Awesomeness Summoned Posted May 12, 2014 Report Share Posted May 12, 2014 I am probably wrong, but I thought the first time Rock saw Syl, it was implied she let him see her cause she liked him. And bit by bit as people got closer to Kal, she started to let others see her. The main distinguishing factor about Rock was that when he saw her, he "recognized" her as something ingrained in his people's traditions/religion. This is what is said right after Rock first indicates he can see Syl: Syl seemed shocked. No, she hadn't appeared to Rock specificallyRock can see her even if she doesn't want him to. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pathfinder Posted May 12, 2014 Report Share Posted May 12, 2014 Ah, it seems my memory likes playing russian roulette regarding accuracy. Win some, lose some lol. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meg Posted May 12, 2014 Report Share Posted May 12, 2014 It's not confirmed. The spren Elhokar sees act differently than the Cryptics around Shallan. Also, note that Elhokar is aware of the spren's presence unlike Shallan who sees Cryptics only in Memory sketches, Taravangian and Jasnah don't see the Crypstics at all. Elhokar's moving shadows are mentioned in WoR prologue and are caused by different type of spren, not Cryptics. The WoR Prologue is about Jasnah, and amongst other things, about her misbehaving shadows and her first visit to Shadesmar. I don't see anything worth to be mentioned about Elkhokar in this Prologue. Rock can see spren. Maybe the same explanation applies to Elhokar. Somehow, he can see them without actually being bound to one. Rock apperantly sees all spren; you think Elhokoar does, too? Why didn't he see Syl, then? I am probably wrong, but I thought the first time Rock saw Syl, it was implied she let him see her cause she liked him. And bit by bit as people got closer to Kal, she started to let others see her. The main distinguishing factor about Rock was that when he saw her, he "recognized" her as something ingrained in his people's traditions/religion. Syl's reaction was told in the former post; you mixed Rock mentioning Syl the first time (to her own surprise) with Syl showing herself to Sigzil in WoR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aleksiel Posted May 12, 2014 Report Share Posted May 12, 2014 The WoR Prologue is about Jasnah, and amongst other things, about her misbehaving shadows and her first visit to Shadesmar. I don't see anything worth to be mentioned about Elkhokar in this Prologue. Elhokar and the spren he sees aren't in the prologue. But the spren Jasnah saw acted a lot like those Elhokar sees, despite the fact that they look more like Cryptics. Jasnah's spren moves around like a shadow, just like the ones Elhokar's described. That was my point, hope it's clearer now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dun Sphere Posted May 16, 2014 Report Share Posted May 16, 2014 Perhaps Elhokar is responsible, or had a part in the death of Dalinar's wife. I cannot recall if her death is ever mentioned in the books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meg Posted May 20, 2014 Report Share Posted May 20, 2014 Aleksiel, on 13 May 2014 - 01:49 AM, said: Elhokar and the spren he sees aren't in the prologue. But the spren Jasnah saw acted a lot like those Elhokar sees, despite the fact that they look more like Cryptics. Jasnah's spren moves around like a shadow, just like the ones Elhokar's described. That was my point, hope it's clearer now I've just finished a reread of TWoK and, though I wouldn't dare to state that it's cryptics around Elhokar, the following passage implies strong similarities: Quote Shallan picked up the charcoal pencil and flipped through to a blank page in her sketchbook. She passed several pictures of the symbol-headed creatures, some set in this very room. They lurked around her, always. At some times, she thought she saw them in the corners of her eyes. At others, she could hear them whispering. She hadn’t dared speak back to them again. TWoK Chapter 64, See of Glass; emphasizes mineThis sounds a lot like Elhokar's description. And it says that Shallan isn't merely drawing the cryptics but also seeing and hearing them, not only on this one day when she had Soulcast. I admit being a bit stubborn . My guess is that those shadows, whispers and "symbolheads" are not only the Shadesmarian manifestation of cryptics but probably of other types of spren, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aleksiel Posted May 20, 2014 Report Share Posted May 20, 2014 I've just finished a reread of TWoK and, though I wouldn't dare to state that it's cryptics around Elhokar, the following passage implies strong similarities: TWoK Chapter 64, See of Glass; emphasizes mine This sounds a lot like Elhokar's description. And it says that Shallan isn't merely drawing the cryptics but also seeing and hearing them, not only on this one day when she had Soulcast. I admit being a bit stubborn . My guess is that those shadows, whispers and "symbolheads" are not only the Shadesmarian manifestation of cryptics but probably of other types of spren, too. I think it could also be a Cryptic and another spren. Unlikely, but possible. I am very curious as to why Elhokar sees them/it. The only reason for seeing a Nahel-bonding spren so far has been either forming a bond or whatever Rock is. We can rule out the latter for Elhokar, so why a spren is bonding with him remains a mystery to me. Not that I don't sympathize with the guy. I wish he finally gets to be a better king, but he doesn't give me a proto-KR impression. He's not dependable, neither resolute, wise, creative, loving or any of the other primary attributes. While he wishes to express such fine qualities, he's a moody, undependable person, who changes his mind too often and too easily. I can't even call him brave or protecting. I got nothing. May be there's another yet unknown explanation to why he sees KR spren. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fifth of Daybreak Posted May 20, 2014 Report Share Posted May 20, 2014 (edited) Paranoia spren. Once you're bad enough to attract them, they only make things worse. Edited May 21, 2014 by EMTrevor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxal Posted May 21, 2014 Report Share Posted May 21, 2014 I think it could also be a Cryptic and another spren. Unlikely, but possible. I am very curious as to why Elhokar sees them/it. The only reason for seeing a Nahel-bonding spren so far has been either forming a bond or whatever Rock is. We can rule out the latter for Elhokar, so why a spren is bonding with him remains a mystery to me. Not that I don't sympathize with the guy. I wish he finally gets to be a better king, but he doesn't give me a proto-KR impression. He's not dependable, neither resolute, wise, creative, loving or any of the other primary attributes. While he wishes to express such fine qualities, he's a moody, undependable person, who changes his mind too often and too easily. I can't even call him brave or protecting. I got nothing. May be there's another yet unknown explanation to why he sees KR spren. That was such a great description of Elhokar and it illustrated brilliantly my uneasiness each time someone mentions he is on the verge to become KR. He just does not fit any description. KR live by their primary attributes and Elhokar lives to impose his will using all possible means. He is petty and childish. I believe he is not seeing KR spren, but another type of spren such as voidspren or evilspren. I also believe someone it trying to take control of him (and/or make him work for their casue) as he is the king of Alethkar and weak minded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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