Nomad’s Armor

[Xaladin he/him]

I’m confused. It seems from SLM he has armor from both his Windrunner and Skybreaker bonds. But he didn’t reach the fourth ideal as a Windrunner. What did I miss?

[KaladinsSenseOfHumourSpren He/Him]

2 minutes ago, Xaladin said:

I’m confused. It seems from SLM he has armor from both his Windrunner and Skybreaker bonds. But he didn’t reach the fourth ideal as a Windrunner. What did I miss?

Nothing, I think. Maybe he was close to his fourth Ideal, so he got his armour spren anyway, except they could never be deployed, only his Skybreaker ones.

[Treamayne]

3 hours ago, Xaladin said:

I’m confused. It seems from SLM he has armor from both his Windrunner and Skybreaker bonds. But he didn’t reach the fourth ideal as a Windrunner. What did I miss?

You did not miss anything - we saw in Oathbringer that Kaladin had already accumulated enough Windspren to help divert some of the Highstorm winds when he protected the fleeing human slaves in Part 1. Radiants begin drawing platespren to them at least during the Third oath (possibly before then) and only reach a critical mass and enough Connection to form them into Shardplate at the Fourth Oath - but the platespren are following the Radiant long before then (also seen later in oathbringer, when Kaladin's Windspren manifest in Shadesmar while they are travelling onNotum's vessel). 

WaT Spoilers

Spoiler

Sigzil's Windspren are noted in the Epilogue to be following the Iriali Caravan that Sigzil left with when he met Aux. 

 

[CoderDrag0n8 He/They]

6 hours ago, Xaladin said:

I’m confused. It seems from SLM he has armor from both his Windrunner and Skybreaker bonds. But he didn’t reach the fourth ideal as a Windrunner. What did I miss?

also im pretty sure he has a dawnshard.

[Treamayne]

21 minutes ago, CoderDrag0n8 said:

also im pretty sure he has a dawnshard

But that would not factor into why both Windspren and GravitySpren are part of his Shardplate. 

[Oraiyu]

3 hours ago, Treamayne said:

we saw in Oathbringer that Kaladin had already accumulated enough Windspren to help divert some of the Highstorm winds when he protected the fleeing human slaves in Part 1. Radiants begin drawing platespren to them at least during the Third oath (possibly before then) and only reach a critical mass and enough Connection to form them into Shardplate at the Fourth Oath - but the platespren are following the Radiant long before then (also seen later in oathbringer, when Kaladin's Windspren manifest in Shadesmar while they are travelling onNotum's vessel). 

Are you saying that the collection of both wind & gravitational spren, while not enough on their own, was enough to reach that "critical mass" to be able to form armor? What is the nature and mechanics of this critical mass? 

Also - if a Radiant needs to progress to the fourth ideal to develop enough of a Connection with their armor spren, how would that help Sig in terms of the wind spren? He'd abandoned the Wind runner ideals. If anything, I'd think that his Connection with them had started to degrade? 

[Treamayne]

On 6/12/2025 at 1:22 PM, Oraiyu said:

Are you saying that the collection of both wind & gravitational spren, while not enough on their own, was enough to reach that "critical mass" to be able to form armor? What is the nature and mechanics of this critical mass? 

Also - if a Radiant needs to progress to the fourth ideal to develop enough of a Connection with their armor spren, how would that help Sig in terms of the wind spren? He'd abandoned the Wind runner ideals. If anything, I'd think that his Connection with them had started to degrade? 

Unfortunately, we don't know those answers. We don't even know how long after SA10 The Sunlit Man takes place. What we do know is that Radiants draw Platespren and Connect to the them - including some unconventional interactions (as seen in RoW and WaT). It is implied that Nomad will have gained 4th Oath Skybreaker before whatever happens that "kills" Aux. We know that after the events of WaT, He retained his Connection to the Windspren that were following him.

It is implied that when Shardplate is summoned, it's composed of any PlateSpren Connected to the Radiant (regardless of order or affilitation) - the Platespren are attracted to deeds and emotions (creationspren and art, Windspren and protection, etc.); so it is implied that the connection is not based on the Radiant Oaths like the Nahel Bond - more like "Radiants of <order> are more likely to attract <spren>" and regardless of the state of the Nahel Bond, Sigzil is still Protecting and still behaving in manners that attracted his Windspren. 

But we won't get confirmation of these implications until the back half of Stormlight Archive (we hope).

Edited October 17, 2025 by Treamayne
SPAG

[Leuthie]

16 minutes ago, Treamayne said:

But that would not factor into why both Windspren and GravitySpren are part of his Shardplate. 

Why wouldn't it? Wouldn't having a humongous pile of Investiture attached to you attract more spren?

[Treamayne]

2 hours ago, Leuthie said:

Why wouldn't it? Wouldn't having a humongous pile of Investiture attached to you attract more spren?

As far as we know, Spren are attracted to Cognitive Realm (emotions) and Physical Realm (Actions/events) things, not Spiritwebs. It's not impossible that the Dawnshard might be a factor, but it's not likely either. We don't see Rysn attracting extra Spren - and Sigzil leaves Roshar right after acquiring the Dawnshard, and so would not be around Spren to attract. . . 

Edited June 12, 2025 by Treamayne
SPAG

[Oraiyu]

8 minutes ago, Treamayne said:

We know that after the events of WaT, He retained his Connection to the Windspren that were following him.

Good point.

11 minutes ago, Treamayne said:

It is implied that when Shardplate is summoned, it's composed of any PlateSpren Connected to the Radiant (regardless of order or affilitation - the Platespren are attracted to deeds adn emotions (creationspren and art, Windspren and protection, etc.); so it is implied that the connection is not based on the Radiant Oaths like the Nahel Bond - more like "Radiants of <order> are more likely to attract <spren>" and regardless of teh state of the nahel Bond, Sigzil is still Protecting and still behaving in manners that attract his Windspren. 

Maybe he maintained his Connection with the windspren because he did not really want to retract, and also only did so for an honorable reason. (so retracting his oaths might even have been, in a way, aligned with his oaths!) 

[BinarySecond]

I'm of the opinion that armour spren are "decided" well before you reach the 4th Ideal.

 

Every single time we see Kaladin accompanied by Windspren I believe those are always the same spren and they are destined to become his armour.

 

I don't believe he's special in that regard, so Sigzil's Windspren were predetermined.

 

I don't think we have any in book information on "switching" orders in any great detail? It surely happened but pre-Recreance probably wasn't that problematic so might not have been particularly of note.

[Nitpicking]

On 6/12/2025 at 1:42 PM, Oraiyu said:

Good point.

Maybe he maintained his Connection with the windspren because he did not really want to retract, and also only did so for an honorable reason. (so retracting his oaths might even have been, in a way, aligned with his oaths!) 

In fact, he broke the oath to defend someone who could not defend herself, paradoxically saying he broke the oath while actually refusing to break its words. This Sanderson guy, he might have some writing talent.