[OB] Is Cultivation's perpendicularity attached to Lift?

[Anujun he/him]

Wyndle mentions that he thinks Lift exists partially in the Cognative realm.

I saw a theory that suggested that the visions the Stormfather creates exist in the Spiritual realm; Sanderson's answer to that was "RAFO" (read and find out).

Lift is able to draw stormlight from consuming food, and we know stormlight comes from the spiritual realm. If lift also exists partially in the Spiritual realm, then it could explain why she can enter the visions created by the Stormfather and Odium.

So if she exists partially in the Physical, Cognative, and Spiritual realms...

And the Stormfather mentioned that Lift smelled of Cultivation...

And it was mentioned in Oathbringer that there is a perpenticularity that moves around (which I think is Cultivation's)...

Could Cultivation's perpendicularity be attached to Lift somehow?

[Sandra she/her]

You mentioned some valid points, but I think it is pretty much confirmed that Cultivation's perpendicularity is in the Horneater Peaks. The perpendicularity that moves around is the highstorm (Honor) and the Everstorm (Odium).

[Anujun he/him]

43 minutes ago, Sandra said:

You mentioned some valid points, but I think it is pretty much confirmed that Cultivation's perpendicularity is in the Horneater Peaks. The perpendicularity that moves around is the highstorm (Honor) and the Everstorm (Odium).

That would make a lot of sense except that if the storms were the perpendicularities, wouldn't they be rather common and predictable to track? Whilst in Shadesmar, didn't the gang learn that the moving perpendicularity was very difficult and unpredictable to find?

I didn't remember which shard's perpendicularity was in the Horneater Peaks, or if it was mentioned, but if you're right then that invalidates my theory anyway. Do you recall the details of that confirmation? How do we know the Horneater Peaks perpendicularity is Cultivation's?

[Leyrann]

We have confirmation in Oathbringer (I believe from Syl?) that the perpendicularity Dalinar summons is Honor's perpendicularity. As the perpendicularity in the Horneater peaks does not move, it cannot be Honor's, so it's Cultivation's. (Odiums perpendicularity, for the record, is either on Braize, or it's the Everstorm, as we know he was on Braize in the past, so he wouldn't have had a perpendicularity on Roshar at that point, while we know the perpendicularity in the Horneater Peaks has been there for longer)

[Brgst13]

We have a WoB that Honors perpendicularity moves.  Odium does not have a shard pool  on Roshar itself.  Therefore it is Cultivation's by default.

[Anujun he/him]

Ah darn, and I thought it was such a juicy theory too Thanks for the correction, you three.

Still, it does seem like Lift is connected to all three planes, and I do hope there is a really cool reason for it. It's Lift, afterall, so it's gotta be awesome

[Nathrangking he/him]

I would add that Azure says in oathbringer that the perpendicularity of cultivation is in the horneater peaks. @Anujun I would need some strong evidence before believing that lift is present at all in the spiritual realm. If she is that would mean that she is on the level of a shard basically because of how abstract the constructs of the spiritul realm are. No living person that we know of exists in the spiritual realm. As for the conversion of food to stromlight:

Spoiler

Questioner

So the character Lift, for her powers, why does she have to eat food instead of sucking in--

Brandon Sanderson

So why does Lift have to eat food instead of sucking in Stormlight. So Lift is a really weird one, she visited the Old Magic and asked something very strange. And the Old Magic didn't know how to treat that and answered with something equally strange. So you will eventually see what happened with Lift and things like that but suffice it to say some really weird things are going on with Lift.

The visions are not constructs of the Stormfather. They were created by Honor and given to the Stormfsather to deliver to potential bondsmiths. It is possible that the visions occur in the spiritual realm. However, a RAFO does not necessarily mean that this is the correct answer. It is possible that Brandon simply did not want to let the cat out of the bag before the books reveal the truth.

Edited December 28, 2017 by Nathrangking

[Yata he/him]

Just to clarify. Yes the Cultivation's Perpendicularity is in the peaks and Yes Honor's Perpendicularity moves...but It's not the Highstorm.

It's possible the Honor's Perpendicularity spawn sometime inside the Highstorms thanks to the Sheer amount of Investiture but It's not a stable or sure event. In the book we see the Highstorms pass many time from a Shadesmar's PoV and no Perpendicularity come to be' there.

Similarity the Everstorm is not Odium's Perpendicularity and by the way Odium's Perpendicularity is more likely One Braize where Odium's Power mainly is

[digitalbusker he/him]

The Highstorm is big, like really big. Big like whoa. If Honor's Perpendicularity is in there somewhere, but not necessarily at a predictable place, it would be pretty hard to find.

[Anujun he/him]

Imagine making your way across the aether and navigating the Rosharan shadesmar to chase Honor's perpendicularity only to come out at the top of a highstorm and fall to your death

Since Honor is dead, maybe Cultivation/Nightwatcher attached Honor's perpendicularity to Lift? Next time I do a read-through, I'm going to pay attention to see if Lift mentions any people appearing out of nowhere.

[RShara she/her]

16 minutes ago, Anujun said:

Imagine making your way across the aether and navigating the Rosharan shadesmar to chase Honor's perpendicularity only to come out at the top of a highstorm and fall to your death

Since Honor is dead, maybe Cultivation/Nightwatcher attached Honor's perpendicularity to Lift? Next time I do a read-through, I'm going to pay attention to see if Lift mentions any people appearing out of nowhere.

Sorry but there is absolutely a Perpendicularity in the Horneater Peaks.  It's stationary, so it can't be Honor's.  Cultivation's perpendicularity doesn't move around, only Honor's does.  Azure calls the Perpendicularity, "Cultivation's Perpendicularity." Ico calls it that.  Pattern calls it that. Notum calls it that.

Also, Kaladin and Adolin and the others were in Thaylenah at the same time Lift was.  They didn't see any perpendicularity or any particular extra power or surprises (other than the number of voidspren) while they were in Shadesmar.

The only time we've had a person appear out of no where was Rock's story in WoK about their trickster god...appearing out of a pool...in the Horneater Peaks.

[Anujun he/him]

42 minutes ago, RShara said:

Sorry but there is absolutely a Perpendicularity in the Horneater Peaks.  It's stationary, so it can't be Honor's.  Cultivation's perpendicularity doesn't move around, only Honor's does.

I didn't say otherwise In fact, in my words you just quoted, I said that maybe it's Honor's perpedicularity that's attached to Lift. It's just a theory to explain why Lift seems to exist partially in all three realms.

That's a good point about Lift being in Thaylenah at the same time as the others, though! That's probably the best evidence that this theory is not true. Thanks!

edit: Unless you can't actually see a perpendicularity? Hmmm. I think it's still possible that this might be the case. Mayhaps improbable, though.

Edited December 28, 2017 by Anujun

[StrikerEZ he/him]

I don't think Lift has a Perpendicularity attached to her. I think she's partially in the CR due to her boon/curse from the Nightwatcher. Or Cultivation, because her curse definitely feels a lot like Dalinar's and seems far too complex for the Nightwatcher. 

[RShara she/her]

12 minutes ago, Anujun said:

I didn't say otherwise In fact, in my words you just quoted, I said that maybe it's Honor's perpedicularity that's attached to Lift. It's just a theory to explain why Lift seems to exist partially in all three realms.

That's a good point about Lift being in Thaylenah at the same time as the others, though! That's probably the best evidence that this theory is not true. Thanks!

edit: Unless you can't actually see a perpendicularity? Hmmm. I think it's still possible that this might be the case. Mayhaps improbable, though.

They definitely saw Honor's Perpendicularity forming around them.  And yes, I know I quoted your words.  I was responding to them, that's why I was quoting

As Striker said, the Nightwatcher changed Lift.  She exists partially in the Cognitive Realm, more so than normal people.  That's why she can touch Wyndle.