Kaladin Vs Szeth POV

[Chlehrma]

My worry is that Szeth will come for Dalinar, see a plated up Renarin and think it is Dalinar in his plate.

[flinn]

 I like how he did the end of Rithmatist.

Their POVs and reaction POVs.

[Tarion]

I hope this isn't when Kal says the next ideal, because it would be too predictable.

By Words of Radiance, we should have enough Proto-Radiants that "the next ideal" probably won't be too big of a deal.  There'll be someone "levelling up" fairly regularly, assuming that they're all on their own journeys.  

 

As such, hitting them at the predictable moments might not be too bad.

 

Then again, I still can't quite put into words the swell of emotion that hits me when Kal says his near the end of WoK.  I definitely hope that Sanderson can keep it like that.  

[DbuckiMcg]

I hope we see the conflict from Kaladin's POV, then get to see the conflict again in Szeth's POV book as a flashback that helps shape/change his life as he tries to redeem himself for actions that he has come to regret.

Edited January 29, 2014 by DbuckiMcg

[TomR]

What is likely to have Sadeas gnashing his teeth is that he is now a "mere" Shardbearer when others are Surgebinders.  It would be even more galling to find out what it takes to become a Surgebinder and realize he has no chance.

 

Well, there's always Voidbinding.

[Cad]

Worst scenario would be if Jasnah is there at all. Then from anyone's viewpoint, Kal takes on Szeth, (if the pov isn't Kal) there's a This post has been reported for attempting to skirt the rules moment when Kaladin reveals his Radiantness, then Jasnah soulcasts Szeth into a pile of dust.

Best scenario, IMO, would be ending in Sadeas' POV, where he realizes that he did end up with the worst side of the trade, then he looks down and says, "Where'd my dinner go?"

[+eveorjoy]

Worst scenario would be if Jasnah is there at all. Then from anyone's viewpoint, Kal takes on Szeth, (if the pov isn't Kal) there's a This post has been reported for attempting to skirt the rules moment when Kaladin reveals his Radiantness, then Jasnah soulcasts Szeth into a pile of dust.

 

Hmmm.... good point. Brandon really needs to clarify Jasnah's limitations. Still, that would be funny in a sad way. Kaladin gets all glowie ready to lay some smackdown and then Jasnah turns Szeth into stone. Afterward commenting to Kaladin, "Aw, so you are windrunner." At which point every reader would toss their book across the room feeling cheated.

 

I wonder if Jasnah was able to kill those men because they didn't expect it. Maybe there is a way to counteract the power. Otherwise Jasnah is the most powerful human on Roshar. What does she have to worry about? Just give her enough gemstones and she can take care of the voidbringer problem all by herself.

[Stoneward]

...then he looks down and says, "Where'd my dinner go?"

Gold. +1 for catching me completely off guard.

[hoser]

Hmmm....

...

I wonder if Jasnah was able to kill those men because they didn't expect it. Maybe there is a way to counteract the power. Otherwise Jasnah is the most powerful human on Roshar. What does she have to worry about? Just give her enough gemstones and she can take care of the voidbringer problem all by herself.

Mostly investiture interferes with other investiture, so Jasnah is not going to be able to soulcast an infused person easily.  If Kaladin keeps his low-level burn on, he should be fairly safe.  I don't know about non-infused Shardplate wearers, though. 

[Robot Aztec]

SYL POV! Cheerlesder time

[+eveorjoy]

Mostly investiture interferes with other investiture, so Jasnah is not going to be able to soulcast an infused person easily.  If Kaladin keeps his low-level burn on, he should be fairly safe.  I don't know about non-infused Shardplate wearers, though. 

 

This is most likely the case, but it is still not clear. Oh well, I'm sure an explanation is coming.

 

SYL POV! Cheerlesder time

 

Oh that would be awesome. If not in WoR I want her POV in a later book.

Edited January 30, 2014 by eveorjoy

[Mr Horrible]

Mostly investiture interferes with other investiture, so Jasnah is not going to be able to soulcast an infused person easily.  If Kaladin keeps his low-level burn on, he should be fairly safe.  I don't know about non-infused Shardplate wearers, though. 

 

Even if Jasnah can't transform surgebinders/shardplate wearers, couldn't she transform the air around them to say, sharpened steel? Heck even mud or stone would likely immobilize anyone.

[don_karma_II]

But of course for the most awesome of all POVs, Lift would have to be there. 

 Lift would probably say " Look he's awesome too.. His void bringer is cute though!!" 

[hoser]

Even if Jasnah can't transform surgebinders/shardplate wearers, couldn't she transform the air around them to say, sharpened steel? Heck even mud or stone would likely immobilize anyone.

Is there a bead in Shadesmar for "the air around Kaladin"?  I still don't get soulcasting air.  Is there one bead for all the air?  It seems like it would take a lot of stormlight to change that.  Maybe?  It still seems OP. 

 

They soulcast air into barracks, though, don't they?  Do they use: a mold, the imagination of the person Soulcasting, some ideal barracks Form? 

[Haxors]

My worry is that Szeth will come for Dalinar, see a plated up Renarin and think it is Dalinar in his plate.

that is something i hadnt thought about, i could easily see that happening. which leads me to believe, god forbid, that renarin might die!! or atleast be gravely injured, i really really hope that im wrong as he is a very relatable character, imo anyway

Edited January 30, 2014 by Haxors

[Duskshard]

that is something i hadnt thought about, i could easily see that happening. which leads me to believe, god forbid, that renarin might die!! or atleast be gravely injured, i really really hope that im wrong as he is a very relatable character, imo anyway

 

Feather's going to faint when she reads this. 

[Shadow Guardian]

At the risk of just re-iterating what several have already said, I think it's likely to flow between both of their viewpoints during the battle, especially depending on how long, drawn out, and epic the inevitable fight becomes. If it's only 1 viewpoint, then my money is on it being Kaladin, but otherwise, I would expect it to switch between as many of our viewpoint characters that are participating in the fight. (I suspect it won't be 'just' Kaladin vs Szeth, but it would likely end with just them as they would use their windrunner abilities to move out of reach of any other participants.)

[Aleksiel]

that is something i hadnt thought about, i could easily see that happening. which leads me to believe, god forbid, that renarin might die!! or atleast be gravely injured, i really really hope that im wrong as he is a very relatable character, imo anyway

 

Oh, come on guys! First someone wrote Kaladin might die and now Renarin?! I don't like this. If someone's dying, let that be...uh, I don't know... Amaram. There, Szeth can kill Amaram.

[don_karma_II]

Oh, come on guys! First someone wrote Kaladin might die and now Renarin?! I don't like this. If someone's dying, let that be...uh, I don't know... Amaram. There, Szeth can kill Amaram.

or Sadeas. You know, he's kinda dull.

[Stoneward]

My worry is that Szeth will come for Dalinar, see a plated up Renarin and think it is Dalinar in his plate.

It's possible, but I don't think it's likely.

Seth does his homework. When he was planning the hit on Taravangian, Szeth knew the "full" palace layout and the king's daily routine down to the hour before he went in for the kill. Szeth would do a lot of recon before attacking Dalinar, and I think it would be very unlikely he wouldn't hear the story. I mean, a Highprince gave up a Shardblade, worth kingdoms, for a bunch of slaves. People will be talking about little else. Szeth probably doesn't even need to ask around to hear all about it; just walk through the market place.

That doesn't mean Renarin's out of danger, though. I love the guy, but he's totally the type to run out into the middle of a Kaladin/Szeth battle because he wants to "help", and I give it a 50/50 chance that he forgets his helmet.

Actually, I'm starting to love this idea. Give us a Renarin's PoV, put him in danger for a noble cause, and then give us HIS second ideal.

Then Szeth takes a beating from the nerd in glasses.

Yes, please.

Edited January 30, 2014 by Stoneward

[Speaker4thDead]

If the covers any indicator to how the battle goes, then Szeth is literally standing on a mound of presumably the guard. Kaladin looks pretty beat down too. The WoK cover was almost a direct correlation to a scene in the novel except with Kaladin saluting instead of Dalinar.

Point being BS is providing ample time to shift between POV based solely on the indicated scale of the fight.

[ccstat]

This is a bit out there, but it's my honest prediction:

First half of the fight is Kaladin POV, he does his best but Szeth gets around him and dispatches Dalinar. Sadness! Then, switch to Szeth POV for the twist! Apparently-innocent-spectator Shallan has fooled him with a lightweaving and Dalinar is really on the other side of the room. Szeth is about to fail, can't trust his eyes, and is running out of stormlight fast. More fighting, ending with Szeth's narrow escape.

[Aminar]

I am firmly of the opinion that Szeth would yield to Kaladin. Szeth knows enough, seemingly, to know about honorspren and the nahal bond. The minute he was forced to face someone with enough honor to attract an honorspren he'd realize that what he has done for his own honor has been utterly futile.

On the other hand, if he has to fight Adolin, which would be a much more interesting fight, things would be very different. I think that scene would be from Szeth's PoV as he realizes that he's finally met his match, that he's finally free of the killing. Right until his slavery has to continue for some reason.

[DefiantBurrito]

Hi I'm new!

 

I strongly suspect that the inevitable Kaladin/Szeth battle will end with Szeth being captured alive.

 

Why?  Remember Wit/Hoid's story about the island villagers who were "forced" to do evil things by their king, only to find out that the king had been dead for years?  Well, I can't help feeling that the story is "destined" for Szeth. (By "destined", not sure if I mean that this was somehow Hoid's intention, or just Brandon's... either way, seems like too good of a fit with Szeth's character to ignore IMO.)

 

It might seem unlikely that Kaladin would be able to capture Szeth, since Szeth seems much more powerful.  But I think there are a few reasonable ways it could happen...

 

1. Kaladin could become much stronger before Szeth shows up.  (Seems unlikely that he could catch up that quickly, but he does have a whole research team helping him out!  Plus, maybe Syl or the KR ideals will help power him up in some way.)

2. He could have help from one of the many Shardbearers around.  Or perhaps from Shallan or Jasnah.

3. My current favorite theory - Maybe Szeth will be so shocked to see another Windrunner that he will hesitate or leave Kaladin some opening.  Might seem unlikely at first glance, but I think we all suspect that the reason for Szeth's "Truthless" status is tied up in the Knights Radiant/Surgebinding somehow, so learning that other Surgebinders exist might be VERY important to him!  Like, important enough to make him consider abandoning his mission.  Meanwhile, Kaladin certainly has the warrior instincts to take advantage of any slight opening. 

4. All of the above?

 

I sort of like Aminar's theory that Szeth might just yield outright (basically just an extension of #3), but I'm not really expecting that, if only because I don't think Brandon would want to cheat us out of such a cool battle scene.    Plus, yielding peacefully in a Shardblade/Stormlight battle might be easier said than done.  

 

In any case, I suspect the scene ends with Szeth being thrown in a cell (Kaladin will be smart enough to keep Stormlight far, far away), and then Kaladin will start interrogating him to learn more about his powers.  Eventually they will become "friends" (or at least develop some respect) and this will lead to Kaladin repeating Hoid's story somehow.  Not sure where things might go from there, but certainly Szeth will have something to think about!

 

Anyway, if the scene plays out like I expect, I would guess that it will be a Kaladin POV.  That just seems to fit best - I think Brandon would want to tell that story from the view of the "underdog" during the fight, and he'll also want to preserve some mystery and uncertainty about Szeth's reaction to seeing another Surgebinder, to make the later interrogation process all the more interesting.

[Aminar]

Hi I'm new!

 

I strongly suspect that the inevitable Kaladin/Szeth battle will end with Szeth being captured alive.

 

Why?  Remember Wit/Hoid's story about the island villagers who were "forced" to do evil things by their king, only to find out that the king had been dead for years?  Well, I can't help feeling that the story is "destined" for Szeth. (By "destined", not sure if I mean that this was somehow Hoid's intention, or just Brandon's... either way, seems like too good of a fit with Szeth's character to ignore IMO.)

 

It might seem unlikely that Kaladin would be able to capture Szeth, since Szeth seems much more powerful.  But I think there are a few reasonable ways it could happen...

 

1. Kaladin could become much stronger before Szeth shows up.  (Seems unlikely that he could catch up that quickly, but he does have a whole research team helping him out!  Plus, maybe Syl or the KR ideals will help power him up in some way.)

2. He could have help from one of the many Shardbearers around.  Or perhaps from Shallan or Jasnah.

3. My current favorite theory - Maybe Szeth will be so shocked to see another Windrunner that he will hesitate or leave Kaladin some opening.  Might seem unlikely at first glance, but I think we all suspect that the reason for Szeth's "Truthless" status is tied up in the Knights Radiant/Surgebinding somehow, so learning that other Surgebinders exist might be VERY important to him!  Like, important enough to make him consider abandoning his mission.  Meanwhile, Kaladin certainly has the warrior instincts to take advantage of any slight opening. 

4. All of the above?

 

I sort of like Aminar's theory that Szeth might just yield outright (basically just an extension of #3), but I'm not really expecting that, if only because I don't think Brandon would want to cheat us out of such a cool battle scene.    Plus, yielding peacefully in a Shardblade/Stormlight battle might be easier said than done.  

 

In any case, I suspect the scene ends with Szeth being thrown in a cell (Kaladin will be smart enough to keep Stormlight far, far away), and then Kaladin will start interrogating him to learn more about his powers.  Eventually they will become "friends" (or at least develop some respect) and this will lead to Kaladin repeating Hoid's story somehow.  Not sure where things might go from there, but certainly Szeth will have something to think about!

 

Anyway, if the scene plays out like I expect, I would guess that it will be a Kaladin POV.  That just seems to fit best - I think Brandon would want to tell that story from the view of the "underdog" during the fight, and he'll also want to preserve some mystery and uncertainty about Szeth's reaction to seeing another Surgebinder, to make the later interrogation process all the more interesting.

Noting of course, that I think that's a reason Szeth and Kal won't fight for long.(Although it would be a fantastic way to force Kal to reveal his powers. (On a side note, I'm getting tired of these plots where people keep damning secrets right up until they inevitably come out. Does nobody know how to approach someone with awkward topics?)