes remained dark. And nobody ever notices Nale's eye-color changing no matter which of his 2 blades he summons or when he surge-binds, so presumably it doesn't. Yet, summoning Jezrien's Honorblade turned Szeth's naturally dark-green eyes saphire blue. I just want to point out that we have WoB telling us that Taln wasn't carrying his honorblade when he appeared at Kholinar. For some reason or another he was carrying a typical deadblade and we don't know what actually happened to his honorblade. No contention here simply clarifying facts. I can't find the WoB to quote, unfortunately. I'm not terribly good at searching the site Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jace21 Posted January 27, 2018 Report Share Posted January 27, 2018 34 minutes ago, TheMediocreMind said: I just want to point out that we have WoB telling us that Taln wasn't carrying his honorblade when he appeared at Kholinar. For some reason or another he was carrying a typical deadblade and we don't know what actually happened to his honorblade. No contention here simply clarifying facts. I can't find the WoB to quote, unfortunately. I'm not terribly good at searching the site Can't anyone find this WoB? I don't remember ever seeing it. I had always been under the impression that the blade Taln had in Kholinar WAS his honorblade but was then switched before it reached the shattered planes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RShara Posted January 27, 2018 Report Share Posted January 27, 2018 1 hour ago, TheMediocreMind said: I just want to point out that we have WoB telling us that Taln wasn't carrying his honorblade when he appeared at Kholinar. For some reason or another he was carrying a typical deadblade and we don't know what actually happened to his honorblade. No contention here simply clarifying facts. I can't find the WoB to quote, unfortunately. I'm not terribly good at searching the site Yeah, I don't think that's what those WoBs say. Taln was carrying his Blade, and it was switched. Because the description of his Blade in Kholinar, and what arrived at the Shattered Plains is completely different. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMediocreMind Posted January 27, 2018 Report Share Posted January 27, 2018 Just now, RShara said: Yeah, I don't think that's what those WoBs say. Taln was carrying his Blade, and it was switched. Because the description of his Blade in Kholinar, and what arrived at the Shattered Plains is completely different. Ohh. My mistake then. It has been a while since I saw that WoB myself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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