[OB] On Shallan's possible character progression - and why Adolin is hindering it

[Guest]

@Spicker @little wilson

Once and for all: It is not my intention to antagonize Adolin.

Understood? Thank you. I'm not blaming him. I'm saying that he is involuntarily enabling Shallan to return to her coping mechanisms. Which is the complete opposite of putting the blame on him.

Though the theory with Dalinar is kinda moot now, because it didn't happen and won't happen.

See with the rest of your statements, I can actually agree. At least to a point. But I said before that I didn't want this to deteriorate into another shipping war. You're the ones constantly hinting at romantic involvement between Kaladin and Shallan.

Edited October 2, 2017 by SLNC

[little wilson]

I'm not saying that you're blaming him. I'm disagreeing that he's involuntarily enabling Shallan. I'm saying that anyone (within reason) could've done exactly what Adolin did and the same thing would've resulted.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, little wilson said:

I'm not saying that you're blaming him. I'm disagreeing that he's involuntarily enabling Shallan. I'm saying that anyone (within reason) could've done exactly what Adolin did and the same thing would've resulted.

Which is just so vague, that I can't accept it.

We can't be sure how it would have happened with Dalinar. We can theorize, yes, but we won't ever know if it would have played out that way. I think, she still has more fear of disappointing Adolin, over speaking out against Dalinar.

And even if your theory was right, it wouldn't change the fact, that Adolin is the culprit in the actual storyline.

Edited October 2, 2017 by SLNC

[+Spicker]

26 minutes ago, SLNC said:

Once and for all: It is not my intention to antagonize Adolin.

Understood? Thank you. I'm not blaming him. I'm saying that he is involuntarily enabling Shallan to return to her coping mechanisms. Which is the complete opposite of putting the blame on him.

Though the theory with Dalinar is kinda moot now, because it didn't happen.

See with the rest of your statements, I can actually agree. But I said before that I didn't want this to deteriorate into another shipping war. You're the ones constantly hinting on romantic involvement between Kaladin and Shallan.

I actually never hinted at romantic involvement with Kaladin. Kaladin can help her with or without any romantic element. I only mentioned the romantic element between shallan and Adolin because it relevant to the discussion.

 

Quote

And even if your theory was right, it wouldn't change the fact, that Adolin is the culprit in the actual storyline.

You may not be trying to blame him, but the language you use here tells a different story.
And your title literally calls out Adolin for hindering Shallan's progression. That kind of sounds like blame. I understand that's not what you intend, but hopefully you can atleast understand why people feel that your are putting blame on Adolin.
But like I said, I agree with what you said about their relationship causing them to build walls. So there is some blame on her relationship with Adolin, but I don't think it is as big a stumbling block to her progression as you do. We know she will have to confront her deception, and we will then get to see if she can progress from it or not.

 

Edited October 2, 2017 by Spicker

[Guest]

14 minutes ago, Spicker said:

You may not be trying to blame him, but the language you use here language tells a different story.

I'm not happy about my choice of the word "culprit" as well, but I couldn't think about a different one in the moment. Not a native speaker, sorry.

[+Spicker]

1 minute ago, SLNC said:

I'm not happy about my choice of the word "culprit" as well, but I couldn't think about a different one in the moment. Not a native speaker, sorry.

No worries. I think we are all guilty of not being able to communicate what we are thinking effectively, which can play a big part in perceived disagreements. I actually agreed with most of what you said, maybe just not how you painted the picture from the beginning. 
 

[Siaun Sanche]

5 hours ago, SLNC said:

I never even said, that I see it as a possible illness. If you mean that by 'pathologizing'.

You compared it to alcoholism in another thread.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Harry the Heir said:

You compared it to alcoholism in another thread.

I did what?

I compared it to the possibility of a depressed man developing an addiction to alcohol as a band-aid, short-term solution.

Why did you have to pull it out of context?

Edited October 2, 2017 by SLNC

[Siaun Sanche]

I don't understand the distinction that you're making. What strikes me as the larger context is that a number of people have reacted to a normal literary device by dismissing Shallan as "crazy", referring off-handedly to "mental deterioration", diagnosed her with DID or multiple personality disorder, or in your case comparing it to addiction. This strikes me as a strained reading of Shallan's larger arc--she is healthier, more honest with herself, and more confident than she's ever been over the course of the series--and a gendered reaction that feeds into a larger stereotype of women as crazy or unhinged.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, Harry the Heir said:

I don't understand the distinction that you're making. What strikes me as the larger context is that a number of people have reacted to a normal literary device by dismissing Shallan as "crazy", referring off-handedly to "mental deterioration", diagnosed her with DID or multiple personality disorder, or in your case comparing it to addiction. This strikes me as a strained reading of Shallan's larger arc--she is healthier, more honest with herself, and more confident than she's ever been over the course of the series--and a gendered reaction that feeds into a larger stereotype of women as crazy or unhinged.

What I actually tried to convey is that band-aid solutions are not solutions. I doesn't have anything to do with a gendered reaction.

[+Spicker]

4 minutes ago, Harry the Heir said:

I don't understand the distinction that you're making. What strikes me as the larger context is that a number of people have reacted to a normal literary device by dismissing Shallan as "crazy", referring off-handedly to "mental deterioration", diagnosed her with DID or multiple personality disorder, or in your case comparing it to addiction. This strikes me as a strained reading of Shallan's larger arc--she is healthier, more honest with herself, and more confident than she's ever been over the course of the series--and a gendered reaction that feeds into a larger stereotype of women as crazy or unhinged.

I must say that I am not diagnosing Shallan with anything, or am I dismissing her as crazy. I don't think it is fair to lump anyone who notes Shallan's identity struggles in the same class of thinking "Oh she is a woman, she is just acting crazy." I even said that as long as she can reconcile all the personalities she creates, then it could work as a coping mechanism. As someone who is a woman, who has PTSD, and has tried coping mechanisms to deal with panic attacks, I definitely identify with what Shallan goes through in some scenes. I do not consider myself crazy at all, and function normally a vast majority of the time (with the exception of my rare trigger situations).
Once again, I am not necessarily saying she has PTSD, but she was written in such a way that I identified my PTSD with it. Me making that connection has nothing to do with me associating craziness with women. It has to do with me seeing Shallan in a situation that I can almost feel what she's feeling. And yes, when I have a panic attack, I would describe it as mental deterioration. Ignoring the clear distress that Shallan is in in some situations for the sake of avoiding the crazy woman stereotype is a disservice to her character.
 

[Siaun Sanche]

5 minutes ago, Spicker said:

I must say that I am not diagnosing Shallan with anything, or am I dismissing her as crazy. I don't think it is fair to lump anyone who notes Shallan's identity struggles in the same class of thinking "Oh she is a woman, she is just acting crazy." I even said that as long as she can reconcile all the personalities she creates, then it could work as a coping mechanism. As someone who is a woman, who has PTSD, and has tried coping mechanisms to deal with panic attacks, I definitely identify with what Shallan goes through in some scenes. I do not consider myself crazy at all, and function normally a vast majority of the time (with the exception of my rare trigger situations).

I appreciate you saying that, and that helps me understand where you're coming from. Having also experienced panic attacks, I understand why "mental deterioration" came to mind for you. I had read that as a larger comment on her character arc, but I see now that you didn't intend that.

I'm not trying to say that people should ignore her distress as it happens, since it's an important part of her character arc. I have noticed a method of discussing it that strikes me as reductive and dismissive, and indicative of a double standard. Canonically all the KR are 'broken', but it seems like Shallan's attracted more of this kind of talk than male characters do.

[+Spicker]

12 minutes ago, Harry the Heir said:

I have noticed a method of discussing it that strikes me as reductive and dismissive, and indicative of a double standard. Canonically all the KR are 'broken', but it seems like Shallan's attracted more of this kind of talk than male characters do.

I can see that. Sometimes people jump to the worst conclusion and assume Shallan will have a complete mental breakdown. I am not saying it won't happen, but Shallan has shown in the past that she can confront the lies she creates, so I have no reason to think she can't do it again. This is part of the reason why I think there is a lot of room for her individual progression in her relationship with Adolin. She will probably have to be forced to face her deceptions, and quite possibly Adolin's.

The point is, all the KR's are broken, but they are all also very resilient. I would hate to see any of them become broken beyond repair.

Edited October 2, 2017 by Spicker

[maxal]

This theory works on several supposition and has for purpose to bring the readers to make conclusions based on those. 

1) This theory supposes Brightness Radiant would have never happened had anyone else but Adolin asked Shallan to learn how to train with her Shardblade. It strongly relies on the supposition the Shallan and Adolin's relationship is so unhealthy it brings out the worst out of Shallan, despite her/his best intentions. While the theory does not put the blame on Adolin himself, it is obvious it relies on the idea he is causing it, even if involuntary. It is obvious the theory means to state Adolin is bad for Shallan and she'd be better off without him. While the theory doesn't specifically say this, it is obvious the theory means for the readers reading it to draw this conclusion.

2) This theory depicts Shallan as a victim of Adolin, as her being trapped into a relationship she wants to make it work, all for the wrong reasons, which forces her to fragment herself just so she can keep up. It removes Shallan of her agency as if she isn't able to state, by her own free-will, whether she wants this relationship or not. Nobody is forcing her. She can get out any second she wants to, but the theory relies on the idea Adolin somehow forced Shallan to yield her Pattern-Blade when in fact Shallan agreed to do it. The theory will however said she did not agree of her own free-will, she did it to please whereas the textual suggests she did it because she understood it was needed. 

3) This theory supposes Brightness Radiant is negative and a symptom of Shallan further breaking down. The counter evidence is has she been regressing, he bond would have suffered. As far as we are aware, it didn't. The theory always links Brightness Radiant to Adolin's character.

4) This theory supposes Kaladin would have never provoked the arrival of Brightness Radiant even if he has asked the same thing. It also relies on the assumption Kaladin is better equipped to help Shallan on the fact he once had issues with dead-Blades. The theory however ignores the fact many Radiants are uneasy around Shardblades and often draw the wrong conclusions due to their lack of knowledge. Dalinar felt uneasy and ill-at-ease when he bonded his last Shardblade: he thought it was because he missed his former Blade. Renarin was terribly uneasy when he bonded his: he thought it was his head, his sickness which was causing it. Radiants do not react well to Blades, on average, so Kaladin not reacting well to them, even if he states it is because they killed his men, isn't the same as Shallan hating the weapon she was forced to use to kill her mother. Kaladin never went through the process of learning not to hate Blades because his problems is not with Blades, but with dead-Blades and what they represent. The theory supposes however Kaladin is the only human being able to help Shallan.

5) This theory supposes Shallan needs help and will never overcome her own issues without someone at her side.

6) This theory supposes Shallan will never be honest, will never open-up, will never share her secrets with anyone else but Kaladin: a bold assumption.

In short, the theory is working on several suppositions and assumptions which may turn out being true, but currently need many speculative elements to come to fruition to materialize itself. 

[Guest]

Christ... It was just an idea.

I have to assume some things to create s theory @maxal

That is why it is called a theory in the first place.

Edited October 3, 2017 by SLNC

[Guest]

But fine, I'll bite. Because you once again insinuate things, that I never said.

6 hours ago, maxal said:

This theory supposes Brightness Radiant would have never happened had anyone else but Adolin asked Shallan to learn how to train with her Shardblade. It strongly relies on the supposition the Shallan and Adolin's relationship is so unhealthy it brings out the worst out of Shallan, despite her/his best intentions. While the theory does not put the blame on Adolin himself, it is obvious it relies on the idea he is causing it, even if involuntary. It is obvious the theory means to state Adolin is bad for Shallan and she'd be better off without him. While the theory doesn't specifically say this, it is obvious the theory means for the readers reading it to draw this conclusion.

No. I put the blame on him for not noticing what is happening to Shallan, for actively promoting it. He had the right idea, but it backfired. I don't put the blame on him for "triggering" the creation of Brightness Radiant. Anyway, we've been over this. It is unnecessary to theorize about how others could have created Brightness Radiant, because it already is written that it was Adolin who caused it. But that the thing is, that he would even act as an enabler, if it hadn't been him. I am still going to assume, he would have wanted to train Blade-fighting and by enlarge would have still promoted Shallan's use of Brightness Radiant. If you are going to assume things, I think I am allowed to assume things, too. Am I not?

All I'm saying is, that I don't see Adolin, in his current state, to be helpful in any way. This might change. I acknowledge that. Whether or not I mean to say, that she is better off without him is up to your interpretation. I didn't mean to imply or manipulate anything and, frankly, I'm getting a bit insulted on that ground, that you assume I'm a manipulative person.

6 hours ago, maxal said:

This theory depicts Shallan as a victim of Adolin, as her being trapped into a relationship she wants to make it work, all for the wrong reasons, which forces her to fragment herself just so she can keep up. It removes Shallan of her agency as if she isn't able to state, by her own free-will, whether she wants this relationship or not. Nobody is forcing her. She can get out any second she wants to, but the theory relies on the idea Adolin somehow forced Shallan to yield her Pattern-Blade when in fact Shallan agreed to do it. The theory will however said she did not agree of her own free-will, she did it to please whereas the textual suggests she did it because she understood it was needed. 

No.

Once again, you're implying things that I never stated. I stated that the only reason, why she is staying is out of free will. Because she doesn't want to disappoint Adolin, because she doesn't want him to ask difficult questions. But why doesn't she want that to happen? Because she wants to keep the status quo. Out of her own free will. Honestly, stop pushing Adolin into some kind of victim role. I am not trying to antagonize him. Isn't my word good enough?

6 hours ago, maxal said:

This theory supposes Brightness Radiant is negative and a symptom of Shallan further breaking down. The counter evidence is has she been regressing, he bond would have suffered. As far as we are aware, it didn't. The theory always links Brightness Radiant to Adolin's character.

Because it is my interpretation of it. You don't have to agree, but in the context of my theory, which you know is theoretical, it makes sense.

Her bond is suffering. Pattern doesn't see any way to help her, but to offering to kill himself. I don't know how this is can't be interpretated as their bond suffering and being strained.

Of course, it links it to Adolin's character. She created Radiant as a reaction to not disappoint him.

6 hours ago, maxal said:

This theory supposes Kaladin would have never provoked the arrival of Brightness Radiant even if he has asked the same thing. It also relies on the assumption Kaladin is better equipped to help Shallan on the fact he once had issues with dead-Blades. The theory however ignores the fact many Radiants are uneasy around Shardblades and often draw the wrong conclusions due to their lack of knowledge. Dalinar felt uneasy and ill-at-ease when he bonded his last Shardblade: he thought it was because he missed his former Blade. Renarin was terribly uneasy when he bonded his: he thought it was his head, his sickness which was causing it. Radiants do not react well to Blades, on average, so Kaladin not reacting well to them, even if he states it is because they killed his men, isn't the same as Shallan hating the weapon she was forced to use to kill her mother. Kaladin never went through the process of learning not to hate Blades because his problems is not with Blades, but with dead-Blades and what they represent. The theory supposes however Kaladin is the only human being able to help Shallan.

I know, that their stories don't exactly line up, but there are enough parallels.

I never said that Kaladin will be the only human being to ever be able to help Shallan, but I don't see Adolin helping her right now and I was going on the assumption, that she once opened up to Kaladin. Sure, it was under peculiar circumstances, but it still worked out for Shallan and it working out naturally lowers inhibitions. Plus, she doesn't have to worry about losing his affection.

6 hours ago, maxal said:

5) This theory supposes Shallan needs help and will never overcome her own issues without someone at her side.

6) This theory supposes Shallan will never be honest, will never open-up, will never share her secrets with anyone else but Kaladin: a bold assumption.

Because psychological problems seldom solve themselves. I've been there, believe me.

I was going on the assumption, that she once opened up to Kaladin. Sure, it was under peculiar circumstances, but it still worked out for Shallan and it working out naturally lowers inhibitions. Plus, she doesn't have to worry about losing his affection.

I know, that it isn't cast in stone. It is a theory. And I never advertised it as anything else. You're trying to make it more than it is.

Edited October 3, 2017 by SLNC

[Aleksiel]

10 minutes ago, SLNC said:

She created Radiant as a reaction to not disappoint him.

No, the need for Radiant goes back to her mother's death and her years long inability to process what happened. Yes, she acknowledged she killed her mother with Pattern as a Blade in WoR, yet in OB she preferred to differentiate between Pattern her spren and the Blade that killed her mother, so she created Radiant to reconcile herself (as best she currently can) with Pattern the Blade.

Quote

 “I can’t be this person, Pattern. I can’t just wield the sword. Some brilliant knight on a tower, pretending she should be followed.”

 

Quote

 

Veil. Veil would be fine holding a sword. She didn’t have Shallan’s broken soul, and hadn’t killed her parents. She’d be able to do this.

No. No, what would Adolin do if he returned and found a completely different woman in the room? He couldn’t know of Veil. The lines she sketched, ragged and unrefined from the shaking pencil, quickly took the shape of her own face. But hair in a bun. A poised woman, not as flighty as Shallan, not as unintentionally silly.

 

Radiant's appearance being so close to Shallan's own instead of hiding behind Veil was for Adolin, it was intended for him to not notice the difference between Shallan and Radiant, however she created Radiant to wield Pattern as a Blade. This is the fundamental reason, it's clearly stated. The occasion was training with Adolin. There is a radical difference between those.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Aleksiel said:

No, the need for Radiant goes back to her mother's death and her years long inability to process what happened. Yes, she acknowledged she killed her mother with Pattern as a Blade in WoR, yet in OB she preferred to differentiate between Pattern her spren and the Blade that killed her mother, so she created Radiant to reconcile herself (as best she currently can) with Pattern the Blade.

 

Radiant's appearance being so close to Shallan's own instead of hiding behind Veil was for Adolin, it was intended for him to not notice the difference between Shallan and Radiant, however she created Radiant to wield Pattern as a Blade. This is the fundamental reason, it's clearly stated. The occasion was training with Adolin. There is a radical difference between those.

Alright, let me rephrase.

She let Radiant emerge as a reaction to not disappoint Adolin.

Look, it really isn't important, why she created Radiant how Radiant is. Adolin tried to make Shallan embrace what she really is and she creates Radiant to avoid it. Adolin is still the cause for Radiant to emerge.

And before you say, that it could have been anyone else. Firstly, I don't completely agree with that, because she's much more emotionally invested in Adolin. Secondly, we've been over this and it is written now, that it was Adolin, who caused what happened.

Edited October 3, 2017 by SLNC

[Aleksiel]

Just now, SLNC said:

Alright, let me rephrase.

She let Radiant *emerge* as a reaction to not disappoint Adolin.

Look, it really isn't important, why she created Radiant how Radiant is. Adolin tried to make Shallan embrace what she really is and she creates Radiant to avoid it. Adolin is still the cause for Radiant to emerge.

A lot of your theory seems to rely on the fact Adolin is the prime reason for Radiant's existence, so I'm trying to show you why I think you got the causal connection wrong. In one sentence you say it's not important why created Radiant, then you state Adolin was the cause. You put too much responsibility on Adolin that's not textually justified. 

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, Aleksiel said:

A lot of your theory seems to rely on the fact Adolin is the prime reason for Radiant's existence, so I'm trying to show you why I think you got the causal connection wrong. In one sentence you say it's not important why created Radiant, then you state Adolin was the cause. You put too much responsibility on Adolin that's not textually justified. 

Look.

Adolin is responsible, that Radiant exists, because he is the one, who pushed Shallan into creating Radiant on a whim.

I'm not saying, that Adolin is to blame for her making that decision, because that was her own decision to make, But she makes that decision, because she doesn't want to screw up their relationship.

Textual evidence? Fine.

Chapter 13:

Quote

 

Adolin bellowed a laugh, and Shallan couldn’t help joining in at the ridiculousness of it. She stepped back from him, but kept hold on his hand. “Neither of us is going to mess this up,” she said to him, squeezing his hand. “Despite what might at times seem like our best efforts otherwise.”

“Promise?” he asked.

“I promise. Let’s look at this notebook of yours and see what it says about our murderer.”

 

She promised him she'd not mess anything up, which is why she is afraid to talk out against him. To object him in that. And because she is afraid, about how she would mess everything up, when he'd know the whole truth. So, she doesn't even allow him to even begin asking difficult questions

Edited October 3, 2017 by SLNC

[Aleksiel]

Just now, SLNC said:

Look.

Adolin is responsible, that Radiant exists, because he is the one, who pushed Shallan into creating Radiant on a whim.

I'm not saying, that Adolin is to blame for her making that decision, because that was her own decision to make, But she makes that decision, because she doesn't want to screw up their relationship.

Textual evidence? Fine.

Chapter 13:

She promised him she'd not mess anything up, which is why she is afraid to talk out against him. To object him in that. And because she is afraid, about how she would mess everything up, when he'd know the whole truth.

This isn't what she thinks about when creating Radiant, she thinks what I pointed to few posts above - that she can't be that person and that Veil could be, which is interesting because she has already recognized Veil as a version of herself. The fact that Radiant looks like Shallan is because of Adolin, but not the inner need to have someone else wield Pattern the Blade.

[Guest]

Just now, Aleksiel said:

This isn't what she thinks about when creating Radiant, she thinks what I pointed to few posts above - that she can't be that person and that Veil could be, which is interesting because she has already recognized Veil as a version of herself. The fact that Radiant looks like Shallan is because of Adolin, but not the inner need to have someone else wield Pattern the Blade.

But Adolin is the direct cause of why she created Radiant. She may not have created Radiant for the specific reason of training with Adolin, but to be able to wield Pattern as a Blade. And yet, she created Radiant out of a need to train with Adolin.

[Shadowfax]

I haven't posted here in a really long time, but this discussion intrigues me. 

 

I want to start off saying, I am not a shipper of any sort. Shallan's story is her own and I honestly don't think she's capable of an actual relationship because she has no idea what a healthy relationship is supposed to be.

 

First, I believe that SLNC isn't trying to blame Adolin for anything, because everything Shallan did, she chose to do. But I also believe that she chose to do what she did due to her betrothal with Adolin and not wanting to lose it. The betrothal means a lot to her, and it was a topic of some focus in the chapters so her perception of it is entirely relevant.

 

Adolin is the one, in the text, who sparked her actions. That is undeniable. He was the one who stated she needs to train with her blade, and he is not wrong; even Pattern agrees.

 

Shallan, not wanting to lose her betrothal, not wanting to let Adolin down, not wanting her evening with him to end, creates Radiant as a coping mechanism against the fear/hate of Pattern as Blade. Shallan did that. FOR HER BETROTHAL TO ADOLIN. Whether or not she may have done it with anyone else does not matter because in the text she has already done it, and done it for him.

 

Pattern is confused about the Radiant personality. Again, Shallan is hiding from hard truths, unwilling to face her fear/hate. This does hinder her progress. This is a setback. Coping mechanisms are never healthy for the long term. Does it hinder her right away? Not entirely, since she is at least finding a part of herself that is willing to hold the Blade. It's still not the correct solution; SHALLAN has to be the one to wield the Blade.

 

The theory, from what I can understand, only states that because of what Shallan has already done -in the text we have- in regards to her fear/hate, when Adolin was around, that perhaps he's not the one to help her overcome it. It's not a wildly outlandish theory and it makes some sense. If Shallan doesn't change her feelings about the betrothal, she will never be able to be her true self around Adolin, and that will hinder her progress. 

 

The theory also seems to state that since Kaladin has been there - in a place of hate and having to overcome it to become what he needs to be- that perhaps he is in a better position to offer Shallan some help. I don't disagree with this. IF they have another moment like they did in the chasms, it could happen. 

 

Ultimately Shallan needs to work out her issues with Pattern. If she gets any help from the outside, the theory proposes Kaladin would be the better option since he has been there in that place of hate and has overcome it.

 

I am just honestly confused why people seem to think this theory is vilifying Adolin when it doesn't seem to be at all. This is a theory about Shallan, and what may help her more. My interpretation of the chapters we've gotten is similar to what was stated in this theory; Adolin may be good for Shallan as a person, but not as a growing radiant who needs to progress through her issues, and not just find ways to cope with them in the short-term.

 

 

[Aleksiel]

Just now, SLNC said:

But Adolin is the direct cause of why she created Radiant. She may not have created Radiant for the specific reason of training with Adolin, but to be able to wield Pattern as a Blade. And yet, she created Radiant out of a need to train with Adolin.

I agree she created Radiant to wield Pattern the Blade, it's the next part we seem to disagree on. Yes, training Adolin was the occasion and plenty of other things could have started this, which I thought you disagreed with, but I don't see why you would if you recognize the main reason for Radiant's existence is for Shallan to use patternblade. 

If I can use an example Jasnah created the circumstances for Shallan's brilliance to shine, but Jasnah isn't the source of Shallan's abilities. So much the same way Shallan's inability to use patternblade is independent of Adolin, thus why I say you put too much responsibility on him. Shallan (for now) has the need to use intermediary - Radiant - anytime she wields patternblade, not solely around Adolin. 

[Guest]

Just now, Aleksiel said:

Shallan (for now) has the need to use intermediary - Radiant - anytime she wields patternblade, not solely around Adolin. 

Nope. She has used it just fine to open Oathgates. With pain, but she didn't need to be Radiant for that.