Nightwatcher and Odium

[Blightsong he/him]

On r/StormlightArchive there was a theory that the old magic was voidbinding, in reference to the Parshendi being refered to as "the old people"

This got me thinking on the Nightwatcher and where she would fit into this theory. Could it be that odium could have hijacked the Nightwatcher like he can spren and use her for his agenda. What would this mean for Taravangian? He has taken the role of semi-antagonist and it would be an easy transition in the story for him to become a legitimate villain. What could this implicate for Dalinar? Many things, but it would depend on when Odium theoretically took control of NW.

Just food for thought, if this next book is Dalinar's as Brandon is saying then we will learn much more about the Nightwatcher.

Edited July 8, 2015 by Blightsong

[DreamEternal]

Wyndle considers Lift as blessed by the "mother" of his people, and Lift visited the Nightwatcher, so I think it is pretty clear she is of Cultivation.

Plus, the Listeners being "the old people" means they lived in Roshar before the coming of humanity and the Shards. While they are vulnerable to Odium throught their ease at bonding spren, be they regular or corrupted, they are of Adonalsium, not Odium.

[Blightsong he/him]

Wyndle considers Lift as blessed by the "mother" of his people, and Lift visited the Nightwatcher, so I think it is pretty clear she is of Cultivation.

Plus, the Listeners being "the old people" means they lived in Roshar before the coming of humanity and the Shards. While they are vulnerable to Odium throught their ease at bonding spren, be they regular or corrupted, they are of Adonalsium, not Odium.

Was just putting some thoughts down, I thought it was interesting. I agree that it is almost definitely still of Cultivation, was just a fun concept

[hoser he/him]

The parshendi are also referred to by the Stormfather as the "ancient ones."  By their songs, they seem to predate the coming of Honor and Cultivation.  If the Nightwatcher and the old magic are of Cultivation, then what is the "not old" or "new" magic?  That gives the following as a possible magic timeline:

 

1. Listener spren bonding with highstorms, Aimians doing whatever they do - Adonalsium created these, presumably (the ancient magic).
2. H+C+humanity (and maybe Heralds) arrive
3. The Nightwatcher starts old magicking and the Oathpact is established if it wasn't before.  Odium comes and starts using his Unmade in desolations.  (the order of these things is uncertain, so I lumped them together.  That doesn't mean that they happened at the same time)
4. The spren start bonding with humans to make Surgebinders (the new magic?)
5. Odium makes spren to bond with the Listeners and uses them in Desolations (voidbringers)
6. Ishar imposes ideals on the Surgebinders and spren, turning them into Knights (or is this the new magic?)
7. Some listeners debond, becoming Parshmen. 
8. The Knights quit at the Recreance
9. The new Knights arise as the listeners give themselves again to Odium and invoke the Everstorm.
10. Listeners start bonding with the Nahel Bond spren (hinted at in the listener songs.  A prophecy?)

Edit: reversed 4. and 5. as Kelek's Breath suggested. 

Edited July 9, 2015 by hoser

[Kelek's Breath he/him]

@hoser, I think #4 and 5 need to be reversed, as far as we know from the books, as the Listeners went to Odium after the betrayal of the spren (as per their songs).

 

As for the Nightwatcher, she has lost interest in humanity due to Honor's death, but I think the spren would know if Odium is influencing. Both Syl and Pattern react badly to the mention of Odium.

[hoser he/him]

@hoser, I think #4 and 5 need to be reversed, as far as we know from the books, as the Listeners went to Odium after the betrayal of the spren (as per their songs).

 

As for the Nightwatcher, she has lost interest in humanity due to Honor's death, but I think the spren would know if Odium is influencing. Both Syl and Pattern react badly to the mention of Odium.

Thanks, good catch!

[Witborn]

(Long time lurker, first time poster)

 

I think that's a good order considering what we've seen/learned so far. I actually think 7 and 8 happened at the same time. According to Eshonai's mother in an interlude, the Last Legion abandoned their spren:

 

 

"Long are the days since we knew the dark home," Mother sang softly to one of the Rhythms of Remembrance. "The Last Legion, that was our name then. Warriors who had been set to fight in the farthest plains, this place had once been a nation and was now rubble. Dead was the freedom of most people. The forms, unknown, were forced upon us. Forms of power, yes, but also forms of obedience."

...
"The day of the storm when the Last Legion fled,' Mother continued in son. "Difficultwas the path chosen. Warriors, touched by the gods, our only choice to seek dullness of mind. A crippling that brought freedom."

 

The" place that had once been a nation and was now rubble" sounds like the Shattered Plains and they moved from that place to abandon their spren (maybe near the area of Feverstone keep?). It really makes me wonder if the actions of the Last Legion and the Recreance happened at the same time, though I have no proof of that at all.