Sigzil and Kaladin

[+Oltux72 he/him]

Let's look back at The Sunlit Man. How are we to interpret Sigzil's reaction to seeing Kaladin? Can we assume that he read Knights of Wind and Truth? It seems to have been written well before he will have begun to be hunted. In that case and given the length of time that has passed, he would assume that Kaladin has died. He does not really look like a man who is seeing a ghost. Does this men that the new heralds already returned by the time of The Sunlit Man?

[Kwiron]

Given the time dilation, I don't think it's implausible that TSM takes place before the back half of Stormlight. Sigzil could be largely clueless about the fates of individuals back on Roshar.

[imriel452]

But, we are looking at a spacefaring Scadrial during TSM, with an off-world research station, and I do not think they are going to reach that state in 80 years IMHO.

[+Oltux72 he/him]

24 minutes ago, Kwiron said:

Given the time dilation, I don't think it's implausible that TSM takes place before the back half of Stormlight. Sigzil could be largely clueless about the fates of individuals back on Roshar.

Sigzil resorts to treaties between spacefaring planets. That requires Roshar to have had a government with a foreign policy.

[thecaptain01]

I think Sunlight Man must happen after the second half of Stormlight.. Especially because only 70 years will pass between both halfs and Scadrial is not nearly close enough for space stations and rockets in 70 years.

I just think either Sig doesn't know that Kals a herald or something unfortunately happens to him at the end of all of Stormlight.

Also turns out Aux is probably Szeths old Highspren, so he wouldn't even need to read Knights of Wind and Truth

[imriel452]

Just now, thecaptain01 said:

I think Sunlight Man must happen after the second half of Stormlight.. Especially because only 70 years will pass between both halfs and Scadrial is not nearly close enough for space stations and rockets in 70 years.

I just think either Sig doesn't know that Kals a herald or something unfortunately happens to him at the end of all of Stormlight.

Also turns out Aux is probably Szeths old Highspren, so he wouldn't even need to read Knights of Wind and Truth

Aux is definitely Szeth's Highspren. Even if you just go by the name, and not the line which names him as "an auxillary"

[NewGuy 16]

Oh yeah, Aux is definitely 12124. That said, in the Sigzil epilogue chapter Aux says he’ll tell him about Kaladin, but that he doesn’t know what happened after Szeth renounced the bond. So as of the end of WaT, I think Sigzil doesn’t know what’s going on—just that he needs to run!

So we still have some gaps to fill in before Sunlit Man: bonding Aux, Aux’s somewhat death, Wit taking back the Dawnshard, etc, but we don’t know whether Sigzil ever returns to Roshar in that time. It’s possible he never learned of the time dilation, it’s possible that he did but it’s still been long enough he thinks everyone he knows is dead by the time he’s Nomad, and it’s possible he does come back and interacts in Part 2. 

[Cocoa he/him]

To be fair, all we know is that he was disbelieving at the possibility that it was Kal in the storm. That could be anything from "but he was dead, his eyes were burned out!" to "but the Heralds are bound to Roshar!" to "but he should be dead of old age!" to "but this is a backwater planet hundreds of lightyears from home, how is he here?!"

[NewGuy 16]

Wait, do Szeth and Nightblood think that Nightblood killed Kaladin? I hope not (poor guys need a break from guilt!) but I could see the possibility.

[NattyBo]

37 minutes ago, NewGuy 16 said:

Wait, do Szeth and Nightblood think that Nightblood killed Kaladin? I hope not (poor guys need a break from guilt!) but I could see the possibility.

No, Szeth comments something to Kaladin’s corpse about being killed by Ishi. 

[coolsnow7]

On 12/8/2024 at 1:08 PM, Oltux72 said:

Does this men that the new heralds already returned by the time of The Sunlit Man?

I think we can be certain that the answer is yes. Like 99.9% probability.

Brandon has said Stormlight Arc II will take place about 10-15 years after WaT, and that it would focus on Aharietiam, Heralds, and the Oathpact. That would be about 85 years on “Cosmere standard”.

I think it’s more than safe to say that the technology - and technological awareness - that’s evident in Sunlit Man is quite a bit more than 85 years post-“budding skyscrapers and firearms”.

I don’t think that bears much on whether Sigzil would know Kaladin is alive because the Heralds have returned and made that evident - who knows if Sigzil has any access to information about what’s going on on Roshar. Or if anyone does. But we can be quite sure that by the time Sunlit Man is happening, Stormlight Arc II has at least begun, if not fully wrapped up.

19 hours ago, thecaptain01 said:

I think Sunlight Man must happen after the second half of Stormlight.. Especially because only 70 years will pass between both halfs and Scadrial is not nearly close enough for space stations and rockets in 70 years.

I just think either Sig doesn't know that Kals a herald or something unfortunately happens to him at the end of all of Stormlight.

Also turns out Aux is probably Szeths old Highspren, so he wouldn't even need to read Knights of Wind and Truth

Well he still would, because Aux got dead-eyed before Retribution even showed up, much less before Ishar and Kaladin worked out the Oathpact solution.

[Necessary Eagle she/her]

12 hours ago, Cocoa said:

To be fair, all we know is that he was disbelieving at the possibility that it was Kal in the storm. That could be anything from "but he was dead, his eyes were burned out!" to "but the Heralds are bound to Roshar!" to "but he should be dead of old age!" to "but this is a backwater planet hundreds of lightyears from home, how is he here?!"

This.

[Stigmadiabolicum]

So I just started wondering this too as I listen to Sunlit again with the new graphic audio..

They usually capture Stormlight scenes SO well, the most epic version with the music and voice acting, and they know their rust casting Hoid and Saze correctly in their scenes or epigraphs

But that was my only complaint is the scene where he thinks he sees Kal, when I first read that I got chills. It was so evocative, we all went nuts with theories when the sample chapters came out haha, but the GA didn't quite do it justice with music. 

That aside..yeah. As far as we know he leaves at the end of WaK, might not even know what happened with Retribution, and even though Aux is Szeths spren, they didn't know what happened to Kal. Only people who know he's a herald are the other heralds, the Wind..and that's about it. Well, probably bridge 4 even with a body they'll be like eh, he survived somehow. 

So assuming the Return hasn't happened yet, he likely has no idea about the current affairs on Roshar unless he scoped some things out when he was on Ashyn, or Hoid kept him up to date? We don't know if this is post era 2 Hoid on Scadrial, if he made his way back to Roshar yet.. impossible to say. 

The timelines are impossible to parse..some aspects seem like they're late Era 4, like Emberdark time since theyre already in the cold war. The time dilation does add some kinks..but I mean, depending on what Kel does on Scadrial in Era 3 based on his comments at the end of TLM, they could have a rapid launch up the tech trees. 

Roshar had made so much progress with magitech and I'm still so confused how anything will work now, unless honor breaks off early in book 6 or warlight is just usable. 

Idk, I really want our boy Sig to eventually make it back..

I mean..era 4 space age is Mistborn but Roshar will still need to be at that level, and if it's long after jasnah is dead after her book 10 it won't really make sense. 

I think it all comes down to if era 3-4 is a few decades and we keep all our characters, or if by the end it's a century later. 

The thing is we can't tell if he's surprised to see Kal purely because it's manifesting on an alien world, or if he's supposed to be long dead. Wonder if we can get a WoB on this 

[Nitpicking]

Sunlit Man takes place in the Space Age, Mistborn Era 4. Scadrial has interstellar travel! That's centuries in the future, long after the timewarp. I'm putting it contemporaneous with Emberdark, just because I think that would be fun and therefore fit Brandon's "Rule of Cool".

[+Oltux72 he/him]

On 4/27/2025 at 9:56 AM, Stigmadiabolicum said:

So assuming the Return hasn't happened yet, he likely has no idea about the current affairs on Roshar unless he scoped some things out when he was on Ashyn, or Hoid kept him up to date? We don't know if this is post era 2 Hoid on Scadrial, if he made his way back to Roshar yet.. impossible to say.

Don't they have newspapers and books in the Cosmere? You'd assume that Sigzil does read all the books on Roshar he can get.

On 4/27/2025 at 9:56 AM, Stigmadiabolicum said:

The timelines are impossible to parse..some aspects seem like they're late Era 4, like Emberdark time since theyre already in the cold war. The time dilation does add some kinks..but I mean, depending on what Kel does on Scadrial in Era 3 based on his comments at the end of TLM, they could have a rapid launch up the tech trees.

They deviate from the tech tree. As far as I can tell, early "space" travel is Southern Scadrian airships in the CR. That is not a big jump.

[AlmightyGir]

On 12/8/2024 at 11:05 PM, Kwiron said:

Given the time dilation, I don't think it's implausible that TSM takes place before the back half of Stormlight. Sigzil could be largely clueless about the fates of individuals back on Roshar.

Are you sure about that?

We went from the industrial revolution to sending Sputnik into space in 44 years. And that's without magic, or the intervention of god biengs like Shard Bearers.