callumke Posted February 16, 2013 Report Share Posted February 16, 2013 I think there are 1114111 allomantic metals. One million, one hundred and fourteen thousand, one hundred and eleven. Before you all call me crazy, let me explain my reasoning, We know that there are More than sixteen and less than infinite allomantic metals, from a 17th shard Q&A in 2010.When I asked Brandon if there were 50 metals, 16 base, 16 lerasium alloys, 16 atium alloys plus lerasium and atium themselves, he indicated I was on the right lines, but asked did Harmony have a metal. I guessed this might be an alloy of atium and lerasium. Today my breakthrough thought was "why does Ruin have a metal?" Ruin is a Shard, but not on associated with Allomancy. Therefore, I thought "Maybe there are more god metals." 16 god metals in fact. What about god alloys, like Harmony's metal? Well, this is where the maths comes in. If there are 16 metals, the combination of Alloys of those metals are (16!)/(2!*(16-2)!), which is 120. But what about further alloys? I am guessing that you could alloy three God metals, and there would be 560. Taking this to its conclusion, there could be an Alloy of all 16 metals. An Adonalsium alloy, perhaps. And what if, for each of these Alloys, there are 16 more Alloys combining that God Alloy with the 16 base metals. There could be 16 more Alloys of the Adonalsium alloy, perhaps, each associated with iron, steel, pewter, tin etc. http://goo.gl/jaj4y This is a link to a spreadsheet that calculates all these combinations, and gives the total number of Metals as 1114111. Admittedly, there are a few issues. One is the number of assumptions I have worked on, Second is that 1114111 isn't itself a multiple of 16. It is actually prime, which I think is cool. Any thoughts? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senor Feesh Posted February 16, 2013 Report Share Posted February 16, 2013 That is... a lot of math O.o I'm not sure, but I seem to recall there being another quote somewhere in the database stating that the number was in the region of 50... if anyone can find the quote that'd be awesome, otherwise I might be getting confused with other people's theories on the number of metals. As for the number of God-metals - whilst it's possible that all the Shards may have (or be able to manifest) God-metals of their own, I'm going to speculate that there aren't any. The reason for this is simply that Ati and Leras created human life on Scadrial. They took the time to mess with the planet's natural development. To the best of our knowledge, no other Shard is confirmed to have tinkered on Scadrial, so I would suggest that ONLY Ruin and Preservation have Invested (note the capital!) Scadrial with their own magics, so these would be the only Shards with God-metals. Does Harmony have a God metal? I would say speculating against the same logic (bearing in mind I have pretty much nothing but gut-feeling to back this up, it's not very scientific ) that it's possible. As the holder of both Ruin and Preservation, he could create a God-metal containing both types of Investiture that exist already on Scadrial. WARNING! WARNING! SOMEONE WHO HAS SPENT VERY LITTLE TIME THINKING ABOUT REALMATICS IS ABOUT TO ATTEMPT THEORYCRAFTING! So, going on from my previous points, my brain has decided to start working on the problem even as I type, so this might become very stream of consciousness. Sorry if it's messy. Why can Allomancers burn the Physical form of Ruin? I posit that it's because humans on Scadrial are Invested with both the power of Preservation and Ruin. Ruin exists already in their Spiritweb, which allows them, through the magic system granted by Preservation, to access both parts of the Shardic Investiture inherent in their beings. A weird thought that cascades from this line of speculation is that if a Scadralian were able to directly access the power of Ruin (as opposed to Hemalaurgy, which seems to simply (simply? since when is such highly specialised knowledge classed as simple?) be a matter of stealing the Investiture of others, then they should also, through the same system (whatever form that might take), be able to access the power of Preservation. Ugh, this seems really unlikely in retrospect (we already have a lot of info suggesting, if not outright confirming, that Hemalurgy IS Ruin's magic system - it's destructive, end-negative, Ruin has knowledge of all the Bindpoints etc.) that I don't think this really has any legs. And as we know Hemalurgy CAN be used to interact with other forms of Investiture, it seems that Allomancy (and all the other magic systems) should have the same potential for interaction on some level. I guess what I'm saying here, in a roundabout fashion, is I have no clue but it does seem likely that even if there are no God-metals from other Shards, then at least Allomancers should be able to interact with other sources of Investiture somehow. Blergh. Bad post is bad. *hangs head in shame* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oudeis Posted March 8, 2013 Report Share Posted March 8, 2013 Blergh. Bad post is bad. *hangs head in shame* I disagree with your self-assesment. I like your post. It gives me a lot to think about. If your definition of a "good post" is, this provides you with all the information you could possibly need and is complete unto itself and has no room for interaction, then it was a bad post. But my definition is, a post that gets people thinking, that suggests things, that brainstorms even if all the science isn't there yet, and by that definition your post is great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krelian Posted March 8, 2013 Report Share Posted March 8, 2013 Ugh, this seems really unlikely in retrospect (we already have a lot of info suggesting, if not outright confirming, that Hemalurgy IS Ruin's magic system - it's destructive, end-negative, Ruin has knowledge of all the Bindpoints etc.) that I don't think this really has any legs. And as we know Hemalurgy CAN be used to interact with other forms of Investiture, it seems that Allomancy (and all the other magic systems) should have the same potential for interaction on some level. I guess what I'm saying here, in a roundabout fashion, is I have no clue :P/> but it does seem likely that even if there are no God-metals from other Shards, then at least Allomancers should be able to interact with other sources of Investiture somehow. Blergh. Bad post is bad. *hangs head in shame* I think if anything, it's the opposite. Anyone in the Cosmere can access Allomancy and Hemalurgy. A bead of Lerasium, or knowledge of spike points, is all that's needed. So yeah, Allomancy/[other form of Investiture] combinations are more likely than other pairings, but the Allomancy would be the added power, not the original one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millennium Posted March 8, 2013 Report Share Posted March 8, 2013 I don't think there are quite that many, but didn't Brandon once say that there were somewhere around 50? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tecslicer Posted March 8, 2013 Report Share Posted March 8, 2013 A few WOB that I have found to help this discution. http://www.theoryland.com/intvmain.php?i=718 (Question 2) FIRE ARCADIAAre there 50 Allomantic Metals? BRANDON SANDERSON Nearly. Does Harmony have a metal? FIRE ARCADIA Is that an alloy of Lerasium and Atium? BRANDON SANDERSON You're along the right lines. A few others pertaining to who can use hemalurgy. INTERVIEW: Aug 31st, 2011 Reddit AMA (Verbatim) INSERTCLEVERPHRASE () I know from reading your blog and various other comments that many of your books are in the same cosmos/universe, specifically Mistborn, Elantris, Warbreaker, and Way of Kings. I also am pretty sure that one day you'd like to do a series that ties all the different series/books together into one super-series. So my question is, would the various magic systems work on different worlds? For example, would a Mistborn be able to use his/her abilities in the world Way of Kings is located on? BRANDON SANDERSON It depends on the magic system. They are all related to a kind of "Spiritual DNA" that one gets from their heritage on a specific planet. However, there are ways around that. (Hemalurgy, for example, 'staples' a piece of someone else's soul to your own, and creates a work around to give you access to magic you shouldn't have.) Some of the magics are more regionally tied than others. (In Elantris, you have to access the Dor, which is very regionally influenced.) The end answer is this: With in-depth knowledge of how the magics work, and their connection, one could probably get them all to work on other planets. It may take effort for some of them. TAGS brandon on writing, elantris, mistborn, stormlight archive, 2 INTERVIEW: Feb 12th, 2013 AMOL Signing Report - Moose (Paraphrased) MOOSE Has Hemalurgy been used on another planet besides Scadrial? BRANDON SANDERSON Yes it has. Brandon did not want to give out any more details about who was getting spiked or if the spiking was successful. TAGS hemalurgy, scadrial, mistborn, metallic arts, cosmere, 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Monstrosity Posted March 9, 2013 Report Share Posted March 9, 2013 I asked at a recent signing if someone who isn't from Scandrial could use Hemalurgy. I got a RAFO for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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