how do you think the inevitable showdown between Harmony and Odium will go down.

[ruler of the mists He/His/the survivor of the pit]

I Think both of harmony's Intents will match, Ruin to preserve.

[Nitpicking]

Wouldn't it be Harmony vs. Retribution? Did you not use that to avoid spoilering the front page?

I can see Sazed doing a clever thing. Retribution harms his people, and then Harmony demands his right to take retribution for this offense. His own Intent requires Retribution to harm himself.

Of course, that would ruin the space war era of the Cosmere, so it won't happen.

[Earless Jaks he/him]

I think that unless something changes, Retribution will absolutely destroy Harmony. Taravangian is more clever and conniving than Sazed ever was. Harmony was barely able to prevent the invasion of a single shard on his domain, so I think a double shard as clever as Retribution would be far more successful.

I don't think such a direct, unchanged, or unaided battle will ever go down though. I think Harmony will become Discord, a third shard will join the fray, or something else will happen to change the power balance between these forces.

[JustQuestin2004 he/him]

1 hour ago, Nitpicking said:

I can see Sazed doing a clever thing. Retribution harms his people, and then Harmony demands his right to take retribution for this offense. His own Intent requires Retribution to harm himself.

Not really how Shardic Intent works. Preservation doesn't Self-Preserve, Ruin doesn't Self-Destruct, Odium doesn't Self-Hate. Their Intents don't apply to themselves, not usually anyway.

[AlmightyGir]

Sazed gonna be all:
I will Preserve your Honor, and Ruin your plans, and seek Retribution for all you've harmed in the Cosmere.

Edited March 16, 2025 by AlmightyGir

[Nitpicking]

58 minutes ago, JustQuestin2004 said:

Not really how Shardic Intent works. Preservation doesn't Self-Preserve, Ruin doesn't Self-Destruct, Odium doesn't Self-Hate. Their Intents don't apply to themselves, not usually anyway.

Nobody has been smart enough to set up the conflict. (Yes, I mean that I'm smarter than the Shards of Adonalsium.)

[AlmightyGir]

9 minutes ago, Nitpicking said:

Nobody has been smart enough to set up the conflict. (Yes, I mean that I'm smarter than the Shards of Adonalsium.)

The shards themselves lack intelligence, so... Yes, you are.

[Earless Jaks he/him]

1 minute ago, AlmightyGir said:

The shards themselves lack intelligence, so... Yes, you are.

I think @Nitpicking meant the Vessels, not the Shards themselves

[AlmightyGir]

13 minutes ago, Earless Jaks said:

I think @Nitpicking meant the Vessels, not the Shards themselves

Sorry, I was nitpicking

[Onironte he/him]

Hmmm...
I like that question, and I think that, when the time of the fight come, Harmony will turn into Discord, or maybe even Sacrifice.
With that being said, I don't think the confrontation to occur in Scadrial nor Roshar, but open space. And It's gonna be... explosive. At least 4 Shards involved, with potentially 7 or even more (Autonomy with Odium, Valor with Saze, Mercy to give the final stroke and even Whimsy). Odium against Ambition wounded the Spiritual realm and causes nightmare-like immortality. An attrition between Odium and Honor created the Shattered Plains. The fusion of Preservation and Ruin brought a new world. The Ascension of Odium to Retribution broke time (temporally). There we are talking about 2 Shards business. Imagine more than 4. That could easily destroy a piece of Cosmere. And because of that, a question arise: How the Shattering not only did not destroy the universe but had no noticeable effects (beyond the Shattering itself)? Could it be possible that Dawnshads might be able to prevent that catastrophe from happening? That could explain why Wit is still related to the Exist Dawnshard...

[Nitpicking]

4 hours ago, AlmightyGir said:

The shards themselves lack intelligence, so... Yes, you are.

Not all of them. Honor has developed sapience. In WaT. The topic of this whole spoiler area ....

[AlmightyGir]

24 minutes ago, Nitpicking said:

Not all of them. Honor has developed sapience. In WaT. The topic of this whole spoiler area ....

Sentience, not sapience. Not yet, at least.

[Earless Jaks he/him]

3 hours ago, Onironte said:

Could it be possible that Dawnshads might be able to prevent that catastrophe from happening? That could explain why Wit is still related to the Exist Dawnshard...

I think that's totally a possibility if a Dawnshard is involved. The Shattering seemed like a pretty clean cut into sixteen portions, as opposed to the messy destruction Odium has brought upon several Shards, because the Dawnshards were used.

Are you saying that Wit has stayed close to the Dawnshard on purpose, so if a 4+ Shard event happens, he can use the Dawnshard to minimize the damage? That's my personal theory, beyond just the fact that the Dawnshards are powerful things that have to be kept track of.

[Nitpicking]

1 hour ago, AlmightyGir said:

Sentience, not sapience. Not yet, at least.

It's talking!

[AlmightyGir]

2 hours ago, Nitpicking said:

It's talking!

There are several political figures that speak and yet show zero intelligence.

[Earless Jaks he/him]

2 hours ago, Nitpicking said:

It's talking!

Yes, which makes it sentient, or self-aware and intelligent. Sapience is the ability to make wise decisions based on knowledge you have, which I don't think Honor quite has. I heard its intelligence is comparable to that of a 7 year old.

[Nitpicking]

My definition of sapience is different. I wonder what Brandon uses.

[ruler of the mists He/His/the survivor of the pit]

On 3/16/2025 at 2:55 PM, Nitpicking said:

Wouldn't it be Harmony vs. Retribution? Did you not use that to avoid spoilering the front page?

I can see Sazed doing a clever thing. Retribution harms his people, and then Harmony demands his right to take retribution for this offense. His own Intent requires Retribution to harm himself.

Of course, that would ruin the space war era of the Cosmere, so it won't happen.

yes