Navy Seon he/him Posted February 6, 2016 Report Share Posted February 6, 2016 Does being in a speed bubble change your aging or would it stay the same as in outside the bubble? 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaymyth she/her Posted February 6, 2016 Report Share Posted February 6, 2016 I would presume that time passes normally from the individual person's point of view - you're going to age per the amount of time you have personally experienced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navy Seon he/him Posted February 7, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 Do you have support for your claim or are you just guessing. Because i am not so sure. I think wayne would be a loooot older otherwise. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voidus Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 Do you have support for your claim or are you just guessing. Because i am not so sure. I think wayne would be a loooot older otherwise. He doesn't actually spend that much time in speed bubbles though, and Bendalloy is pretty expensive, I'd be surprised if he's spent even close to a year inside one. As for the actual question it's somewhat tricky, I'm inclined to think you would age as normal, everything in a physical sense behaves as normal so it would make sense. But then the cosmere also has some kind of spiritual sense of how old you 'should' be, hence why TLR instantly aged to 1000 when his metalminds were removed. So the question really is could time bubbles alter that? My inclination would be that they do, they already have some ties to the spiritual so it's not at all unreasonable. Short answer: We don't have a definite yes or no but the evidence pretty strongly suggests that you would age as normal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yata he/him Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 (edited) He doesn't actually spend that much time in speed bubbles though, and Bendalloy is pretty expensive, I'd be surprised if he's spent even close to a year inside one. As for the actual question it's somewhat tricky, I'm inclined to think you would age as normal, everything in a physical sense behaves as normal so it would make sense. But then the cosmere also has some kind of spiritual sense of how old you 'should' be, hence why TLR instantly aged to 1000 when his metalminds were removed. So the question really is could time bubbles alter that? My inclination would be that they do, they already have some ties to the spiritual so it's not at all unreasonable. Short answer: We don't have a definite yes or no but the evidence pretty strongly suggests that you would age as normal. Here I am with Voidus, your soul will push to return at the right age. My only doubt is "Does this happen also while you are in the bubble or only when you return in the normal-time" ? Edited February 7, 2016 by Yata Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navy Seon he/him Posted February 7, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 Normally from personal view or external view? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yata he/him Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 (edited) Normally from personal view or external view? External view. Your soul (or Spiritual Aspect) "knows" how old are you (because it has connections to your birthplace and birthdate) and it pushes your physical aspect to align with the "right age". Edited February 7, 2016 by Yata Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navy Seon he/him Posted February 7, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 Thanks 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navy Seon he/him Posted February 7, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 Thats what i suspected. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voidus Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 See I would say the opposite, I brought that up because it could provide a means for time bubbles not to age you but given that we know they work on certain spiritual principles I think altering your spiritual age could be easily within their abilities. Also because there are other, entirely non-magical ways to dilate time and if time bubbles didn't alter your spiritual age then those shouldn't either, so for instance a spaceship travelling at near lightspeed would ordinarily seem to have much slower time than the universe around it, now if someone were inside of one they might travel for what seems to the outside like 100 years but to them is only 1. Now if the spiritual link to your age was based solely on your birthdate then you'd still die from old age during that trip.But it's a pretty moot point, I doubt any Sliders or Pulsers have the resources to dilate time in a significant enough way to actually notice any effect on their aging, it's used sporadically and in short bursts. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yata he/him Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 (edited) But Voidus, If you still getting older at the standard time in or out of a time bubble. You may travel in a ship with "accelerate time" (Bendalloy) and feel 100 years of travel, while actually you are still getting a single year older. Because also if you "lives" 100 years, your Spiritual Aspect knows that you can't be too old (knowing your birthdate) and it keeps you younger (and live). Edited February 7, 2016 by Yata Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaymyth she/her Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 I agree mostly with Voidus - we age based on experienced time. Einsteinian relativity and all that. For most Pulsers/Sliders, it's probably not going to matter that much. But...cadmium burns really slowly. So take a cadmium savant and make him crazy enough to spend a crapton of time in a bubble. You can get some weird aging effects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgedancer he/him Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 Okay, I'm not sure how relevant this is but on the topic of how the spiritual affects your age, atium feruchemy kind of implies that it only fixes you towards becoming as old as you should be but not towards being as young as you should be. I mean, from how Brandon explained the fault in the atium compounding immortality, the reason it doesn't really work is because the more you mess with your age the harder your soul pushes you towards what age you should be and thus you have to spend more and more Investiture. Yet you obviously have to spend no Investiture when aging yourself up to it, as the only reason you're doing it in the first place is to gain the investiture to make yourself younger later on. Meaning that in the worst case scenario, Pulsers shorten their life but Pulsers can't make theirs longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaymyth she/her Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 Okay, I'm not sure how relevant this is but on the topic of how the spiritual affects your age, atium feruchemy kind of implies that it only fixes you towards becoming as old as you should be but not towards being as young as you should be. I mean, from how Brandon explained the fault in the atium compounding immortality, the reason it doesn't really work is because the more you mess with your age the harder your soul pushes you towards what age you should be and thus you have to spend more and more Investiture. Yet you obviously have to spend no Investiture when aging yourself up to it, as the only reason you're doing it in the first place is to gain the investiture to make yourself younger later on. Meaning that in the worst case scenario, Pulsers shorten their life but Pulsers can't make theirs longer. Yeah, but time bubbles are different. You're not just messing with your age using Investiture, you're actually experiencing time at a different rate from the people outside the bubble. I don't see that this should be treated any differently from standard time dilation shenanigans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Navy Seon he/him Posted February 7, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 An important question is if speed bubbles really effect time or just reaction time. Maybe instead of time speeding up, its the contents in the bubble speeding up and not time. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgedancer he/him Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 Yeah, but time bubbles are different. You're not just messing with your age using Investiture, you're actually experiencing time at a different rate from the people outside the bubble. I don't see that this should be treated any differently from standard time dilation shenanigans. Oh yes, I generally agree with you and Voidus, I just thought it's an interesting point to bring up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightGradient Posted February 8, 2016 Report Share Posted February 8, 2016 An important question is if speed bubbles really effect time or just reaction time. Maybe instead of time speeding up, its the contents in the bubble speeding up and not time. Speed bubbles definitely effect time, since bullets and carriages can experience the bubble. Last time I checked, bullets and carriages don't react(in the Physical realm at least) consciously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voidus Posted February 8, 2016 Report Share Posted February 8, 2016 An important question is if speed bubbles really effect time or just reaction time. Maybe instead of time speeding up, its the contents in the bubble speeding up and not time. Since living things don't experience noticeable changes inside a bubble that means things such as chemistry proceed at a proportional rate so it's not just things moving faster. But Voidus, If you still getting older at the standard time in or out of a time bubble. You may travel in a ship with "accelerate time" (Bendalloy) and feel 100 years of travel, while actually you are still getting a single year older. Because also if you "lives" 100 years, your Spiritual Aspect knows that you can't be too old (knowing your birthdate) and it keeps you younger (and live). Not entirely sure what you're trying to say here, English is a little broken. But my point is that if Bendalloys time reference isn't taken into account because your 'spiritual' age is simply the current date minus your birthdate then that wouldn't just apply to Bendalloy it would apply to other relativistic time differences. EDIT: If this is the case however and you age relative to what you would be outside of time bubbles then an immortal with Cadmium and Duralumin could do some pretty serious damage, just Duralumin-burst a Cadmium bubble and instantly age the people nearby a few years, continue til they die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yata he/him Posted February 8, 2016 Report Share Posted February 8, 2016 Not entirely sure what you're trying to say here, English is a little broken. But my point is that if Bendalloys time reference isn't taken into account because your 'spiritual' age is simply the current date minus your birthdate then that wouldn't just apply to Bendalloy it would apply to other relativistic time differences. Sorry I was really tired yesterday My point was (but after a little rest I change my mind): If your soul "knows" your right age only watching your birthdate, you will get old at the same rate inside or outside a Bubble. Therefore during a spacetravel, if a space-ship is inside a mobile Bendalloy-bubble (to move very fast in the space), also if the crew experiences all the relative Bubble-time, they age like if they weren't in a Bubble. For example: they travel for an year (external time) within a bubble with x100 time acceleration. Also if their experience all this 100 years at the end of the journey they are just one year older. This was my idea, and it worked within the Mistborn rules, until I though about other long-live-being in the Cosmere that broke this idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natc Posted February 8, 2016 Report Share Posted February 8, 2016 (edited) The issue being that extreme gravity/velocity naturally causes time dilation and would cause aging shifts matching the person's reference frame instead of just letting spiritual age march onward. If temporal allomancy does directly disrupt the flow of time then aging should match the person's perspective and not the external perspective. Edited February 8, 2016 by natc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voidus Posted February 8, 2016 Report Share Posted February 8, 2016 Sorry I was really tired yesterday My point was (but after a little rest I change my mind): If your soul "knows" your right age only watching your birthdate, you will get old at the same rate inside or outside a Bubble. Therefore during a spacetravel, if a space-ship is inside a mobile Bendalloy-bubble (to move very fast in the space), also if the crew experiences all the relative Bubble-time, they age like if they weren't in a Bubble. For example: they travel for an year (external time) within a bubble with x100 time acceleration. Also if their experience all this 100 years at the end of the journey they are just one year older. This was my idea, and it worked within the Mistborn rules, until I though about other long-live-being in the Cosmere that broke this idea. Right but I'm talking about just any old spaceship, not one that uses Bendalloy, Relativity dictates that time flows differently when travelling at speeds approaching c or around large enough gravity. So they could still experience an effect similar to Bendalloy without actually using Bendalloy, if it were true that your birthdate was the only factor in what your spiritual age is then even relativistic effects like that would be canceled out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParadoxicalZen he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 Question is; do either of the bubbles leave you feeling like jumping to left? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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