Two Feruchemy questions

[Oudeis]

Storing in a duraluminmind reduces your connection to those around you; anyone seeing you is less likely to notice you. Obviously, this is useful if you're gonna be a spy or thief. "What was that sound?" "I'm having trouble caring. Prolly no one."

But, the problem is, motivations frequently, somewhere down the line, come down to a person. If you're stealing something for sheer personal greed, you're good. If you're assassinating a cruel dictator for the good of la revolucion, what happens when you lose your connections and suddenly no longer care about Miranda, the fiery rebel organizer, or even when you just stop caring about the evil tyrant, because hate is just another social connection? Is there any sort of trick people can think of (not specific situations, but a general trick that most people could use) to keep yourself focused and motivated when you're putting your own ability to care about people in a box?

Second. Tapping pewter makes your muscles physically much larger. This, obviously, makes you weigh more. Can you store this additional weight in an ironmind?

EDIT:

Another. Can you tap a zincmind as defense against emotional Allomancy? Not from a perspective of, using logic to override passion, but from a perspective of, if your mind is literally moving at a different speed, emotions being induced from outside might be more obvious for being actually slower.

Edited January 21, 2013 by Windrunner
Please don't double post. Thanks! :)

[Abevan]

For your second question, storing weight is more storing gravities effect on your mass. I believe going around at half weight would store the same amount regardless of how much you weighed at the time,

[Eric]

I don't think that follows, Abevan. Even if it stores gravity's effect on your mass, tapping pewter increases that mass, causing gravity to have a greater effect. Storing half of that greater effect should be more than storing half of your regular mass. (And since storing weight is far more likely from a physics perspective to actually affect mass instead of proximity, this is kind of a moot point regardless.)

As for the OP's first question: selfish motivations remain. Is she hot? Is he a douche? Shouldn't you be in charge? That hat would look great on you! Just remember to manufacture a purely selfish goal for your sociopath self and you'll be fine.

The zincmind idea is certainly plausible, and the reverse sounds just as reasonable: being literally slow-witted seems like it would be harder for you to resist 'sudden' emotional bursts.

[Voidus]

You could always just get a Rioter to rile you up, I've usually thought about doing the opposite though, Tapping heaps of connection and just walking past any guards who'd probably just ask if you need help killing the target and getting a Soother to Soothe away all the attachment you feel towards them.

[Oudeis]

Tapping heaps of connection and just walking past any guards who'd probably just ask if you need help killing the target

I've never been under the impression that it's a matter of, "you make people have a positive impression." I think it just increases or decreases the degree of that connection. If this guard's natural reaction to a stranger walking up is suspicion, and you walk up tapping duralumin, it's not going to make him suddenly love you. It's going to make his suspicion full-blown paranoia.

I could be mistaken; I don't think it's mentioned specifically in the books. Does anyone know if Sanderson has talked about it to fans?

[Voidus]

It's from the MAG so it's not absolutely guaranteed but it's the only source we have on it.

Tapping connection, on the other hand, makes the character more empathetic and connected to those around him, and increases the trust and authority others place in him.

[Eric]

Which, idealistically, means there should be no cruel dictator. You store it like Wax, 15% for like ten years, then walk in, turn on the charm, and talk through his problems and the solutions the Resistance is looking for and walk away without shedding blood.

[Phantom Monstrosity]

For your second question, storing weight is more storing gravities effect on your mass. I believe going around at half weight would store the same amount regardless of how much you weighed at the time,

Not exactly. If it stored gravity's effect, you'd fall faster when tapping weight - that is something that Wax explicitly says doesn't happen.

[cleric]

the way Wax talks storing weight is % based not pound based. storing 50% of your weight at 500 Lbs would return 50% weight gain at 200 Lbs

[Voidus]

the way Wax talks storing weight is % based not pound based. storing 50% of your weight at 500 Lbs would return 50% weight gain at 200 Lbs

That'd give increasing returns though, if it was percentage based then you could multiply it's effects. eg. tap 100% weight so you're 2x as heavy then tap another 100% so you'd be 4x as heavy instead of 200% I think that that's just the easiest way to talk about storage, he's not going to suddenly undergo changes in weight so it's a reasonably accurate standard and easier than working out how much that percentage of your weight actually is.

[cleric]

you also have to remember that the physical world is just 1/3rd of where the magic comes from in brandons works. so the weight transfer will also be tied to those. It could take into account your natural state, so even when oversized you are only storing the % based on your natural weight.

[Djando Je]

@phantom

Storing weight does effect the speed at which you fall. I've just been reading in WoA where Sazed stores weight in his metalminds so that he doesn't fall as fast.

[Eric]

That's a function of wind resistance. He hits terminal velocity sooner, but his acceleration (the rate at which he falls until reaching terminal velocity) remains tied to the gravitational force of the planet. He falls just as quickly, but his fall doesn't accelerate as long. It's a fine distinction, granted, but relevant to some things.

Edited January 25, 2013 by Eric

[Nepene]

That's a function of wind resistance. He hits terminal velocity sooner, but his acceleration (the rate at which he falls until reaching terminal velocity) remains tied to the gravitational force of the planet. He falls just as quickly, but his fall doesn't accelerate as long. It's a fine distinction, granted, but relevant to some things.

He doesn't fall as quickly. When air resistance becomes significant it starts to overwhelm gravitation acceleration. He is still tied to the planet's gravity as you say, but he falls slower and accelerates for longer due to air resistance counteracting the force of gravity.

[Oudeis]

the way Wax talks storing weight is % based not pound based. storing 50% of your weight at 500 Lbs would return 50% weight gain at 200 Lbs

I think that that's just the easiest way to talk about storage, he's not going to suddenly undergo changes in weight.

I agree with Voidus here; it's possible that you can't store the extra weight from pewter, but Wax talking about the percentages of his own weight is very possibly just because his natural weight is NOT going to vastly change any time soon, so for him it's a constant.

[Voidus]

I agree with Voidus here; it's possible that you can't store the extra weight from pewter, but Wax talking about the percentages of his own weight is very possibly just because his natural weight is NOT going to vastly change any time soon, so for him it's a constant.

Not to mention it goes against feruchemy being end-neutral, you get out what you put it, so the amount of weight you store can't be suddenly increased just because you've been hitting the gym or pigging out

[Eric]

He doesn't fall as quickly. When air resistance becomes significant it starts to overwhelm gravitation acceleration. He is still tied to the planet's gravity as you say, but he falls slower and accelerates for longer due to air resistance counteracting the force of gravity.

His acceleration is equal to the force of gravity, which is what I meant by "falls just as quickly". However, air resistance overcomes it faster and causes him to stop accelerating sooner, resulting in a lower terminal velocity.

[Nepene]

His acceleration is equal to the force of gravity, which is what I meant by "falls just as quickly". However, air resistance overcomes it faster and causes him to stop accelerating sooner, resulting in a lower terminal velocity.

No, that's incorrect. His acceleration is equal to the sum of gravity and air resistance. While he is not tapping iron he might fall at 9.8 m/s/s but while he taps it air resistance might make him accelerate at only 1 m/s/s. He won't fall just as quickly. He might fall like a feather, swinging slowly from air current to air current. I am sure you have seen feathers. They do not fall just as quickly as a pen you dropped because air resistance is a major factor in their acceleration. They don't accelerate as fast.

Air resistance is weaker as he is moving more slowly though he will reach his terminal velocity faster I believe, as you say.

[Eric]

No, that's incorrect. His acceleration is equal to the sum of gravity and air resistance.

Both should be positive values, so that should be the difference, not sum.

While he is not tapping iron he might fall at 9.8 m/s/s but while he taps it air resistance might make him accelerate at only 1 m/s/s.

I'm with you so far (though you meant stores, not taps).

He won't fall just as quickly.

Initial acceleration is 9.8 m/s/s. That is what I meant, and failed to sufficiently clarify, in my last response. My apologies.

He might fall like a feather, swinging slowly from air current to air current. I am sure you have seen feathers. They do not fall just as quickly as a pen you dropped because air resistance is a major factor in their acceleration. They don't accelerate as fast.

Not over periods of time, no. The feather has a much lower terminal velocity. But in the instant that they are dropped, yes, they do.

Air resistance is weaker as he is moving more slowly though he will reach his terminal velocity faster I believe, as you say.

Drag/air resistance will actually have a greater effect as his body has a greater surface area-to-mass* ratio than normal. That's what causes him to reach terminal velocity sooner, and therefore have a slower terminal velocity.

* - Even if storing weight doesn't store mass on some level, it at the very least duplicates the effects of having less mass to a reasonable degree.

Edited January 26, 2013 by Eric

[Nepene]

Both should be positive values, so that should be the difference, not sum.

I'm with you so far (though you meant stores, not taps).

Initial acceleration is 9.8 m/s/s. That is what I meant, and failed to sufficiently clarify, in my last response. My apologies.

Indeed I did.

I suppose hypothetically in a still air chamber that would be so for a fraction of a second but in the real world wind and air flow would be a significant factor in your movement, if you really wanna be exact. His initial acceleration is uncertain given how easy he is to influence when he is storing most of his weight.

Not over periods of time, no. The feather has a much lower terminal velocity. But in the instant that they are dropped, yes, they do.

Assuming wind doesn't exist, yes.

Drag/air resistance will actually have a greater effect as his body has a greater surface area-to-mass* ratio than normal. That's what causes him to reach terminal velocity sooner, and therefore have a slower terminal velocity.

Ah yes, we were talking about different things, me about absolute air resistance, you about the relative effect. I don't think we disagree on this.

[Eric]

Yup, we're on the same page now. I really was ignoring wind and other air currents, which I didn't realize was what you were getting at there. My bad on that score.