What happens if a Misting igests a bead of lerasium alloyed with another metal?

[Phantom Monstrosity]

When someone first burns steel they would not be able to use it well enough to levitate

 

Unless they're Vin.

Edited May 8, 2013 by Phantom Monstrosity

[Voidus]

When someone first burns steel they would not be able to use it well enough to levitate. That takes practice. It's possible that you can consciously control they way you use Lerasium to rewrite your Identity however you choose, but that would take practice. If this is correct, the people we have seen were just reflexively burning the metal, like the unconscious Elend reflexively burned pewter to heal his body. The default seems to rewrite your sDNA and link your Identity perfectly to Preservation. But if you knew how, I think you could use a pure bead to become a feruchemist. Now if you mix another metal in, that might add some specific restrictions and limit what parts of Identity get changed.

Cosmere

for that matter, I think if you hade Investiture from all 16 shards and knew how to use Lerasium well enough you could map your Identity with links to all 16 at once!

Could just be a matter of skill but Brandon's quote seems to suggest it's really unlikely anyone would know how to use it properly, I'd think it would be more likely to do something weirdly specific that no one would think of by themselves like burn it then say some specific weird command and that would make you an Awakener, or draw an Aon in it and become an Elantrian.

EDIT: 

Unless they're Vin.

Vin couldn't levitate even by WoA times, except by the same way all Coinshots can do by just pushing to the top of their range.

Edited May 8, 2013 by Voidus

[Phantom Monstrosity]

Could just be a matter of skill but Brandon's quote seems to suggest it's really unlikely anyone would know how to use it properly, I'd think it would be more likely to do something weirdly specific that no one would think of by themselves like burn it then say some specific weird command and that would make you an Awakener, or draw an Aon in it and become an Elantrian.

 

Well, Brandon takes into account IC info limitations for this sort of thing.  See: his response on atium/lerasium alloys

[Voidus]

Well, Brandon takes into account IC info limitations for this sort of thing.  See: his response on atium/lerasium alloys

Yeah, I saw that the other day makes you wonder if TLR ever did anything special with Lerasium since he was a Sliver..

Edited May 8, 2013 by Voidus

[WeiryWriter he/him]

Yeah, I saw that the other day makes you wonder if TLR ever did anything special with Lerasium since he was a Splinter.

 

He wasn't a Splinter.  Splinters have never been human.  He was a Sliver, and became one by taking the power at the Well of Ascension.

[Voidus]

He wasn't a Splinter.  Splinters have never been human.  He was a Sliver, and became one by taking the power at the Well of Ascension.

Ah, cheers that's actually a weird point though, I wonder if that was a slip up from Brandon, most Splinters seem to have relatively little cosmere wide knowledge, since it's the Aons inside of Seons that are Splinters some of them aren't even sentient. Could this have been a typo or something? Seems like Slivers are much more likely to know how something like this works, TLR got detailed knowledge of all three metallic arts at the WoA.

[Phantom Monstrosity]

http://www.theoryland.com/intvmain.php?i=680

zas678

Also, would the Elantrians and the Lerasium-mistings be considered Slivers? Or is just the Lord Ruler and Vin Slivers (Via the Well)? Or do you need more power to be considered a Sliver?

Brandon Sanderson (Goodreads)

Elantrians are not slivers. Mistborn trilogy spoiler warnings follow! The Lord Ruler was indeed a Sliver. So was Vin. For the rest, I would say probably not.

What defines an actual Sliver of Adonalsium is not as clear-cut as you might think. It's a term that in-universe people who study this have applied to various existences and states. Every single person on the world of Scadrial has a bit of Leras in them—a bit of the power of Preservation. Every single person has a bit of Ati in them. There's a certain threshold where these scholars would call you a Sliver of Adonalsium. But I would say that any regular Misting is probably not a Sliver. A full Lerasium Mistborn is getting closer, but people who have held one of the powers are what would probably be termed a Sliver by the definitions. If you hold all the power that makes you a Shard, but the Lord Ruler held a little bit of it and then let it go. From then on they referred to that change in him—the residue, what was left—as a Sliver. When he held it he became the Shard for a short time, and Vin was a Shard for a short time. After Vin gave up the power, what Kelsier is at the end of the trilogy—that's a Sliver of Adonalsium.

 

 

Basically, the Lord Ruler was considered a Shard for a few seconds.  Though, it could just be a 'Brandon not being 100% fixed on terminology yet' thing, where someone with a Splinter was also being called a Splinter, since that quote was fairly old.

Edited May 8, 2013 by Phantom Monstrosity

[Voidus]

http://www.theoryland.com/intvmain.php?i=680

 

 

Basically, the Lord Ruler was considered a Shard for a few seconds.  Though, it could just be a 'Brandon not being 100% fixed on terminology yet' thing, where someone with a Splinter was also being called a Splinter, since that quote was fairly old.

I don't know that Shardpools would be considered Splinters, and the only other people who held Splinters we know of are Returned who didn't demonstrate that big a knowledge of realmatics or anything. So maybe there are Splinters we don't know of yet who know this kind of thing but I'm thinking that this might be a mistake in transcription or something, do we know who wrote up that report?

[Phantom Monstrosity]

The goodreads thing?  That was typed by Brandon.

[WeiryWriter he/him]

I don't know that Shardpools would be considered Splinters, and the only other people who held Splinters we know of are Returned who didn't demonstrate that big a knowledge of realmatics or anything. So maybe there are Splinters we don't know of yet who know this kind of thing but I'm thinking that this might be a mistake in transcription or something, do we know who wrote up that report?

 

Shardpools aren't Splinters, Brandon has said there are no Splinters on Scadrial.  In the link to the lerasium/atium alloy question above I think he meant "Shard or Sliver".  It was also a transcription so it is possible they transcribed the wrong term from memory. 

 

Edit: Oops I didn't see that you also mentioned it could be a transcription error.

Edited May 8, 2013 by WeiryWriter

[Voidus]

The goodreads thing?  That was typed by Brandon.

That's really weird then. I might have to add that to my list of questions to see if it was a mistake.

EDIT: Ah sorry, no I meant the one where we got that Splinters might know how to use Lerasium

Edited May 8, 2013 by Voidus

[kroen]

When someone first burns steel they would not be able to use it well enough to levitate. That takes practice. It's possible that you can consciously control they way you use Lerasium to rewrite your Identity however you choose, but that would take practice. If this is correct, the people we have seen were just reflexively burning the metal, like the unconscious Elend reflexively burned pewter to heal his body. The default seems to rewrite your sDNA and link your Identity perfectly to Preservation. But if you knew how, I think you could use a pure bead to become a feruchemist. Now if you mix another metal in, that might add some specific restrictions and limit what parts of Identity get changed.

Cosmere

for that matter, I think if you hade Investiture from all 16 shards and knew how to use Lerasium well enough you could map your Identity with links to all 16 at once!

I highly doubt a pure bead of lerasium can turn you into a Feruchemist. Lerasium is of Preservation, and Feruchemy is of balance. The only way I could think of would be a bead of 50% lerasium 50% atium.

[Senor Feesh]

I highly doubt a pure bead of lerasium can turn you into a Feruchemist. Lerasium is of Preservation, and Feruchemy is of balance. The only way I could think of would be a bead of 50% lerasium 50% atium.

 

Except I'm fairly sure this has been officially debunked (cookie if anyone can find the quote).

 

I could actually make a case for Feruchemy being more of Preservation than Allomancy is, if not for the fact that we KNOW Allomancy is Preservation's system, as you could say that Feruchemy 'preserves' attributes (nothing is created or lost). Allomancy is arguably a force for change, which is against Preservation's intent.

 

As for how to actually create a full feruchemist, other than selective breeding, I have no idea.

[Isomere]

I highly doubt a pure bead of lerasium can turn you into a Feruchemist. Lerasium is of Preservation, and Feruchemy is of balance.

You could easily be right, the only things we have seen so far is Lerasium helping you use Allomancy. We also know that there are lots of other things that it can do that haven't been seen yet.

The theory is, to use a magic system you need Investiture and Identity both linked to the same Shard. To use Allomancy you need a bit of Preservation inside of you (Investiture) and a spiritual attunement to Preservation (Identity). I think that to use Feruchemy you would need a bit of both Preservation and Ruin, and an attunement to both of them.

Now to jump into how I think Lerasiuim is working, and it is very speculative. We know that everyone on Scadrial already has a bit of both Preservation and Ruin inside of them. But most people don't have the attunement necessary to make use of those shard-bits of Investiture. I'm suggesting the actual power of Lerasium is about changing around which Shards you are attuned to (your Identity), and the potential changes may not be as limited as we assume.

The only way I could think of would be a bead of 50% lerasium 50% atium.

Brandon has said that alloys of Lerasium create Mistings. I think this is because an alloy guides the changes to the particular spot of sDNA related to the second metal. Atium/Lerasium blend would make you an Atium misting? Or let you see the future of your sDNA? Different ratios have different effects? They both annihilate and create a nuclear bomb? So many fun ideas.

On the other hand, if no alloy is present then the only thing guiding the sDNA changes would be the cognitive control of the guy burning Lerasium. There may be some built in limitation, only letting you attune to Preservation. For now I think attunement to Preservation is just the default that occurs if you aren't using cognitive control to get a different result.

[kroen]

Can a Ferring turn Twinborn by ingesting a lerasium/metal alloy? 

[Isomere]

Can a Ferring turn Twinborn by ingesting a lerasium/metal alloy? 

A similar question is what would happen to a Mistborn that takes an alloy.

If the ability to use Feruchemy is on the same spot in your sDNA, seems like you would overwrite the ferring power and become a misting. If the ability is on a different spot, you would get both and become Twinborn. For Mistborn, I could see becoming a Misting, or having one ability become much stronger than the others.

The best answer I have is to use The Lord Ruler as precedent. He did NOT lose his Feruchemy, so my guess is you become a Twinborn.

[kroen]

Oh yeah, forgot about TLR. One could argue, though, that TLR made himself a Mistborn when he ascended. Do we know for sure that he ingested a lerasium bead?

 

Anyway if it indeed doesn't overwrite Feruchemy, I wodner what we would call a Full Feruchemist who can also use one metal Allomantically. Then again we also don't have a name for a Full Feruchemist+Mistborn either.

[Phantom Monstrosity]

HoA, chapter 81 bumper:

The mists of that day created Mistings only, of course—there were no Mistborn until the Lord Ruler made use of the nuggets.