CosmereQuestioner Posted October 26, 2016 Report Share Posted October 26, 2016 As I reread WoR I couldn't help but notice the conversation between Shallan and Wit, where he states that he can't teach her, she needs to figure out more on her own to progress, because the shards here are a lot more strict. (Paraphrased). Is the concensus among sharders that this refers to the fact that on roshar the invested must intentionally fulfil oaths and have aligning goals, (some of which must be learned/done at their own pace) as opposed to scadrial where mistborn such as Vin unknowingly burn metals with no intent or knowledge? (I welcome other thoughts and interpretations on this statement by Hoid) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VirtuousTraveller he/him Posted October 26, 2016 Report Share Posted October 26, 2016 I believe there are clearly defined rules between Odium and Honor in their conflict on Roshar. I think part of this involves the Stormfather's explanation to Kaladin that a champion must be appointed to challenge Odium (an oddly specific process for such a god-like power to respect otherwise). The organization of the 10 Heralds and the 10 orders of the Knights Radiant (and their specific powers) speak to this as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1stBondsmith he/him Posted October 26, 2016 Report Share Posted October 26, 2016 To cultivate is not to strew seeds and see what pops up. It is to guide, nurture and develop something specific and intentional. Honor follows sctrictures and guidelines, thus adhering to a code of integrity. Is it any wonder that the magic systems of these two combined would take time to develop, master and exercise all the powers of? I think that would be expected. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenod Posted October 26, 2016 Report Share Posted October 26, 2016 (edited) And odium would perhaps look into Shallan if she suddenly pops up out of nowhere as a fully fledged radiant, and while examining her past he would probably find Hoid, and get mad at him (just stating the obvious). Edited October 26, 2016 by kenod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farnsworth Posted October 26, 2016 Report Share Posted October 26, 2016 Since Odium is so nearby, the shards are probably more defensive even shattered. They would be stricter out of fear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The One Who Connects he/him Posted October 26, 2016 Report Share Posted October 26, 2016 Before this thread, I don't think "the community" really gave that line much cohesive thought, if I can be honest. The variance of responses here seem to support the prior sentence. Yet none of them really seem wrong.. 6 hours ago, CosmereQuestioner said: on roshar the invested must intentionally fulfil oaths and have aligning goals, (some of which must be learned/done at their own pace) as opposed to scadrial where mistborn such as Vin unknowingly burn metals with no intent or knowledge? I like this interpretation. It fits pretty well with how Hoid said it, which may be more important than specifically what he said. (Hoid does that quite a bit, it's unbearable ) 5 hours ago, VirtuousTraveller said: I believe there are clearly defined rules between Odium and Honor in their conflict on Roshar. I considered saying that I think "the champion" thing is separate from this, but upon reread I see what you actually said. 10 Heralds, 10 Orders, Specific Surges per Order, etc... Shardic strictness is made evident in all of the organization and regimenting of things. 5 hours ago, 1stBondsmith said: To cultivate is to guide, nurture and develop something specific and intentional. Honor follows guidelines, thus adhering to a code of integrity. Is it any wonder that the magic systems of these two combined would take time to develop? And hatred is a very easy and direct way to learn patience. Everything takes time on Roshar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VirtuousTraveller he/him Posted October 27, 2016 Report Share Posted October 27, 2016 Quote Three of sixteen ruled, but now the Broken One reigns. I guess all three of the shards ruled together at one point or another - there would have to be strict rules. Preservation and Ruin were bound by rules too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CosmereQuestioner Posted October 28, 2016 Author Report Share Posted October 28, 2016 How i see it is that Preservation and ruin were locked in constant conflict, and would basically never let anything happen due to cancelling each other out with their opposite intents. Honor and Cultivation, however, ruled in harmony til Odium came along. I feel that their "strictness" would be more closely related to Honor's code of ethics, and ensuring that not just anyone could use investiture, unless their goals aligned with his. Ruin and preservation each just needed an edge, and hence made their investiture available to anyone who was broken enough to relieve it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Droughtbringer Posted October 28, 2016 Report Share Posted October 28, 2016 On 10/26/2016 at 11:39 AM, VirtuousTraveller said: I think part of this involves the Stormfather's explanation to Kaladin that a champion must be appointed to challenge Odium (an oddly specific process for such a god-like power to respect otherwise). Can we consider other people champions though? The Elend vs Marsh battle was essentially two champions fighting, Vin (As Preservation) and Ati (as Ruin) were giving their "champions" Strength, increasing their abilities, and turning them into killing machines, so my point is, can we consider these another set of Champions? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savanorn he/him Posted October 28, 2016 Report Share Posted October 28, 2016 On Thursday, October 27, 2016 at 3:40 AM, CosmereQuestioner said: As I reread WoR I couldn't help but notice the conversation between Shallan and Wit, where he states that he can't teach her, she needs to figure out more on her own to progress, because the shards here are a lot more strict. (Paraphrased). Is the concensus among sharders that this refers to the fact that on roshar the invested must intentionally fulfil oaths and have aligning goals, (some of which must be learned/done at their own pace) as opposed to scadrial where mistborn such as Vin unknowingly burn metals with no intent or knowledge? (I welcome other thoughts and interpretations on this statement by Hoid) Your definition is more or less what I took it to mean. TOtC is right though, so far as I know this hasn't been the topic of discussion so there hasn't been a consensus yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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