Hoid's goal is...

[Lightflame]

Ah Hoid, the elusive figure who has shown up at many times and places around the Cosmere. While his motive is unclear, Brandon claims that there is plenty of evidence in the story for us to find. So I found one.

I believe that Hoid's goal is the recreation of Adonalsium.

There are several bits of proof for this. In The Way of Kings, Hoid namedrops him and says something like, "I wonder, if you split a man into his different emotions, then stuck him back together, would he still be the same?" (I'm not sure of the exact quote.) Note where I emphasized. Hoid specifically mentions putting Adonalsium back together. Brandon is no stranger to hiding things by having characters explicitly state them (Denth anyone?). Hoid's words would make sense if he was explaining his plans, and he might be based on the context of his conversation with Dalinar. Alas, I forget when it happened, but that scene was so notable that someone most likely has a quote of which page it was on.

As well, in the original ending of The Well of Ascension, Hoid's footsteps led Vin to the well. Why would he want Ruin released? Because you can't reform Adonalsium with a Shard captive.

Also, Hoid is hanging around Elantris during the book named after the city. Since it was around the time when Elantris was broken, Hoid would probably want it fixed. With that goal done, he would probably be able to find a way to get the splinters turned back into a Shard.

In Warbreaker, Hoid is a storyteller, and he hangs around a city filled with Slivers.

Actually, Hoid's cameos all have something in common. His appearance in Elantris and The Stormlight is in a place where Splinters are found. In Mistborn, he's in a city where a Shard is held captive. In Warbreaker, he's in a city filled with Slivers. The only time he hasn't had a cameo is in The Alloy of Law. What's different about that book? All Shards are complete, and at their full power. They don't need to be fixed. Therefore, his presence is no longer required.

As well, when talking with Kaladin, he mentions that he went to Roshar to meet an old friend, but he usually avoids them nowadays. This "old friend" could be Odium, and he could be there to stop him. Odium is messing around with the Shards, so for someone who seeks put them all back together, he would be the number one enemy. It makes sense that Hoid is most active on Roshar, because he needs to stop Odium if his goal is to be completed.

If he indeed wrote The Letter, then his conflict with the Seventeenth Shard person would make sense. Reviving Adonalsium would change the Cosmere on a massive scale, and could potentially end world-hopping (if Shards make it possible). As such, the Seventeenth Shard would be inclined to stop him.

As for the why, I have some reasons. Hoid was there when Adonalsium broke, so he might have actually been the one to break Adonalsium. If this gave him his abilities or consciousness, then the "stealing himself" that he mentioned to Kaladin could have happened because Hoid broken Adonalsium. If this is so, then recreating Adonalsium would be a form of atonement. Alternately, Hoid is the remnants of Adonalsium, and he wants to become complete (immortal worldhopper who isn't a Shardholder or part of the Seventeenth Shard?). If so, "stealing himself" would mean the consciousness he gained from being broken. However it happened, it's a valid guess.

Discuss.

[johns]

Good theory. The only thing that needs to be added is that Hoid is in Alloy of Law, he's just not named. He's the beggar in black at the wedding in chapter 5. His appearance is so minor though that I'm not sure if it can be used to support/disprove your theory.

[Rubix]

I can say definitively (per Brandon) that in Alloy of Law, Hoid was there just to give his congratulations to his friends.

[Cheese Ninja]

I too believe that Hoid plans to reconstruct Adonalsium. I'm not sure if he's planning to use a new base or if the original is still somehow usable. For some reason I don't think he's going to use himself as the base, but there's no way to be sure. I'm also not sure which bits of Shards he has collected besides Atium and Lerasium, maybe a few thousand Breaths as well? He probably picked up those glowy spheres in Elantris (aons and seons?). We know from Compounding that it is possible to get more out of the magic system than normal if you cheat it. He justs needs to understand Realmatic Theory better than we do to do it on a much larger scale.

[Aeshdan]

I too believe that Hoid plans to reconstruct Adonalsium. I'm not sure if he's planning to use a new base or if the original is still somehow usable. For some reason I don't think he's going to use himself as the base, but there's no way to be sure. I'm also not sure which bits of Shards he has collected besides Atium and Lerasium, maybe a few thousand Breaths as well? He probably picked up those glowy spheres in Elantris (aons and seons?). We know from Compounding that it is possible to get more out of the magic system than normal if you cheat it. He justs needs to understand Realmatic Theory better than we do to do it on a much larger scale.

I'm guessing he's got the original base. I think that's the "element" he spoke of in The Letter.

[Cheese Ninja]

I'm guessing he's got the original base. I think that's the "element" he spoke of in The Letter.

Not a bad theory.

Let me first assure you that the element is quite safe. I have found a good home for it. I protect its safety like I protect my own skin, you might say.

Well now I feel like I should rethink my whole "he's not going to use himself as the base" thing. "My own skin" sounds like a not very subtle way of saying that he took it into himself. Maybe he can extract it later?

[Commander Spoonface]

I believe that Hoid's goal is the recreation of Adonalsium.

I have seen many posts about this being Hoid's goal (more than any other theory about his goals), but yours is definately the most well-constructed one I've seen.

In The Way of Kings, Hoid namedrops him and says something like, "I wonder, if you split a man into his different emotions, then stuck him back together, would he still be the same?"

Words can not express how awesome this is.

[Cheese Ninja]

I should probably address the first post directly, for clarifications, corrections, and differences of opinion.

Ah Hoid, the elusive figure who has shown up at many times and places around the Cosmere. While his motive is unclear, Brandon claims that there is plenty of evidence in the story for us to find. So I found one.

I believe that Hoid's goal is the recreation of Adonalsium.

There are several bits of proof for this. In The Way of Kings, Hoid namedrops him and says something like, "I wonder, if you split a man into his different emotions, then stuck him back together, would he still be the same?" (I'm not sure of the exact quote.) Note where I emphasized. Hoid specifically mentions putting Adonalsium back together. Brandon is no stranger to hiding things by having characters explicitly state them (Denth anyone?). Hoid's words would make sense if he was explaining his plans, and he might be based on the context of his conversation with Dalinar. Alas, I forget when it happened, but that scene was so notable that someone most likely has a quote of which page it was on.

“I know,” Wit said, then looked directly at him. “Adonalsium.”

Dalinar frowned more deeply. “What?”

Wit searched his face. “Have you ever heard the term, Dalinar?”

“Ado…what?”

“Nothing,” Wit said. He seemed preoccupied, unlike his usual self. “Nonsense. Balderdash. Figgldygrak. Isn’t it odd that gibberish words are often the sounds of other words, cut up and dismembered, then stitched into something like them—yet wholly unlike them at the same time?”

Dalinar frowned.

“I wonder if you could do that to a man. Pull him apart, emotion by emotion, bit by bit, bloody chunk by bloody chunk. Then combine them back together into something else, like a Dysian Aimian. If you do put a man together like that, Dalinar, be sure to name him Gibberish, after me. Or perhaps Gibletish.”

“Is that your name, then? Your real name?”

“No, my friend,” Wit said, standing up. “I’ve abandoned my real name. But when next we meet, I’ll think of a clever one for you to call me. Until then, Wit will suffice—or if you must, you may call me Hoid. Watch yourself; Sadeas is planning a revelation at the feast tonight, though I know not what it is. Farewell. I’m sorry I didn’t insult you more.”

There you go. Name of the chapter is "Gibletish".

As well, in the original ending of The Well of Ascension, Hoid's footsteps led Vin to the well. Why would he want Ruin released? Because you can't reform Adonalsium with a Shard captive.

Actually, She followed the mist spirit to find a bead of Lerasium in his bootprint, she didn't follow his footprints to the Well. I don't think he needed Ruin to be released to reform Adonalsium. But it still might have been his goal because he foresaw the formation of Harmony, a being in much better shape to protect itself from Odium than simply Ruin or Preservation.

http://www.brandonsanderson.com/library/39/Mistborn-2-Alternate-Ending-Part-Two

It leaned over. Vin knelt, feeling where it gestured. There, in the frost, she thought she made out the distinct impression of a footprint. But that was impossible. Did the Spirit make it? She wondered. But that was the print of a boot.

She glanced at it, feeling around. Her fingers brushed something. A piece of ceramic, but one that wasn't broken. She picked it up, standing; it looked like a disk, and was set at the very center with what appeared to be a tiny nugget of metal.

Hoid used Shadesmar to sneak into there while no one was looking, which is a pretty awesome trick for him. He can teleport himself around a world, to some degree.

Also, Hoid is hanging around Elantris during the book named after the city. Since it was around the time when Elantris was broken, Hoid would probably want it fixed. With that goal done, he would probably be able to find a way to get the splinters turned back into a Shard.

In Warbreaker, Hoid is a storyteller, and he hangs around a city filled with Slivers.

Actually, Hoid's cameos all have something in common. His appearance in Elantris and The Stormlight is in a place where Splinters are found. In Mistborn, he's in a city where a Shard is held captive. In Warbreaker, he's in a city filled with Slivers. The only time he hasn't had a cameo is in The Alloy of Law. What's different about that book? All Shards are complete, and at their full power. They don't need to be fixed. Therefore, his presence is no longer required.

I argue that we've never seen Shards at their full power, they're all Invested in something or other, and in Elantris's case even Splintered, after Odium had killed the Shardholders. Also, as has already been pointed out, Hoid had a very small cameo at the wedding in AoL.

As well, when talking with Kaladin, he mentions that he went to Roshar to meet an old friend, but he usually avoids them nowadays. This "old friend" could be Odium, and he could be there to stop him. Odium is messing around with the Shards, so for someone who seeks put them all back together, he would be the number one enemy. It makes sense that Hoid is most active on Roshar, because he needs to stop Odium if his goal is to be completed.

If he indeed wrote The Letter, then his conflict with the Seventeenth Shard person would make sense. Reviving Adonalsium would change the Cosmere on a massive scale, and could potentially end world-hopping (if Shards make it possible). As such, the Seventeenth Shard would be inclined to stop him.

As for the why, I have some reasons. Hoid was there when Adonalsium broke, so he might have actually been the one to break Adonalsium. If this gave him his abilities or consciousness, then the "stealing himself" that he mentioned to Kaladin could have happened because Hoid broken Adonalsium. If this is so, then recreating Adonalsium would be a form of atonement. Alternately, Hoid is the remnants of Adonalsium, and he wants to become complete (immortal worldhopper who isn't a Shardholder or part of the Seventeenth Shard?). If so, "stealing himself" would mean the consciousness he gained from being broken. However it happened, it's a valid guess.

Discuss.

“I’ve many.” The man shook Kaladin’s hand. “I began life as a thought, a concept, words on a page. That was another thing I stole. Myself. Another time, I was named for a rock.”

“A pretty one, I hope.”

“A beautiful one,” the man said. “And one that became completely worthless for my wearing it.”

“Well, what do men call you now?”

“Many a thing, and only some of them polite. Almost all are true, unfortunately. You, however, you may call me Hoid.”

“Your name?”

“No. The name of someone I should have loved. Once again, this is a thing I stole. It is something we thieves do.” He glanced eastward, over the rapidly darkening Plains. The little fire burning beside Hoid’s boulder shed a fugitive light, red from glimmering coals.

“People see in stories what they’re looking for, my young friend.” He reached behind his boulder, pulling out a pack and slinging it on his shoulder. “I have no answers for you. Most days, I feel I never have had any answers. I’ve come to your land to chase an old acquaintance, but I end up spending most of my time hiding from him instead.”

There's your other relevant quote, with Hoid being particularly vague. I really don't know how we're supposed to interpret those first few sentences("I began life..."), but my theory for the "I was named for a rock." is that he was a Shardholder at some point, and then gave it up. (rock=Shard) I agree the "old acquaintance" is probably Odium. He needs at least a decent sized chunk of Odium for his plans, and so he needs to find something that Odium has Invested, which is difficult, because that's not something Odium likes to do in the first place. And that whole conflict between them that was mentioned in the Letter is another part of it. I wonder if that black sphere that Gavilar had and passed onto Szeth contains Invested Odium?

[Swifftalon]

If, by Alloy of Law, Hoid had reunited all the shards of Adonalsium, every world in the cosmere would be drastically different. The biggest change? Every magic (allomancy, breath, stormrunning, etc.) Would disappear unless Adonalsium was on the right world. The magic only works because of the shard that's present. We know Hoid does a fair bit of world-hopping, but Brandon has hinted that said hopping takes more time than you might expect. He's also said that he plans to do 3 trilogies in the world of Mistborn: the series we already have, a series in modern times, and a series in space. Given that, I doubt Hoid gained the Shard between Hero of Ages and Alloy of Law.

[Cheese Ninja]

If, by Alloy of Law, Hoid had reunited all the shards of Adonalsium, every world in the cosmere would be drastically different. The biggest change? Every magic (allomancy, breath, stormrunning, etc.) Would disappear unless Adonalsium was on the right world. The magic only works because of the shard that's present. We know Hoid does a fair bit of world-hopping, but Brandon has hinted that said hopping takes more time than you might expect. He's also said that he plans to do 3 trilogies in the world of Mistborn: the series we already have, a series in modern times, and a series in space. Given that, I doubt Hoid gained the Shard between Hero of Ages and Alloy of Law.

Lightflame isn't saying that Adonalsium is reconstructed in Alloy of Law. He's simply saying that the reason we didn't see Hoid in AoL was because there were no Slivers/Splinters for him to collect there. Which is incorrect because Hoid does show up very briefly at the wedding.

And we really aren't sure what would happen to the magic systems if Adonalsium is reconstructed. It may steal back all the Invested Sharditude, it may not. If magic can be used outside of the world it originates on, it's possible that magic systems will function even if the Shard moves away.

[Dros]

Wow. You know what, I have resisted this theory in the past, but now that I think about it, Brandon has said that Odium is not interested in picking up multiple Shards like Sazed because he likes being what he is, Intent on hating, and picking up another Shard would change that. Being reunited with all the Shards to reform Andolasium would definitely change his Intent. Perhaps Hoid is trying to put Andolasium back together and Odium is reisting him and going around splintering Shards to slow Hoid down even more.

Edited August 17, 2012 by Droz

[Turos]

I'm guessing he's got the original base. I think that's the "element" he spoke of in The Letter.

What if he is the original base? Shooting out there, maybe his abilities are unique to a '17th shard' of Adonalsium.

Another note: what powers did humans have where Adonalsium came from before it shattered? Or did they have any?

Edited August 19, 2012 by Turos

[Leuthie]

I always suspected that Hoid's purpose in mentioning it was trying to see if Dalinar learned about Adonalsium from Honor in his visions.

I've always seen Hoid as a scholar who can't help but take part in the things he's pursuing. I don't think his purposes are as grand as reforming Adonalsium. The Letter seems to confirm this when he mentions his interventions and pleads for help on Roshar. He sees what's unfolding as a turning point for the Cosmere somehow and is trying to convince the recipient of that.

[Krelian]

What if he is the original base? Shooting out there, maybe his abilities are unique to a '17th shard' of Adonalsium.

Another note: what powers did humans have where Adonalsium came from before it shattered? Or did they have any?

 

 

Lightweaving is the (or at least a) magic native to Yolen. I'd assume that means it existed while Adonalsium was still intact, but we really don't know much at all for sure.

[Alatar]

Mmmmm. Lightflame wrote the OP, so this thread is automatically suspicious, but it may be serious so...

 

“I wonder if you could do that to a man. Pull him apart, emotion by emotion, bit by bit, bloody chunk by bloody chunk. Then combine them back together into something else, like a Dysian Aimian. If you do put a man together like that, Dalinar, be sure to name him Gibberish, after me. Or perhaps Gibletish.”
 

 

 

Reading at this, I thought... HERALDS! I can't access my WoK ebook right now, could someone quote exactly? That's when it describes Damnation, hooks in the flesh, pain, but then, after some time, Heralds are again full in shape. So, I see here something of a parallelism, maybe it's too thin, but it's here. We still don't know the purpose of the Oathpact, so maybe it really wasn't intended as a defense against Voidbringers, but as an experiment or even a way to have the Ten Heralds to fight endlessly?

 

I began life as a thought, a concept, words on a page

 

Words on a page? So, it's confirmed, BS is Adonalsium!

 

Well, now seriously, maybe in Yolen there was some magic that could turn the writing into flesh, and the original Hoid was one such magic user? So maybe this Hoid is not a real man, but a construct.

[Morsk]

Well, now seriously, maybe in Yolen there was some magic that could turn the writing into flesh, and the original Hoid was one such magic user? So maybe this Hoid is not a real man, but a construct.

I've thought he was a construct ever since I read TES, even wrote up a theory about it. But I was too lazy to find some of the quotes so it's been sitting on my desktop in a text file called hoid.txt... since Nov 1 2012 apparently. Wow I'm good at procrastinating. But you've inspired me! I'll try to post it today. Edited March 25, 2013 by Morsk

[Observer]

Hoid and a lot of people in TLoP mention how "The Gods are dead". He even mentions it to Siri in Warbreaker, which has always seemed a little strange to me, since we think that Adonalsium lived there with them. Just how long was Adonalsium "dead" before anybody picked up the pieces?

[happyman]

Hoid and a lot of people in TLoP mention how "The Gods are dead". He even mentions it to Siri in Warbreaker, which has always seemed a little strange to me, since we think that Adonalsium lived there with them. Just how long was Adonalsium "dead" before anybody picked up the pieces?

 

Brandon has said that there is more to the story than just Hoid and Adonalsium.  I wouldn't be at all surprised to discover that even before the breaking, there were deific shenanigans going on.  Hoid's comments and "The Liar of Partinel" sample chapters definitely suggest as much.

[BlairJ]

I wouldn't be surprised if we found out that there was more than just Hoid on each planet.....  

[Phantom Monstrosity]

I wouldn't be surprised if we found out that there was more than just Hoid on each planet.....

Hoid actually means H-oid. They are clones of the original H.

[Windrunner]

I wouldn't be surprised if we found out that there was more than just Hoid on each planet.....

They are all the same person

FEIFNER

Can Hoid travel through worlds? Or, in other words, are all of your "Hoids" one person?

BRANDON SANDERSON

Well, ‘Hoid’ the name is an alias that a certain person is using, and he stole it from someone else. But the person named Hoid in Elantris, Mistborn, and Warbreaker are all the same individual. For the record, this is not a ‘name cameo.’ This is, indeed, the very same person.

Source

[lordofsoup]

Was it confirmed somewhere that Yolen was around before Adonalsium was shattered, or do we just assume that because Hoid witnessed the shattering?

[Worldhopper]

Was it confirmed somewhere that Yolen was around before Adonalsium was shattered, or do we just assume that because Hoid witnessed the shattering?

 

I think it is an assumption based on that statement. Although its a good one. I personally beleive that everything that is happening in the Cosmere, such as the shattering of Adonalsium, began on Yolen. But we will more than likley have to wait for Dragonsteel until that little gem is revealed.

[Observer]

W've seen shards make life before, and the amount of power required was equivilent to that a a massive Atium mountain. This is considered a small amount of power for a Shard.

 

But what about a world? Maybe creating Yolen (And maybe the other shardworlds) took a lot out of Adonalsium? I'm just trying to figure out the dead gods thing. Either the people don't get it, or we never really understood how Adonalsium worked all along.

[happyman]

..or we never really understood how Adonalsium worked all along.

 

This is my opinion.  I really hope that the backstory is more complex than anybody has theorized.  Why?  Because it makes a better story that way!