Possible proto-bondsmith?

[Calderis he/him]

This has to have been pointed out before, but I haven't seen it personally and it stood out during my reread. 

From tWoK ch. 66 Codes, 

Quote

“That chanting, that singing, those rasping voices.” —Kaktach 1173, 16 seconds pre-death. A middle-aged potter. Reported seeing strange dreams during highstorms during the last two years.

Strange dreams during highstorms seems rather significant. Could it be another proto-bondsmith who died? 

[StrikerEZ he/him]

Hmm...I never paid all that much attention to those, and I never noticed that one before. Sounds a lot like a proto-Bondsmith, but I dunno. Why would a random potter become a Bondsmith?

EDIT: I just thought of something. Do we know if Gavilar received the visions during Higstorms, or could that just have been Dalinar's way of receiving them?

Edited July 26, 2017 by StrikerEZ

[Calderis he/him]

1 minute ago, StrikerEZ said:

Hmm...I never paid all that much attention to those, and I never noticed that one before. Sounds a lot like a proto-Bondsmith, but I dunno. Why would a random potter become a Bondsmith?

The main question I want to know, is did that death date precede Dalinar receiving the visions. 

[StrikerEZ he/him]

1 minute ago, Calderis said:

The main question I want to know, is did that death date precede Dalinar receiving the visions. 

Hmmm...was it ever specified when he started receiving them? I can't really remember, but I think it just said that he'd been having them for awhile before the start of the book. He'd had a couple before WoK even started, I think.

[Calderis he/him]

Just now, StrikerEZ said:

Hmmm...was it ever specified when he started receiving them? I can't really remember, but I think it just said that he'd been having them for awhile before the start of the book. He'd had a couple before WoK even started, I think.

It had only been a couple of months. If I remember correctly, either his first or second Vision that we see was noted in book as the 12th he'd experienced. 

[StrikerEZ he/him]

5 minutes ago, Calderis said:

It had only been a couple of months. If I remember correctly, either his first or second Vision that we see was noted in book as the 12th he'd experienced. 

Ah, okay. Hmm...it'd be nice if we had specific dates for the start of the books.

Also, do we know if Gavilar received the visions during the Highstorms as well? Could that just be how Dalinar receives them? Or do you think that's how the visions have to be received?

[CaptainRyan he/him]

14 minutes ago, Calderis said:

This has to have been pointed out before, but I haven't seen it personally and it stood out during my reread. 

From tWoK ch. 66 Codes, 

14 minutes ago, Calderis said:

“That chanting, that singing, those rasping voices.” —Kaktach 1173, 16 seconds pre-death. A middle-aged potter. Reported seeing strange dreams during highstorms during the last two years.

Strange dreams during highstorms seems rather significant. Could it be another proto-bondsmith who died? 

I agree with you here. I have also wondered if this fellow was a proto-bondsmith or if they just happened to have some sort of connection issue. 
Off topic but "connection issue" in the Cosmere will have strange meanings once the internet is invented haha

Anywho, according to a timeline I found online at this place it says that Bridge Four rescued Dalinar's army in 1173. If I recall correctly, Dalinar makes an off-hand comment about how he has been seeing visions for the past 5-6 months during tWoK. So, it could mean Dalinar started seeing the visions right after this fellow died or it could mean there was some overlap. It would require more investigation to see if I am remembering what Dalinar said correctly and what order the months are in.

 

2 minutes ago, StrikerEZ said:

Also, do we know if Gavilar received the visions during the Highstorms as well? Could that just be how Dalinar receives them? Or do you think that's how the visions have to be received?

I think that is how the visions have to be received. Also, I think I remember Taravangian mentioning that Gavilar confided to him (Taravangian) about his (Gavilar's) visions. So, I believe Gavilar received the visions and I believe he received them during highstorms.

[Pagerunner he/him]

Kaladin dreamed during a Highstorm, and watched one of Szeth's assassinations. Renarin also may have seen visions during Highstorms, since that was when he made the marks. I think he may have been an incipient Radiant, but not necessarily a Bondsmith.

I believe Kaktach means the 8th month, the 9th week, and the 3rd day. (Kak, Tanat, Chach.) I'm having a hard time finding exact dates, but I believe the battle for the Tower (the end of WoK) was the 9th month, the 6th week, and the 4th day. (From what I could find here; I can't vouch for its accuracy.) That means that there were 36 days (or maybe 35, I'm just counting on my fingers) between this man's death and the battle of the Tower. I don't believe that's enough time for everything that happened to Kaladin, much less to allow Dalinar to experience several highstorms before Kaladin's arrival into camp.

[StrikerEZ he/him]

1 minute ago, CaptainRyan said:

I think that is how the visions have to be received. Also, I think I remember Taravangian mentioning that Gavilar confided to him (Taravangian) about his (Gavilar's) visions. So, I believe Gavilar received the visions and I believe he received them during highstorms.

I know Gavilar received the visions as well. I was just wondering if he received them during Highstorms as well, because I don't think it was ever explicitly mentioned.

I mean, you would think someone would've noticed their king disappearing during every Highstorm like Dalinar did. Someone would've send something about the fact that both Gavilar and Dalinar hid inside their rooms during Highstorms.

[Calderis he/him]

4 minutes ago, Pagerunner said:

Kaladin dreamed during a Highstorm, and watched one of Szeth's assassinations. Renarin also may have seen visions during Highstorms, since that was when he made the marks. I think he may have been an incipient Radiant, but not necessarily a Bondsmith.

Very very true. Dalinar's visions are such a prominent part of the story that I completely disregarded Kaladin's own highstorm dreams. 

Thank you. 

[Toaster Retribution he/him]

There is a difference in frequency with Kaladins and Dalinars visions though. Kal has had his twice(?) while Dalinar had more than ten, in quick succession. Knowing how often Mr. Potter received his visions is important for figuring them out. 

When it comes to Renarin, a lot of wierd stuff is going on with him, and we lack information about him and his order, so judging stuff based on him seems unsafe. 

Generally though, neither Shallan, Jasnah or Lift seem to have been subject to visions. Neither have often-theorized proto-radiants such as Eshonai, Adolin, Szeth or Rysn. 

So I think that visions are special, and not something that your average Radiant necessarily experiences.

[Calderis he/him]

1 hour ago, StrikerEZ said:

I mean, you would think someone would've noticed their king disappearing during every Highstorm like Dalinar did.

I don't think so actually. People already huddle inside during highstorms, and Gavilar was a member of, if not the founder of, the Sons of Honor. He also told Taravangian of his visions. It would be much less difficult to hide if you have co-conspirators to vouch for your whereabouts during the storms. 

[+hwiles]

 

1 hour ago, Pagerunner said:

...

I believe Kaktach means the 8th month, the 9th week, and the 3rd day. (Kak, Tanat, Chach.) I'm having a hard time finding exact dates, but I believe the battle for the Tower (the end of WoK) was the 9th month, the 6th week, and the 4th day. (From what I could find here; I can't vouch for its accuracy.) That means that there were 36 days (or maybe 35, I'm just counting on my fingers) between this man's death and the battle of the Tower. I don't believe that's enough time for everything that happened to Kaladin, much less to allow Dalinar to experience several highstorms before Kaladin's arrival into camp.

Actually, since highstorms hit every 3ish days on average, that might be exactly enough time for Dalinars visions to have started immediately after that potter's death.

Btw, you're right on the dates according to the sources i could find on my own.

[AluminumGnat he/him]

Highstorms occur every 3 days?! I had thought the gap between each was closer to two weeks. Is there something I am missing here?

[Watchcry he/him]

3 hours ago, StrikerEZ said:

I know Gavilar received the visions as well. I was just wondering if he received them during Highstorms as well, because I don't think it was ever explicitly mentioned.

I mean, you would think someone would've noticed their king disappearing during every Highstorm like Dalinar did. Someone would've send something about the fact that both Gavilar and Dalinar hid inside their rooms during Highstorms.

Navani definitely ought to have noticed Gavilar receiving visions during high storms. She would have said something to Dalinar. 

[+hwiles]

5 minutes ago, AluminumGnat said:

Highstorms occur every 3 days?! I had thought the gap between each was closer to two weeks. Is there something I am missing here?

Er...i believe that's the approximate average. Closer to the weeping the time increases to 6-12 days, but most of the year I believe it's usually 2-6 and only relatively rarely are there longer breaks.

Edit: it's been a while since my last reread, if this sounds bonkers definitely fact check me.

Edited July 26, 2017 by hwiles

[Weltall]

I don't remember the exact text where highstorm timing is discussed but they're described as coming every few days. The Weeping is significant because on every other year there's a two week gap between highstorms on each end (start to Lightday, Lightday to end) and on alternate years there's four straight weeks with no highstorms. For a two week gap to be significant, the average period between storms necessarily has to be a lot shorter than that.

Roshar also has very odd seasons and those tend to last a couple of weeks before transitioning to another, unpredictably.

[+hwiles]

I don't want to derail this thread any further, but to clarify, the weird seasons thing is confirmed to be due to Roshar not having a tilted axis. Roshar doesn't have seasons in the traditional sense, so they call any time period of relatively uniform weather a "season," but year round, there's less variation than on Earthlike planets.

[AluminumGnat he/him]

Huh. Thanks for all of the replies! Definitely something to keep in mind during my next re-read. 

[Pagerunner he/him]

There is a list of ten Highstorm dates in the WoR Ch88 epigraph. One is 3 days after the previous one, one is 7 days, but most are 5 or 6.

Edited July 27, 2017 by Pagerunner

[Darkness he/him]

The order of Pagerunners to the rescue again