SwordNimiForPresident the sword/that sword Posted August 19, 2024 Posted August 19, 2024 In chapter 5 Kelek tells Shallan that bonding two Spren used to be impossible. With the idea of a double bond in mind it occurred to me that Dalinar can make Stormlight, Navani can make Towerlight, and Lift can make Lifelight. Lift is also capable of physically interacting with her Spren, and can see into the Cognitive realm. I think she may be bonded to the Nightwatcher and Wyndle. Anyone see any obvious holes, and/or supporting evidence? 6
alder24 Posted August 19, 2024 Posted August 19, 2024 30 minutes ago, SwordNimiForPresident said: In chapter 5 Kelek tells Shallan that bonding two Spren used to be impossible. With the idea of a double bond in mind it occurred to me that Dalinar can make Stormlight, Navani can make Towerlight, and Lift can make Lifelight. Lift is also capable of physically interacting with her Spren, and can see into the Cognitive realm. I think she may be bonded to the Nightwatcher and Wyndle. Anyone see any obvious holes, and/or supporting evidence? I agree. There were theories like this before (here for example - with some supportive evidence - do not discuss SA 5 spoilers in that topic), but now knowing what effects a double bond has on Shallan, it seems even more likely. 1
coolsnow7 Posted August 19, 2024 Posted August 19, 2024 (edited) These WoB are cited in the other thread for this - but are actually evidence to the contrary: Quote Questioner When Odium and Dalinar were having their meeting in Oathbringer, Odium seemed kinda freaked out by something. Could it possibly be related to how Lift can interact with spren in the physical world, and that might cause some problems for him, <seeing the impossible>? Brandon Sanderson He is weirded out by Lift, certainly. Lift is something that shouldn't exist, let's just say that. You'll find out why, probably in book 6? But she should not exist. DragonCon 2019 (Aug. 29, 2019) Why shouldn’t the Nightwatcher Bondsmith exist? Why would this freak out Rayse? Moreover if the Nightwatcher were bonded, it seems more than a bit unlikely that the Fused wouldn’t know - they’re keeping tabs on the ideals individual Radiants have reached, and seem to know better than Dalinar (and us) where Dalinar is at. Quote Gary Singer (paraphrased) Could Lift convert food from other cosmere worlds into Stormlight? Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) Yes. Lift's Spiritweb has something changed about it to allow converting mass to Investiture directly. Out of Excuses 2016 (Sept. 23, 2016) What is different about Dalinar or Navani’s Spiritweb that would allow them to convert mass to Investiture directly? Ironically if you read the WoB carefully then while we’re finding out that Lift is very weird, it’s actually contrary evidence to her being the Nightwatcher Bondsmith. Further evidence that whatever makes Lift weird, it’s not that: Mraize is hunting her. Why would a Bondsmith be of particular interest to the Ghostbloods - but not Dalinar? More likely is that Lift is some kind of new Cosmere mechanic that will catch us all completely off guard. Edited August 19, 2024 by coolsnow7 3
Ashbringer he/him Posted August 19, 2024 Posted August 19, 2024 5 hours ago, coolsnow7 said: Why shouldn’t the Nightwatcher Bondsmith exist? Why would this freak out Rayse? Moreover if the Nightwatcher were bonded, it seems more than a bit unlikely that the Fused wouldn’t know - they’re keeping tabs on the ideals individual Radiants have reached, and seem to know better than Dalinar (and us) where Dalinar is at. Today's reading does seem to suggest that double-bonds shouldn't exist, or that rules existed to make them not exist. And the Fused also seemed to think Shallan was an Elsecaller for a while. 5 hours ago, coolsnow7 said: Further evidence that whatever makes Lift weird, it’s not that: Mraize is hunting her. Why would a Bondsmith be of particular interest to the Ghostbloods - but not Dalinar? Going to guess the answer is somewhere along the lines of "hunting the Blackthorn leads to a really bad day for Mraize". Even Nale's scared of Dalinar. Could also want a Bondsmith Lift for the same (surface) reason they want BAM - easy perpetual source of Investiture. Lift's not as good as Dalinar is for that, or BAM probably is, but a similar idea. Assuming the GBs don't want BAM for some other reason. I think it's possible, but unlikely - more her own strange things. For one thing, Lift hasn't really shown the sense of Unity that Dalinar (and Navani) have. 1
coolsnow7 Posted August 20, 2024 Posted August 20, 2024 9 hours ago, Ashbringer said: Today's reading does seem to suggest that double-bonds shouldn't exist, or that rules existed to make them not exist. And the Fused also seemed to think Shallan was an Elsecaller for a while. No. Today’s reading explicitly stated that double-bonds were always known to be possible. I’m not sure what the Fused thinking Shallan might be an Elsecaller proves. 9 hours ago, Ashbringer said: Going to guess the answer is somewhere along the lines of "hunting the Blackthorn leads to a really bad day for Mraize". Even Nale's scared of Dalinar. Could also want a Bondsmith Lift for the same (surface) reason they want BAM - easy perpetual source of Investiture. Lift's not as good as Dalinar is for that, or BAM probably is, but a similar idea. Assuming the GBs don't want BAM for some other reason. But this is proving my point: that to the extent that the Ghostbloods want a source of unlimited Investiture, Lift is simply unhelpful even if technically fulfilling the specifications.
Ashbringer he/him Posted August 20, 2024 Posted August 20, 2024 47 minutes ago, coolsnow7 said: No. Today’s reading explicitly stated that double-bonds were always known to be possible. I’m not sure what the Fused thinking Shallan might be an Elsecaller proves. Kalak just says he knows weird things happen when weird things happen to Nahel bonds, and that there were rules against having two bonds. Not very definitive. Kalak’s thing is being not very definitive, kind of. As for the Fused, more of an example of them not knowing everything about each Radiant. 50 minutes ago, coolsnow7 said: But this is proving my point: that to the extent that the Ghostbloods want a source of unlimited Investiture, Lift is simply unhelpful even if technically fulfilling the specifications. … I’m not arguing against your point? My point is that the Ghostbloods trying to capture Dalinar would probably go really, really badly for the Ghostbloods, because he either pulls a Bondsmith and Connects to their past to fight them, or pulls a Blackthorn and Connects their insides to their outsides. Lift could fit. Especially if she actually is a Bondsmith and could pull more power than we expect. Even direct Mass->Investiture would be incredibly valuable to them. But as far as we know, it wouldn’t work very well. TLM/Cosmere Spoiler The GBs have access to the Dor jars, which seem to fulfil the “very large quantity of Investiture” requirement, but feeding and drawng from Lift or a Bondsmith would be perpetual. Assuming they can’t spike it out of her somehow. Also, Mraize did capture Lift, then he traded her away. It seemed more about the sport to him. 3
Rorzikel Posted August 23, 2024 Posted August 23, 2024 On 8/19/2024 at 6:33 PM, Ashbringer said: Today's reading does seem to suggest that double-bonds shouldn't exist, or that rules existed to make them not exist. And the Fused also seemed to think Shallan was an Elsecaller for a while. On 8/20/2024 at 3:49 AM, coolsnow7 said: No. Today’s reading explicitly stated that double-bonds were always known to be possible. I’m not sure what the Fused thinking Shallan might be an Elsecaller proves. I believe they thought that because that's what Sja-Anat used as a lie to Odium to explain how Shallan, Adolin, and Kaladin ended up in Shadesmar in OB (covering up how she helped them escape into Shadesmar rather than kill them). 3
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