I have another question about the end positive nature of Allomancy

[Through the Living Wrath he/him]

Sooooo

Allomancy

It’s end positive, brings in investiture from an outside source (as I learned from my last question!)

But…

Feruchemy is end neutral (well, slightly end negative, but that is simply because of inefficiency in transportation and investiture diffusion)

But…

Allomancy is of Preservation

while Feruchemy is of Harmony…

So shouldn’t Allomancy be end neutral? Cultivation counters Preservation’s intent, and so do Ambition and Endowment.

 

 

(also, side thought, Lerasium-Harmonium alloy? Hoid-Feruchemy?)

[alder24]

17 hours ago, SpiritOfWrath said:

But end positive contradicts the intent…

im just confuzzled

*sigh*

Allomancy is a gift that grants you strength to preserve yourself, that's why it's end-positive. The Shard of Preservation isn't about preserving itself, just like the Shard of Ruin isn't about destroying itself, they can fuel any kinds of interactions so the fact that Allomancy draws from Preservation, which might seem like it weakens it, doesn't matter to the Shard - and it doesn't weaken it, the power once drawn will return to the Shard after being used. 

As for Feruchemy being of Harmony, that's not the case. Invested Arts are born from interactions between the world and Shards present on it. Feruchemy is a merger of both Ruin and Preservation and it represents the balance between those two. I don't think we know why Feruchemy is end-neutra;, but if I were to guess I would say it's because Preservation's magic is end-positive and Ruin's one is end-negative, which sums up to end-neutral. An Invested Art born from mixing two Shards doesn't always end up end-neutral. For example all magics on Sel are end-positive, despite them all coming from both Devotion and Dominion. Surgebinding also is end-positive, despite being of both Cultivation and Honor. But again, we don't know why Feruchemy is end-neutral or even if there are any rules dictating how a mixed magic will be fueled.

Spoiler

Chaos

Allomancy provides many very dramatic effects, which some have noted is not very much like Preservation. Could you walk me through how Allomancy is of Preservation, though it does dramatic, dynamic things?

Brandon Sanderson

One of the 'basics' of the magic in all of the worlds is that the energy of Shards can fuel all kinds of interactions, not just interactions based on their personality/role. I did this because otherwise, the Magics would all be extremely limited.

The 'role' of the Shard has to do with the WAY the magic is obtained, not what it can do. So, in Preservation's case, the magic is a gift--allowing a person to preserve their own strength, and rely upon the strength granted by the magic. While Hemalurgy has a huge cost, ending in net entropy.

/r/fantasy AMA 2011 (Aug. 31, 2011)

 

Spoiler

Chaos

It's a little odd that Preservation would inherently give up its power to fuel Allomancy, because you'd think he would preserve himself, you know? Does that make sense?

Brandon Sanderson

Preservation, as a Shard, is about preserving life, people, and the like. Not about self. No more than Ruin is about destroying self, or Cultivation is about growing herself.

/r/fantasy AMA 2011 (Aug. 31, 2011)

 

Spoiler

Master_Moridin

Why does Preservation fueling Allomancy not weaken Preservation compared to Ruin?

Brandon Sanderson

Because the power, once used, returns to him--much as water, after passing over a turbine, continues on in its system.

17th Shard Forum Q&A (Sept. 28, 2012)

 

Spoiler

[...]

Kaimipono

On a broader level, is Hemalurgy officially dead, then? Or is it still extant in some Ruin-free (but still messy) form? (If it's gone, is there any imbalance since Preservation's magic power is kept and Ruin's isn't?)

Brandon Sanderson

Is Hemalurgy dead? No, not at all. It, like the other two powers, was not created by Ruin or Preservation, but by the natural state of the world and its interaction with the gods who created it. It still requires the same method of creation, but very few people are aware of how it works.

Hero of Ages Q&A - Time Waster's Guide (Oct. 15, 2008)

 

Spoiler

Questioner

So in Scadrial we know that Allomancy is end-positive, and Hemalurgy end-negative, and Feruchemy is neutral, right? Is there such a concept on Sel, with the magics?

Brandon Sanderson

All of the magics on Sel, every one of them, is end-positive.

Questioner

Okay. And what fuel-- well, it's not a fuel. What focuses it? It's-- no, not that too.

Brandon Sanderson

They all draw power from the Dor. None of it's coming from the people. That's what this refers to, right?

Calamity release party (Feb. 16, 2016)

 

[Treamayne]

43 minutes ago, SpiritOfWrath said:

Feruchemy is of Harmony…

Not entirely Correct. Feruchemy is of both Ruin and Preservation, but predates Harmony by a few millenia.

• Feruchemy expresses Preservation by saving a Ferring's attribute to use at a later date.
• Feruchemy expresses Ruin by entropic decay of compressed traits (and a small amount lost in the transition of storing and tapping)

End Positive, End-Neutral, and End-Negative have nothing to do with Preservation or Ruin - they are external to the Shards. The Connection is the other way - Preservation's art is End Positive because End Positive is the power structure most in line with it's intent. Other arts like Surgebinding and AonDor are also End Positive and have nothing to do with Preservation. Likewise, Hemalurgy being End Negative because that best expresses Ruin's Intent but other arts like Dakhor are also End Negative and have nothing to do with Ruin.

Hope that helps

Edited March 15, 2025 by Treamayne
SPAG

[Through the Living Wrath he/him]

27 minutes ago, Treamayne said:

Not entirely Correct. Feruchemy is of both Ruin and Preservation, but predates Harmony by a few millenia.

• Feruchemy expresses Preservation by saving a Ferring's attribute to use at a later date.
• Feruchemy expresses Ruin by entropic decay of compressed traits (and a small amount lost in the transition of storing and tapping)

End Positive, End-Neutral, and End-Negative have nothing to do with Preservation or Ruin - they are external to the Shards. The Connection is the other way - Preservation's art is End Positive because End Positive is the power structure most in line with it's intent. Other arts like Surgebinding and AonDor are also End Positive and have nothing to do with Preservation. Likewise, Hemalurgy being End Negative because that best expresses Ruin's Intent but other arts like Dakhor are also End Negative and have nothing to do with Ruin.

Hope that helps

But end positive contradicts the intent…

im just confuzzled

*sigh*

[Treamayne]

33 minutes ago, SpiritOfWrath said:

But end positive contradicts the intent

How would it contradict the Intent? The Allomancer is Preserving themselves through application of external investiture.

(Preservation isn't about preserving itself - it's Preserving others; and spent investiture isn't lost, it goes right back to the Spiritual Realm that it came from anyway.)

Edited March 15, 2025 by Treamayne
SPAG/Clarity