Mutantspicy Posted December 21, 2017 Report Share Posted December 21, 2017 Why do we think Szeth hid the sphere in Jah-Kaved? I do not recall this. I'm curious, because I wonder if Taravangian somehow got a hold of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.S.A.M.K.M Posted December 21, 2017 Report Share Posted December 21, 2017 It seemed the Parshendi were terrified, so I could see them simply abandoning the stone or sending it back to the king with their answer. Both the sons of honor and the listerners believe the king had it, while only truthless knows he has it. if the unmade can be trapped into a gemstone, could they then be used in a kind of fabrial? I have this theory that the nine unmade in a single fabrial could be used as a weapon against the enemy. We know at least one of the unmade can affect both humans and the listerners, so why not all of them. Look at what happened when the high Prince unmade was captured, they were crippled. In my solution, such a weapon would be aimed at the fused only. It either breaks what little sanity and control they have left, or force them to move on. Since they are somehow linked or tied to the ever storm, that would be the best avenue of attack. By either placing the device at the void version of origin, or binding the ever storm to it. the three mindless unmade would mess with their sanity. The black fisher sounds like it is linked to sadness, grief, pain or depression, so another way to mess with their sanity. The high Prince unmade would fuel and link the fused together, allowing the unmade to be affected by the rest of the nine. The rest are tricky. The one that forces its host to grow crystals, it could force all the fused into becoming thunderclasts, the listerners naturally grow shells anyway and gem hearts, so this would be possible. The corrupting unmade could mess with the fused somehow. The midnight mother produces essence, which could spread to the fused. The last is unknown, the dust mother is just too unknown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storms! he/him Posted December 21, 2017 Report Share Posted December 21, 2017 Pretty sure Venli says that Ulim had been talking to her for a long time, and helped her figure out stormform. She was also with the Parshendi who bought Szeth and that Parshendi mentions a voice guiding him to Szeth and revealing his true nature. This was happening simultaneously to Eshonai talking to Gavilar and seeing the two gems. I hate to be the guy that bursts someone's bubble, but Ulim is almost certainly NOT one of the two gems 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Govir Posted December 21, 2017 Report Share Posted December 21, 2017 54 minutes ago, Storms! said: Pretty sure Venli says that Ulim had been talking to her for a long time, and helped her figure out stormform. She was also with the Parshendi who bought Szeth and that Parshendi mentions a voice guiding him to Szeth and revealing his true nature. This was happening simultaneously to Eshonai talking to Gavilar and seeing the two gems. I hate to be the guy that bursts someone's bubble, but Ulim is almost certainly NOT one of the two gems While I agree with you, remember that when Venli says "a long time", that is 6 years after the assassination. The other thing to consider is who actually guided them to Szeth? Why would Ulim (who wants the "gods" to return) guide them to Szeth (who ultimately delayed the return)? The only reason I could think of is if Ulim and company thought that Szeth could be used to hasten the return, but the plan didn't work as they thought it would. But we haven't seen any hints of that. On another note, I have a question about the gems in general. The one we see at the end of OB that traps the thrill is fairly large (the size of a basketball I think? Maybe a bit smaller like a softball?). Does the size of the gem matter when trapping a spren? If so, the size I picture for the Black Sphere (a marble at most) is much too small to hold an Unmade. The counter to this is that an Unmade / Spren can be captured in any size gem (i.e. it's not so much a capturing, as an anchoring), and the size of the gem only determines how much Stormlight it can hold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stonedshaman Posted December 21, 2017 Report Share Posted December 21, 2017 This is kind of a tangent but this seems to be the best place to put this. Does anyone else get the feeling that Dalinar and Navani will use the thrill to power urithiriu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutantspicy Posted December 21, 2017 Report Share Posted December 21, 2017 23 minutes ago, Govir said: While I agree with you, remember that when Venli says "a long time", that is 6 years after the assassination. The other thing to consider is who actually guided them to Szeth? Why would Ulim (who wants the "gods" to return) guide them to Szeth (who ultimately delayed the return)? The only reason I could think of is if Ulim and company thought that Szeth could be used to hasten the return, but the plan didn't work as they thought it would. But we haven't seen any hints of that. On another note, I have a question about the gems in general. The one we see at the end of OB that traps the thrill is fairly large (the size of a basketball I think? Maybe a bit smaller like a softball?). Does the size of the gem matter when trapping a spren? If so, the size I picture for the Black Sphere (a marble at most) is much too small to hold an Unmade. The counter to this is that an Unmade / Spren can be captured in any size gem (i.e. it's not so much a capturing, as an anchoring), and the size of the gem only determines how much Stormlight it can hold. I don't know that size matters. From Navani's notebook its seems the cut style is more important for the type of spren it can trap. Also, I think the cut must be perfect for trapping unmade, the type of gem cut that will not leak stormlight. As was the case for the Gem Dalinar used to capture the thrill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutantspicy Posted December 21, 2017 Report Share Posted December 21, 2017 3 minutes ago, stonedshaman said: This is kind of a tangent but this seems to be the best place to put this. Does anyone else get the feeling that Dalinar and Navani will use the thrill to power urithiriu I've wondering if urithiru is a fabrial, that can be powered by 10 unmade. Like an emotion fabrial, which would be perfect for fighting Odium / passion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.S.A.M.K.M Posted December 21, 2017 Report Share Posted December 21, 2017 Somehow Ulim escaped damnation or he came to this world after the last herald broke. If Venli was in contact for long time, it seems it predates the herald return. If the Everstorm could be summoned, so could be other spren, void or not. If the listerners need spren for differing forms, it makes sense they can summon specific spren at need, via their songs. we know at least one unmade was trapped in a gemstone, so there could be lesser void spren similarly contained. When the sons of honor were searching for lore and relic, they could have uncovered or released Ulim. i have a theory that the unmade could be channeled into an epic fabrial. My idea is that such device would be aimed at the fused. But the unmade are just so unknown, the effect is just guessed at. I am hoping that what control and sanity the fused have will be removed, making them all thunderclasts. It might either help them move on from this realm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wit Beyond Measure she/her Posted December 22, 2017 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 8 hours ago, Storms! said: Pretty sure Venli says that Ulim had been talking to her for a long time, and helped her figure out stormform. She was also with the Parshendi who bought Szeth and that Parshendi mentions a voice guiding him to Szeth and revealing his true nature. This was happening simultaneously to Eshonai talking to Gavilar and seeing the two gems. Though I agree with Govir that six years is a great approximation for the amount of time Ulim has been with Venli, I do agree that the voice speaking to Klade, supposedly, rather than Venli is heavily implied to be Ulim. Whether that is Ulim or not is not definitive but strong evidence against my theory, yes. Quote Klade’s slave was an assassin. Klade claimed that a voice—speaking to the rhythms—had led him to the man, who had confessed his skills when pressed. Venli had apparently been with Klade, though Eshonai hadn’t seen her sister since earlier in the day. Sanderson, Brandon. Oathbringer: Book Three of the Stormlight Archive (p. 25). Tom Doherty Associates. Kindle Edition. As for Urithiru: 7 hours ago, Mutantspicy said: I've wondering if urithiru is a fabrial, that can be powered by 10 unmade. Like an emotion fabrial, which would be perfect for fighting Odium / passion. 7 hours ago, stonedshaman said: This is kind of a tangent but this seems to be the best place to put this. Does anyone else get the feeling that Dalinar and Navani will use the thrill to power urithiriu Urithiru is quite unlikely to be powered by an Unmade of Odium. Shallan just worked hard to rid Urithiru of their negative influence. I strongly suspect that Urithiru will be powered by the Sibling, sibling spren to the Stormfather and the Nightwatcher, who is likely of Honor or Cultivation or both. I've talked about that theory extensively here: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
echaozh he/him Posted December 22, 2017 Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 9 hours ago, Govir said: While I agree with you, remember that when Venli says "a long time", that is 6 years after the assassination. The other thing to consider is who actually guided them to Szeth? Why would Ulim (who wants the "gods" to return) guide them to Szeth (who ultimately delayed the return)? The only reason I could think of is if Ulim and company thought that Szeth could be used to hasten the return, but the plan didn't work as they thought it would. But we haven't seen any hints of that. The Parshendi were lead to Szeth because it would give them a war against the humans. What did the Fused want? To war against the humans and destroy them all. Also a war will make the Parshendi search for more power to survive, which will force them to bring back the old gods. It makes perfect sense. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.S.A.M.K.M Posted December 22, 2017 Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 A war would push the Parshendi into searching for forms of power, and it would make those like the sons of honor to search out new sources of powerful for themsemselves. i wonder if Ulim was unknowingly drawn to the presence of a trapped unmade, not necessarily straight to it, but in the same region. Sort of how the unmade can affect region, the thrill and death rattles being an example of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The One Who Connects he/him Posted December 22, 2017 Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 On 12/20/2017 at 3:20 PM, Wit Beyond Measure said: Many are saying that Szeth's stone was left in Jah Keved, and I seem to remember something about a stone there, but I couldn't later find the reference. Why are we thinking Jah Keved, other than Szeth's appearance there? Is the stone mentioned there? On 12/20/2017 at 6:53 PM, Mutantspicy said: Why do we think Szeth hid the sphere in Jah-Kaved? I do not recall this. I'm curious, because I wonder if Taravangian somehow got a hold of it. Because Szeth said he hid it there. Quote The miners eventually tired of Took's increasingly slurred stories. They bid him farewell, ignoring his braod hints that another cup of beer would prompt him to tell his greatest tale: that of the time when he'd seen the Nightwatcher herself and stolen a sphere that glowed black at night. That tale always discomforted Szeth, as it reminded him of the strange black sphere Gavilar had given him. He'd hidden that carefully in Jah Keved. He didn't know what it was, but he didn't want to risk a master taking it from him. Regarding Taravangian getting it, barring a passage from the Diagram, I have my doubts. Szeth hid it at least... 2-3 masters before Taravangian hired him. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutantspicy Posted December 23, 2017 Report Share Posted December 23, 2017 ^Cool thanks for that. Now that you state it I do remember this bit. But where is it from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dvoraen Posted December 23, 2017 Report Share Posted December 23, 2017 39 minutes ago, Mutantspicy said: ^Cool thanks for that. Now that you state it I do remember this bit. But where is it from? It's from an interlude in The Way of Kings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The One Who Connects he/him Posted December 24, 2017 Report Share Posted December 24, 2017 21 hours ago, Mutantspicy said: ^Cool thanks for that. Now that you state it I do remember this bit. But where is it from? More specifically(if you need it), it's from Interlude I-3 of Way of Kings. (It's also near the end of that interlude, if that helps) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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